Trick Shot Pool Sucks

No one else has disagreed, so I must. I completely understand how you guys feel, though. The trouble is this: we pool fanatics love to see runout after runout, regardless of gimmicks or gadgets on the table. Because we know the game, we know the level of skill and precision required to put together a 3 pack (or more!). But, to the ordinary ESPN watcher, someone running a rack of 9 ball (for instance) can easily be the most boring thing to watch, likely because they don't know the game.

Trick Shot Magic is all about the skill required for particular shots and the energy that comes from a successful make. It just so happens that the pool table is the medium by which this is passed along to the general public. I don't think it takes anything away from the game at all. Rather, it brings more to the game. Those "non-pool players" that are watching have their interests peaked by seeing such. I hope to be on TSM someday.

That being said, know this. After the World Artistic Pool Championship I discussed this very thing with some friends in the industry. I said, I don't want "Eric Yow's Trick Shot Madness" to be about gimmicks or the like. I don't want to have to rely on coke bottles and coin wrappers in my exhibition to be impressive and entertaining. And I don't! If I have props on the table such as a stacked ball or a bridge, it is to keep the crowd interested and entertained. But, you've seen the masse shots that I do, I pack my show with skill, more than anything else.

On a side note, watch for the ESPN 3-cushion show coming up this summer. It will be "Artistic Billiards" and the first of its kind on a major network. Semih Sayginer, Mike Massey, and I will be performing "Trick Shots" on the billiard table. But, there will be no coin wrappers or snapple bottles. Every shot will be a 3-cushion billiard. I suspect it will be a HUGE success. It, in its own right, as is Trick Shot Magic, will be appealing to a widespread audience.

(fwiw, I value your opinions expressed above)

-yow!
 
psykoyow said:
No one else has disagreed, so I must. I completely understand how you guys feel, though. The trouble is this: we pool fanatics love to see runout after runout, regardless of gimmicks or gadgets on the table. Because we know the game, we know the level of skill and precision required to put together a 3 pack (or more!). But, to the ordinary ESPN watcher, someone running a rack of 9 ball (for instance) can easily be the most boring thing to watch, likely because they don't know the game.

Trick Shot Magic is all about the skill required for particular shots and the energy that comes from a successful make. It just so happens that the pool table is the medium by which this is passed along to the general public. I don't think it takes anything away from the game at all. Rather, it brings more to the game. Those "non-pool players" that are watching have their interests peaked by seeing such. I hope to be on TSM someday.

That being said, know this. After the World Artistic Pool Championship I discussed this very thing with some friends in the industry. I said, I don't want "Eric Yow's Trick Shot Madness" to be about gimmicks or the like. I don't want to have to rely on coke bottles and coin wrappers in my exhibition to be impressive and entertaining. And I don't! If I have props on the table such as a stacked ball or a bridge, it is to keep the crowd interested and entertained. But, you've seen the masse shots that I do, I pack my show with skill, more than anything else.

On a side note, watch for the ESPN 3-cushion show coming up this summer. It will be "Artistic Billiards" and the first of its kind on a major network. Semih Sayginer, Mike Massey, and I will be performing "Trick Shots" on the billiard table. But, there will be no coin wrappers or snapple bottles. Every shot will be a 3-cushion billiard. I suspect it will be a HUGE success. It, in its own right, as is Trick Shot Magic, will be appealing to a widespread audience.

(fwiw, I value your opinions expressed above)

-yow!
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I'm sorry Eric,

This wasn't meant to be an attack on you or any of the trick-shot competitors. I know you put a lot of work into it and there IS definitely an audience that finds it interesting. I think, most of us are simply conveying our frustration with professional pool - particularly MEN's professional pool. They are the sport's most talented group yet they get the least amount of air-time.

This past weekend, they had a trick-shot marathon on ESPN Classic. Jeanette Lee was probably on my tube for about 2 hours straight doing trick-shot after trick-shot. I know there's likely a million people out there who got a kick out of watching her jump over "a bazillion balls" but to me, that's not pool.

I do think some televised diversity is good. I'll be as quick to say it shouldn't be just trick-shots as I would say it shouldn't be just 9-ball. I think showing a 100-ball run on television could be rather exciting if the production is done well and of course, I think straight pool would also draw criticism if it were the only game ESPN chose to air. They're simply airing the trick-shot competition a lot now and it's gotten to a point where it's just no longer novel for us.

Like I said, this wasn't meant to be an attack on the competitors. I think everyone here will agree that it's good to know that something that pertains to billiards is successful and we ARE happy that there are pool players making a living. However, I think we'd prefer it if television showed the games we all relate to.
 
I liked the idea that they used during the showing of the Legendary Stars of Pocket Billiards series where they had Willie Mosconi, Minnesota Fats, and the gang shoot trick shots to fill in the hour after their matches were finished. If they combined this with actually showing the whole match (make the show two hours long or an hour and a half) and some player interviews/introspectives, it would make the whole thing more enjoyable IMO.
 
My 5 cents

There are entertaining trick shot shows, just not the ones on TV. I guess TV is for rated G crowds, I never liked trick shot magic (sorry Charlie) or any other trick shot shows on TV. Unless Fats and Mr. Mosconi were present and yelling at each other, now that was entertainment.

I have been playing pool for 23 yrs. out of 27 and have enjoyed many shows around a table, just not many Andy Griffith wanna be's can make a good show, it takes something no one playing pool has had since Fats.

I'm more of an Richard Prior or George Carlin fan myself, the more foul jokes, the better. I have been watching this thread and in the past have stood up for trick shot pool, not any more. Now that I have taken time away from pool and the industry, I realize you have all been right, Trick Shot's Suck! That is unless, I am the one shooting them and all the ball waxing in the world can't change that.

I love pool and would love to see a strong gathering of players come from the USA. The problem is, that I don't see trick shot's helping make great players, or putting players in the pool halls. If it were going to help, it would have by now.
 
Pool programing needs to be more personal. How can anybody watch a game when each of the players (to the average joe) all seem to play the same exact way? I bet non-pool players view pool as I view golf on TV. It bores the hell out of me! If only they can follow the steps of poker programing and go into an engaging "story" of each of the players to entice the audience.
 
personally I think that pool in general is in trouble in a big way, 3 or 4 years ago when I quit playing there were a lot more pool rooms than now. I think that poker has drawn a big portion of players away. And I think that the only way that pool will ever make a comeback is when the tournament money goes up significantly and a GOOD pool movie sparks the new young player, I don't think just the tourney money going up will do it because there will never be the kind of money golf, poker and the like offer. I think that the big paydays combined with a movie like rounders did wonders for poker and can help pool up out of it's slump hopefully.
 
I have to agree that the artistic pool is gruling to watch. Other than Mike Massey's shots, most of them are all in how they are set up......and thats not pool! Its kinda like watching a slam dunk contest.....they are neat at first, but then once you have seen them all they become too repetitious.

Southpaw
 
Southpaw said:
I have to agree that the artistic pool is gruling to watch. Other than Mike Massey's shots, most of them are all in how they are set up......and thats not pool! Its kinda like watching a slam dunk contest.....they are neat at first, but then once you have seen them all they become too repetitious.Southpaw
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The other thing that really bothers me is that the women competitors spend way too much time with their noses buried in books. This makes it appear that they are not as into the competition as the men who actually make a vocation of the craft, and are not familiar with as many of the shots.

Either way, a little "Trick Shot Magic" goes a long way.

Ken
 
Trick shots can be fun to watch, but the ESPN production sucks all of the enjoyment out of it. I hate that they have to explain the shot on EVERY attempt. I don't understand that, I got what they were trying to do on the first attempt, but if nobody makes the shot I have to listen to the explanation 4 times.

Personally I love the World Trickshot Masters competition held at the WPM. Sure, it's not a legitimate world trick shot title, but the fifteen minute routine makes it fun and you get to see a little bit of the personality of some of the players. Steve Davis was always my favorite, he never made a shot but he was always entertaining.
 
Cameron Smith said:
Trick shots can be fun to watch, but the ESPN production sucks all of the enjoyment out of it. I hate that they have to explain the shot on EVERY attempt. I don't understand that, I got what they were trying to do on the first attempt, but if nobody makes the shot I have to listen to the explanation 4 times.

Personally I love the World Trickshot Masters competition held at the WPM. Sure, it's not a legitimate world trick shot title, but the fifteen minute routine makes it fun and you get to see a little bit of the personality of some of the players. Steve Davis was always my favorite, he never made a shot but he was always entertaining.
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When Charlie Ursitti had it going with ABC they had a very good trick shot format. These were all entertaining shows and they are still on TV from time to time. Real good entertaining stuff.

The reason you have to sit through the explanation 400 times is because when they film a show they don't know what footage they are going to use or discard for the final cut. This isn't the fault of trick shot magic's (ESPN's) it 's the players missing more than they make who are to blaim for this.

You would think Pavel would be on ESPN by now. That kid get's my vote for the real deal this year. He made the front page of yahoo.com. That is what you call famous, he got more veiwers that day than ESPN get's during the superbowl for an entire decade. I wish the world of pool was a real sport. Then a guy like Pavel would be invited instead of a guy like blank man.

What they don't think the 3.5 billion hit's a day on yahoo.com is enough people watching Pavel to merit an aperence on their little show. Pavel had more exposure in one day than everyone playing pool combined, ever. It's a shame they don't keep it running on their home page all the time. Then trick shot's might have some kind of impact on pool.

Here is a link to my proof that Pavel is the best. This fact can't be disputed Pavel is by far the best trick shot guy ever with over 3.5 billion possible views in one day.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahoo

WOW now that is exposure and it tower's over all of billiards since Fats. Did you know that pool only has 750,000 die hard fan's here in the USA. How many 750,000's fit into 3.5 billion veiws in one day.

Jamison
 
Pavel is the best?! If you say so. He's been at it a little over a year. When he shot his first trick shots he was emailing me to let me know, in broken english, what he did. I said, "get it on film." Before long he was emailing me short video clips again and again. He sent me about 12 or 15 of them before I said, "put them all together with music, like mine." And he did. Through his videos he's gotten a LOT of exposure, but after a year of filming and editing I don't think you can call him the best. I'm proud of him and what he's done and tell him often. (He's on my forum.) But, until I see him energize a crowd, shoot under pressure, or at least make a video shooting several hard shots in a row... See, for me, Semih Sayginer is the best. Pavel is NOT Semih Sayginer. That's not to say he won't be the best one day, but I think your logic is flawed considerably.

I keep trying to get Pavel to come to the US and compete with us in the APTSA. Jamison, maybe you could fund his trip. ;)

-yoweezy!
 
JamisonNeu said:
WOW now that is exposure and it tower's over all of billiards since Fats. Did you know that pool only has 750,000 die hard fan's here in the USA. How many 750,000's fit into 3.5 billion veiws in one day.

Jamison
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Jamison...Not sure where you got your numbers, but there are many more 'diehard' pool fans than just 750,000. There are, at any given time, four million weekly league players. These are folks who play AT LEAST once a week, mostly yearround...and many of them are out in the bar or poolroom several times a week. They own cues and tables, read books, watch pool on tv and videos, and play as often as time allows...things we would consider for what I call 'pool kooks' (and one I am happy to include myself as). Still, it's not a huge number, but an interesting statistic, out of the 40 million who played once last year.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
Scott Lee said:
Jamison...Not sure where you got your numbers, but there are many more 'diehard' pool fans than just 750,000. There are, at any given time, four million weekly league players. These are folks who play AT LEAST once a week, mostly yearround...and many of them are out in the bar or poolroom several times a week. They own cues and tables, read books, watch pool on tv and videos, and play as often as time allows...things we would consider for what I call 'pool kooks' (and one I am happy to include myself as). Still, it's not a huge number, but an interesting statistic, out of the 40 million who played once last year.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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Mr. Lee,
I am saying this with no sarcasm in my voice. I wan't you to know I respect you and your contribution to pocket billiards.
How many time's does 40 million fit into 3.5 billion? If there is 1000 millions in every billion? My numbers were off, but in the big picture not by much...what if they showed Pavel's video for two days?

Eric, hardness of a shot is in the eyes of the beholder, you will learn this in time. I personally think it would be very hard to shoot on such a little table as Pavel. Mostly because, my lack of interest wouldn't allow me the hour's needed to preform his shot's.

Eric, don't put Pavel down, it wasn't a year ago when you were writing me those same kind of e-mails... Pavel is the best and numbers prove it. I personaly think what you and Pavel do are the easiest of all the tricks out there, but that is probably because I hold all the records you are after...You know, the Masse records.

The fact is that Pavel alone reached more homes in one day than all the trick shot magics ever will. I know I seem harsh, but fact's are fact's. 3.5 billion is a very very very very very big number compared to trick shot magic number's. They could air trick shot magic from now on and Pavel would still have more coverage from that one day.
Jamison
 
I won't say that I don't enjoy trick shots, but I find trick shot magic to be a bit repetitious. Having said that, however, if Trick shot telecasts will help to give our sport visibility, I'm in favor of having them on TV, and I appreciate the efforts of all those that are part of it.
 
Jamison, you are mistaken. I too am masse world champion. You holding the record by a single solitary point means nothing to me. I made all five shots in a row, for what it's worth. Moreover, in 2006, we had NO masse practice on the competition table so I was shooting all 5 with NO practice. To make all five in a row under those conditions means so much more to me than the record/title in and of itself.

The Lord has blessed me considerably, particularly in such a short time. Similarly, God has blessed Pavel. It is my desire that we all praise Him for allowing us to accomplish that which we have. I'm still chasing a dream, praying that His will would be done, not mine. I pray that many doors would continue to be opened for me in artistic pool, and for Pavel as well.

See you next week Jamison. We should put on a masse demonstration together!

Because He Lives,
-yow!

Colossians 3:17
 
psykoyow said:
Jamison, you are mistaken. I too am masse world champion. You holding the record by a single solitary point means nothing to me. I made all five shots in a row, for what it's worth. Moreover, in 2006, we had NO masse practice on the competition table so I was shooting all 5 with NO practice. To make all five in a row under those conditions means so much more to me than the record/title in and of itself.
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You sound very proud of your accomplishments in artistic pool, I am truly glad for you Eric. Just remember sports are always won by one or more points...you sound like a guy that owns a Mustang when debating with a guy who owns a Camaro, "but they only lose by a second". It's a sport Eric, 1 point or 50 points it's all the same.

I am guessing when you say next week you mean Allen's tournament. I doubt you will be seeing me any time soon Eric, I have no reason to go to any more artistic tourney's. That is until someone bests my records or there is some kind of gain for me involved by going.

BTW. We never practiced masse on the tables we competed on. Well at least the few of us who are above cheating, we never shot masse on those tables before our match, it has happened though. Good luck next week Eric, if you make all of your hangers you win.
Jamison
 
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psykoyow The Lord has blessed me considerably said:
God blesses everyone equally. You don't think god looked down from heaven to say, "Eric I bestow upon you, this gift, to make little balls fall in big holes better than the next guy". I pray god does more with his spare time than bless trick shot artist's. I pray that god would take my gift of aim and give it to some poor young soldier fighting in the desert so that he may live one more day. I really don't think hitting pool balls is on his list of thing's to bless. Just a hunch, I can't speak to god or for god, so I don't know any more or less than you about it.

Jamison
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sjm said:
I won't say that I don't enjoy trick shots, but I find trick shot magic to be a bit repetitious. Having said that, however, if Trick shot telecasts will help to give our sport visibility, I'm in favor of having them on TV, and I appreciate the efforts of all those that are part of it.
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Well said.

I guess I have to agree. Mike Massy is a good friend of mine and I still enjoy watching him. He is one of the most amazing people I have ever met.
 
Maybe it's the format of the trick shot competitions that I've seen on ESPN, but they don't show off the really impressive shots that I've seen elsewhere, for example from the people mentioned here.

On ESPN, they do just enough so that their opponent has a good chance of missing the same shot.
 
PKM said:
Maybe it's the format of the trick shot competitions that I've seen on ESPN, but they don't show off the really impressive shots that I've seen elsewhere, for example from the people mentioned here.

On ESPN, they do just enough so that their opponent has a good chance of missing the same shot.
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Well said PKM, When I tried entering my shot's in the competitions they voted them all down saying "impossible" or that one is too hard. Funny thing is I make them on the first try all the time. Not really the reply I was looking for by the supposed best in the world. lol The real big problem with the format is it's trick shot's with non-champion players. Most of the contestants can't play trick shots or pool.

Jamison
 
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