Vivian the criminal can't delete this thread.

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
In the end, the point is he called someone a criminal and has no evidence that person committed a crime.

Somebody may have, of course it's possible "that person" may have, but that's all it is. Had a bad experience with the tournament, didn't pay attention to his own business (and yes that's his fault and he could have easily gotten his whole $144.62 back if he'd paid attention to his bank statements - the bank was 100% on the hook for the altered check).

Rail against her all you want for running a lousy operation, not refunding money, and on and on - but don't look for a bunch of attention by posting about something that happened over six months ago, cost you $4.62 you completely failed to notice and call someone a criminal and claim she altered a check when you have no evidence that she did so.

Anyway, I enjoy reading 99.9% of what is on here, learning a lot about cues, tables, where the game is at right now and where it's been so going back to reading some positive things this evening! No point getting into any more back and forth over less than $5.00 that someone honestly didn't care that much about to take care of it at the time.

Maybe we can agree on a couple of things here. 1. The check DID get altered and was deposited to a bank account that she had control over. 2. The tournament was canceled at the last minute and he never received a refund of the $144.62. Now the question is, what can we deduce from that? As for issue #1, that is a given as to what happened. As to issues #2, that is also a given unless we do not believe the OP's story about never receiving a refund. Perhaps here, we need to know who and how many others also did not receive refunds. That would go a long way toward making his case against her for misuse of his funds. If true, it is not a criminal offense, only a civil matter, and other than outing her on here he does not have much recourse.
 

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
... The 2nd and 3rd checks that I wrote were never altered or cashed. ...
I think it's more correct to say that they have not been altered or cashed yet so far as you can tell.

Which leads me to a "stop payment" rant. If you want to stop payment on a check, you have to pay the bank a fee (about $30 as I recall for my old bank which turned out to be a pack of thieves so I'm with a local bank now) and that fee puts a stop payment on the check for six months. After that six months the payee is free to cash the check unless you pay for another six months of protection. The bank does not guarantee that it will not cash old (nominally expired) checks so your alternative is to close the account. Which I did.
 

jojopiff

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
In the end, the point is he called someone a criminal and has no evidence that person committed a crime.

Somebody may have, of course it's possible "that person" may have, but that's all it is. Had a bad experience with the tournament, didn't pay attention to his own business (and yes that's his fault and he could have easily gotten his whole $144.62 back if he'd paid attention to his bank statements - the bank was 100% on the hook for the altered check).

Rail against her all you want for running a lousy operation, not refunding money, and on and on - but don't look for a bunch of attention by posting about something that happened over six months ago, cost you $4.62 you completely failed to notice and call someone a criminal and claim she altered a check when you have no evidence that she did so.

Anyway, I enjoy reading 99.9% of what is on here, learning a lot about cues, tables, where the game is at right now and where it's been so going back to reading some positive things this evening! No point getting into any more back and forth over less than $5.00 that someone honestly didn't care that much about to take care of it at the time.

Yikes. Full & complete disagreement with everything you’ve written. A liar & cheat is a liar & cheat. They should be called on it when they do so, whether it’s 6 days, 6 weeks, or 6 months. Nobody “asks” to be ripped off & by saying the OP wasn’t paying attention that’s essentially what you’re implying.

The OP is out $144.xx...not $4.xx as you stated. Whilst neither are life changing amounts of money...it’s the principle.
 

spartan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
1. OP should have never started this thread without including the "evidence".
2. OP has no proof of any kind "Vivian the criminal" altered his check - what she may or may not know or care to find out about who did it is very much a far cry from committing the criminal act of forgery - this thread title and thread starter were not appropriate at all.
3. It appears someone may have. 3.3% was the fee for credit card payments, so maybe some dummy that was putting a deposit together did that (okay, real idiot, lol) - may not have been legal, but likely not part of some scheme to defraud someone out of $4.62 - still wrong.
4. If OP didn't get that rectified by the bank and he has said nothing about that issue, it's HIS OWN FAULT. The only possible reason is he let some legally binding time pass (or just didn't bother to find out if he was told that it did, whether that was a fact). Totally his fault, or he would absolutely have his $4.62 and likely the other $140 since the instrument was altered.
5. The "I didn't catch it because I was looking for $140" is a little embarrassing. You look for the check number, you look for the payee, you actually look at your statement when you get it and reconcile your account.
6. OP finally says he really didn't catch it until sometime in February - makes little sense, but seems to me you take your lumps over losing $4.62 and also the $140.00 by not apparently taking this up with the bank in a timely fashion, if at all, rather than call someone a forger when you absolutely don't have the proof she did it.

Poor personal financial practices leading to an anonymous attack on an Internet forum, some people like that sort of thing.

She may owe a lot of people money and not be paying it, but that really doesn't excuse the accusation that has been walked back quite a bit by the OP.

Did you just read the crap you posted?
You are either (a) blind (b) dumb (c) Vivian fan (d) snake (e) all of above.
Yes , a snake because you can somehow twist and turn everything that the OP is now somehow the bad guy. LOL.
With people like you who needs enemies. Maybe it is small amount, maybe OP is making big deal of out it etc. At least give the OP benefit of the doubt.

Like Schultz of Django Unchained, I cannot resist “shooting down” morons like you.

tenor.gif



:thumbup:
 

racefornine

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Bob J. The bank waived the fee. I didn't put a stop payment immediately because I believed Vivian. I was still an unhappy fan. I was still fighting for the refund of my friends. As soon as I realized the fraud and I too was robbed she stopped correspondence. After multiple emails with no response and admitted anger I posted here. For the internet lawyers,skeptics and biased commentators. Every thing I posted is the truth. When she makes it right or tries to explain her actions I will be ready to listen or come at her with the truth if she lies.
 

SBC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You should sue her in small claims court locally. Easy enough. If she doesn't respond you win by default. You have every reason to represent yourself and pursue it.

Also speak to your bank about stopping payment on the check....because you never received the service (the tournament entry). Venting here won't get you your money.
 

jeephawk

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'll make it simple - you are a douchbag.

Anybody that stands up for a thief is a thief themselves in my book.

Clear enough?
Jason

Well, there's another example of calling people names and making accusations that you really have no frame of reference for making. Not very classy and completely inappropriate. Nice. Let's burn a few witches while we are it, lol.

Read the post - not standing up for anything other than having some solid evidence before anonymously (or otherwise) calling someone a criminal and claiming as a fact they altered a negotiable instrument, which the OP absolutely did not and does not have. No proof, none, and the OP is pretty much responsible for the mess he found himself in as of about 6 months ago. Go after her all you want for all the other stuff? Oh yeah, I said that.

Have a nice day.
 
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Island Drive

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well, there's another example of calling people names and making accusations that you really have no frame of reference for making. Not very classy and completely inappropriate. Nice.

Read the post - not standing up for anything other than having some solid evidence before anonymously (or otherwise) calling someone a criminal and claiming as a fact they altered a negotiable instrument, which the OP absolutely did not and does not have. No proof, none, and the OP is pretty much responsible for the mess he found himself in as of about 6 months ago. Go after her all you want for all the other stuff? Oh yeah, I said that.

Have a nice day.

When I write a check, I always have the duplicate in my checkbook. If anyone needs proof, I just take a picture of the copy, and if needed I will bring my checkbook to the court, untouched.
 

jeephawk

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Did you just read the crap you posted?
You are either (a) blind (b) dumb (c) Vivian fan (d) snake (e) all of above.
Yes , a snake because you can somehow twist and turn everything that the OP is now somehow the bad guy. LOL.
With people like you who needs enemies. Maybe it is small amount, maybe OP is making big deal of out it etc. At least give the OP benefit of the doubt.

Like Schultz of Django Unchained, I cannot resist “shooting down” morons like you.

tenor.gif



:thumbup:

LOL, I believe just about everything he (eventually) posted. He acted foolish. If he'd paid attention to his bank account the bank would have had his $144.62 reimbursed within a very short time. He fooled around and now apparently it is too late for that.

Thread should have been titled: "I messed up and learned a hard lesson dealing with Vivian". Then lay out the facts in the first post about what actually happened, without the drama.

Never even heard of this Vivian until I read the thread. Don't need to know anything about her at all other than if you are going to call anyone a criminal and go on a rant and internet campaign about it you better have proof.

He has no proof. Period. His check was apparently altered - THERE IS NO EVIDENCE SHE WAS THE PERSON WHO ALTERED THAT CHECK OR EVEN DEPOSITED IT, NOR IF SHE DID DEPOSIT IT THAT SHE KNEW AN ALTERED CHECK WAS PART OF THE DEPOSIT.

Read up a little, don't be so quick to jump to conclusions and start calling people names just because you are worked up over this Vivian for whatever reason and feel bad for the OP.

The alteration apparently matches exactly the 3.3% surcharge for credit cards the event was charging. For some reason, somebody (and you don't know who it was) added that amount to the check. I'm going with some dummy who did that, whomever it was - not much in it for anyone to alter a check over $4.62 as a matter of some act or part of a series of acts of fraud. Really makes no sense as intentional fraud, but who knows.

Sorry, was getting out of this thread. Posting in it just perpetuates it, but having a little coffee this morning and noticed a couple of folks decided to expand the name calling.

Getting out of it now. Hope you have a great day - and yes, I mean that.
 
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jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Silver Member
Well, there's another example of calling people names and making accusations that you really have no frame of reference for making. Not very classy and completely inappropriate. Nice. Let's burn a few witches while we are it, lol.

Read the post - not standing up for anything other than having some solid evidence before anonymously (or otherwise) calling someone a criminal and claiming as a fact they altered a negotiable instrument, which the OP absolutely did not and does not have. No proof, none, and the OP is pretty much responsible for the mess he found himself in as of about 6 months ago. Go after her all you want for all the other stuff? Oh yeah, I said that.

Have a nice day.

I stand by my post. You keep shoveling.
Jason
 

Chili Palmer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
A little far fetched but is there proof the check was processed through her bank and the account for the tournament? Anybody could have grabbed that check and deposited into their bank.

And just so ya'll know, I'm on the OP's side but this is one fact that hasn't been mentioned. With Vivian stopping communications that says a lot, but you still need to confirm ALL parts of the transaction.
 

Celophanewrap

Call me Grace
Silver Member
How do you drive being this blind?
Jason

I use the force.
So, you know them both and you know Vivian to be a common thief, do you?
I don't know her reputation, you ma well be right, but then you may be wrong.
How do you function being so narrow minded?
I'm not defending anyone, I'm just saying I don't know.
So glad that you do, I wish I could read people as well, it's a special gift
 

ribdoner

SATISFACTION GUARANTEED
Silver Member
Ground zero

wouldn't be any shit if VV's failed endeavor hadn't been such fertile ground

wonder how much she's got on the cuff
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
All these shit house lawyers on AZB are forgetting one important rule in law, including the OP....intent! That is a requirement to try and claim someone committed fraud, you must be able to prove "intent" that means proving the person who altered the check, then deposited it....INTENDED to defraud the OP.....good luck!!!

PS, it's much easier to use for slander since this has all been made puplic by the OP, as the facts of slander are alive and well in this thread. Being a tournament director is NOT what's being discussed here, HER honesty IS though however, and that's two DIFFERENT subjects!!!
 
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realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Can I sue someone who says or writes something defamatory about me?

If you meet the requirements for*a civil action, you can sue someone for defamation, whether libel or slander, if they have written or said something bad about you. However, you must be able to prove the necessary elements of a defamation suit if you wish to collect damages.
Defamation can take two forms, which are generally referred to as libel and slander. Libel is defined as a defamation of a person, group, organization, product, government, or country that was made in written or printed words or in pictures. Slander is the same thing, except the defamatory statement was made in the form of spoken words, sounds, sign language, or gestures.
 
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