well here we are again. bash me.
- Thread starter Trent
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Jesus Christ, man....do you even READ what people are writing about this?
You posted this up in a public venue, making it available for comments. The vast majority have drawn you a road map to get out from under this situation...keeping your integrity and customer base in-tact.
Yet you continue to act butt-hurt over what would have otherwise been a very simple problem to resolve.
YOU HAD AN AGREEMENT TO SEND YOUR CUSTOMER THE CUE HE GAVE YOU SUPPLIES AND MONEY FOR. PERIOD. END OF SENTENCE.
Now, because you're upset that he's demanding you live up to your end of the bargain, you're throwing a temper tantrum.
Grow up...man up...send the customer what was agreed upon...and be DONE with it.
It's just that simple. Seriously.
The longer you drag this out with your whining, the more folks will steer away from any future projects you may complete.
It's not that hard.
No. The general consensus is:
1) You apparently made an agreement before the build to return the wood to the customer if anything went wrong, thus putting you in a corner right now.
2) Disclose what went wrong to the customer and let him decide what to do. Already done.
3) Don't sign it, return it, and keep record of you dealings with the guy just in case he decided to start a slam thread about you.
4) Don't be so stupid as to start a slam thread about yourself.
Guess its kinda late for #4 now isn't it? But you can still make good on #3.
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No the general consensus is that you should send the cue because the guy who paid you money and gave you the wood to make, wants it back. I know you have disclosed the problems with the cue to him, and he doesn't care. Just send him the damn cue, stop being a drama queen, and get on with your life. You're letting a situation affect you because your pride is getting in the way.
Trent,
You come across as a piss poor businessman who is at best childish.
Do you understand that if the buyer sent you a blank and you agreed to turn it into a cue and you cut it up in to pieces, you can be held liable?
Do you understand that perhaps the buyer selected that particular wood for a reason? Perhaps the appearance of the wood is more important to him than a joint you think you feel a rattle in.
Do you understand that after this thread, it's a really good thing that you're leaving cue making? After reading your rants, understanding that you aren't capable of conducting business without acting like a 5 year old, and knowing that you have no issues destroying personal property when your panties get in a bunch, I don't think you'd ever sell another cue.
You've been paid, send the buyer his cue. There are no other options, choices, or decisions.
You come across as a piss poor businessman who is at best childish.
Do you understand that if the buyer sent you a blank and you agreed to turn it into a cue and you cut it up in to pieces, you can be held liable?
Do you understand that perhaps the buyer selected that particular wood for a reason? Perhaps the appearance of the wood is more important to him than a joint you think you feel a rattle in.
Do you understand that after this thread, it's a really good thing that you're leaving cue making? After reading your rants, understanding that you aren't capable of conducting business without acting like a 5 year old, and knowing that you have no issues destroying personal property when your panties get in a bunch, I don't think you'd ever sell another cue.
You've been paid, send the buyer his cue. There are no other options, choices, or decisions.
Your behavior is going to create a reputation that will run far and long beyond this one website, chief. Cue nuts have long memories...and big mouths.
"I don't care" - That says it all.
Unbelievable.....
heres the email arrangement
From: Larry Shaughnessy
To: Trent Cowgill
Trent,
Heres what I need to do before I can send anything to a cuemaker (you or other makers). Send my stuff out to be stabilized, and then it can be sent out for cues. That takes a couple weeks or so. I am getting ready to send my stuff any day now. I could do the deposit of $375 when I ship the stabilized wood to you, if we can work out a deal.
I couldn't agree to giving you 3 extra pieces of wood tho. It is very expensive.......So if you messed up I would pay for the damaged piece to be returned to me and I would send a replacement out to you ASAP.... not a problem. I would reuse the damaged piece for blades if that happens. (If you're looking for wood I could hook you up, but that would have to be a side deal)
As far as price goes I would do $750 for the 3 cues with 2 shafts for each cue with the rings I like. Joint and butt cap material etc I would leave up to you....
I would want a date that you will have them done......you pick whatever works for you, just so I have some idea when to expect them, and when I need to have the rest of the money out to you.
I have to say you do great work........ Hopefully this deal will work for both of us.
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With that being said Yes sure I messed up taking on wood I had never used before not knowing that it wouldn't hold glue.
Seems to me that a cue that will not hold glue at all do to the stabilizing as mentioned by another posting than this cue is no good regardless as it might as well be made of delrin.
so I would like to disassemble the cue leaving as much usable wood as possible and send the wood back along with the deposit of 130 dollars.
from the emails ive received about this cue and the future it will have I surely do not want it out there in the world as it will just fall apart.
I will even still send some nice wood of my own to help out with the loss.
at this point i will have still fulfilled the agreement originally set by us.
From: Larry Shaughnessy
To: Trent Cowgill
Trent,
Heres what I need to do before I can send anything to a cuemaker (you or other makers). Send my stuff out to be stabilized, and then it can be sent out for cues. That takes a couple weeks or so. I am getting ready to send my stuff any day now. I could do the deposit of $375 when I ship the stabilized wood to you, if we can work out a deal.
I couldn't agree to giving you 3 extra pieces of wood tho. It is very expensive.......So if you messed up I would pay for the damaged piece to be returned to me and I would send a replacement out to you ASAP.... not a problem. I would reuse the damaged piece for blades if that happens. (If you're looking for wood I could hook you up, but that would have to be a side deal)
As far as price goes I would do $750 for the 3 cues with 2 shafts for each cue with the rings I like. Joint and butt cap material etc I would leave up to you....
I would want a date that you will have them done......you pick whatever works for you, just so I have some idea when to expect them, and when I need to have the rest of the money out to you.
I have to say you do great work........ Hopefully this deal will work for both of us.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
With that being said Yes sure I messed up taking on wood I had never used before not knowing that it wouldn't hold glue.
Seems to me that a cue that will not hold glue at all do to the stabilizing as mentioned by another posting than this cue is no good regardless as it might as well be made of delrin.
so I would like to disassemble the cue leaving as much usable wood as possible and send the wood back along with the deposit of 130 dollars.
from the emails ive received about this cue and the future it will have I surely do not want it out there in the world as it will just fall apart.
I will even still send some nice wood of my own to help out with the loss.
at this point i will have still fulfilled the agreement originally set by us.
So he even says if you messed up to return it to him. Sounds like you need to remove the joint pin from the cue and send it off.
Trent.... Since
#1 - YOU are the one who messed up building the cue in the first place...
#2 - YOU are the one who doesn't have time to finish it....
Why don't YOU just send the cue to another cue maker to have it corrected???
Why do you just continue to argue???
I really don't understand. From what I have read of the emails, I see nothing said to you that I wouln't have said to you.
Russ.....
Edited to Add: I understand the glue / joint failure part and it seems the buyer is also. Send him the cue and let him deal with it.
#1 - YOU are the one who messed up building the cue in the first place...
#2 - YOU are the one who doesn't have time to finish it....
Why don't YOU just send the cue to another cue maker to have it corrected???
Why do you just continue to argue???
I really don't understand. From what I have read of the emails, I see nothing said to you that I wouln't have said to you.
Russ.....
Edited to Add: I understand the glue / joint failure part and it seems the buyer is also. Send him the cue and let him deal with it.
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That's not your decision to make.
The buyer knows the risk. The buyer is willing to accept that risk. You fully disclosed this information to him and now, its public knowledge.
Stop trying to do the honorable thing because frankly, you're doing it wrong. Send the guy his cue. Period.
i probably would have taken what i offered
1. Free cue after i finish moving
2. Refunding all the money back
3. Multiple sticks of ambonya, thuya, camphor burl to replace the wood as i dont have any koa.
Pretty fair offer or maybe i would have fixed it (after the move) but no he wants it done shiped by tuesday or there will be legal action
But its ok to talk to me like shit and threaten me because hes the buyer and the wood guy on az.
Last offer i send back the 130 i told him not to send minus shipping materials and shipping expense and he gets a rattle and ringwork no shafts.
Dude,,,it's f'ing koa!!!!
No, due to the "Cue-Maker Became a Tool" clause, you now need to do whatever the buyer tells you to do. It's in the fine print.
Lol at not having enough time to finish the cue. In the amount of time he posted here most cuemakers could of made an entire cue!
To end this just send it to Andy Gilbert and I will pay for the repair. If you need the address I can give it to you.
To end this just send it to Andy Gilbert and I will pay for the repair. If you need the address I can give it to you.
Trent your in the wrong. Grow up. I want to warn you. I now work in a career that gives me a first hand look into legal matters(not a lawyer). And the things he is talking about doing
do carry some weight. If he takes you to civil court you will lose big. I will bet almost anything on that based on the fact he knows the defect and still wants the cue. Its in writing. But you wont just lose the cost of the cue, no you lose the cost of the wood, cost of the summons to court, his attorney fees, his and his attorneys travel expenses, and maybe damages. Base figure of about 5,000 and can go up from there. Is it worth that much money to allow your pride to run rampant. I know you think yourself very big and important but a judge wont be impressed. I belive you have just committed cueicide and you may have no choice but make cues as a hobby for yourself if you keep going down this path. I hope you heed my words as I actually know what I'm talking about.
do carry some weight. If he takes you to civil court you will lose big. I will bet almost anything on that based on the fact he knows the defect and still wants the cue. Its in writing. But you wont just lose the cost of the cue, no you lose the cost of the wood, cost of the summons to court, his attorney fees, his and his attorneys travel expenses, and maybe damages. Base figure of about 5,000 and can go up from there. Is it worth that much money to allow your pride to run rampant. I know you think yourself very big and important but a judge wont be impressed. I belive you have just committed cueicide and you may have no choice but make cues as a hobby for yourself if you keep going down this path. I hope you heed my words as I actually know what I'm talking about.
That is not a "common enough" repair. That's a difficult and delicate repair. Pretty much all the materials and work that has gone into it would be lost.
Roger
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