out of all the tips ive ever used i could never tell a difference between any, triangles deff hold their shape better then any other ive tried though.
What is the advantage of a layered tip?
- Thread starter Highmiles
- Start date
out of all the tips ive ever used i could never tell a difference between any, triangles deff hold their shape better then any other ive tried though.
If layered tips made a cue play better wouldn’t you think for a few dollars more that high-end production cue companies that have been in business for years would put them on their cues? Joss=Triangle, Pechauer=Triangle, Helmstetter=LePro, Balabushka=LePro, and many others come standard with single layered tips. Just a thought.:grin: Johnnyt
Do you think that the nicer cue made a difference?
Exactly what I have been wondering. There are also a lot of custom builders that use single layer tips.
Along the same thought line, why put an expensive tip on a high-end production cue when it will be the first thing replaced?
I am pretty sure the high-end production cue makers are getting their tips a lot cheaper then we can.
1000 lepros cost a lot less than 1000 layered tips.
How often can you catch a deal on 50 Lepro tips for less than $20? I still have a dozen or so left from the early 90s and probably have 20 or so Talisman mediums from early 2000. I do my own tip replacement.
I am pretty sure the high-end production cue makers are getting their tips a lot cheaper then we can.
1000 lepros cost a lot less than 1000 layered tips.
How often can you catch a deal on 50 Lepro tips for less than $20? I still have a dozen or so left from the early 90s and probably have 20 or so Talisman mediums from early 2000. I do my own tip replacement.
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They would get bulk price on layered tips also. The extra few dollars they would have to tack on to a $500-$1500 cue would not be a deal breaker. Layered tips are no better than single layered tips is why they don't bother. Johnnyt
What kind of responses were you expecting?
Comparing Apples to Apples:
If you're looking at pure economic cost, here are some from AZMarketplace, and one from Muellers
LePros, @ 43 cents per tip
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Lepro_Cue_Tips-372-80.html
Triangle, @65 cents per tip, approximately 1 1/2 LePros.
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Triangle_Cue_Tip-150-80.html
Moori, @$15.95 per tip, approximately 37 LePros, or 24 1/2 Triangles
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Moori_Pool_Cue_Tip-144-80.html
Kamui Black, @$19.75 per tip, approximately 45 LePros, or 30 Triangles.
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Black_Kamui_Pool_Cue_Tip-100201-80.html
Molavia, @$11.95 per tip, approximately 27.7 LePros, or 18 Triangles.
My local cue guy swears the Molavia Hard performs like the old Moori Medium-Hard.
http://www.poolndarts.com/index.cfm...919&Fuseaction=Catalog.Product&productID=8326
For value sake, let's add $10 for labor.
FWIW, all the layered tips I've come are oversize, at 14mm and have to be shaped down. Usually best done on lathe. Single layer tips often come in different sizes 12mm,13mm, 14mm. Match up the right size, they usually fit straight out of the box with minimal shaping.
Comparing Apples to Apples:
If you're looking at pure economic cost, here are some from AZMarketplace, and one from Muellers
LePros, @ 43 cents per tip
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Lepro_Cue_Tips-372-80.html
Triangle, @65 cents per tip, approximately 1 1/2 LePros.
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Triangle_Cue_Tip-150-80.html
Moori, @$15.95 per tip, approximately 37 LePros, or 24 1/2 Triangles
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Moori_Pool_Cue_Tip-144-80.html
Kamui Black, @$19.75 per tip, approximately 45 LePros, or 30 Triangles.
http://www.seyberts.com/products/Black_Kamui_Pool_Cue_Tip-100201-80.html
Molavia, @$11.95 per tip, approximately 27.7 LePros, or 18 Triangles.
My local cue guy swears the Molavia Hard performs like the old Moori Medium-Hard.
http://www.poolndarts.com/index.cfm...919&Fuseaction=Catalog.Product&productID=8326
For value sake, let's add $10 for labor.
FWIW, all the layered tips I've come are oversize, at 14mm and have to be shaped down. Usually best done on lathe. Single layer tips often come in different sizes 12mm,13mm, 14mm. Match up the right size, they usually fit straight out of the box with minimal shaping.
Based on all the threads on layered tips, I didn't expect most of the replies to defend solid tips.
I also expected some solid reasons why some people have gone to layered, other than having to trim an occasional mushroom.
I have seen more defensiveness over pricey chalk, than layered tips. So far it has all been emotion (I just like 'em) and no real substance as to why they may or may not be better.
At this point, I will be staying with pressed, solid tips.
JohnnyT, even if they got a quantity discount it would still be more expensive than the cheap lepros or triangles. Besides, if they layered tip aren't any better, why pay more $$$
Economics 101.
Economics 101.
I think that's what I said. "Layered tips are no better than Triangle type tips, so why pay more. LOL. Johnnyt
that's an easy one...
Moori = $10
Tringle / LePro = $1
an extra $9 in profit on a $300=$400 cue is significant, they get no price premium on the cue for tip.
My point is the layered tip doesn't make a cue play any better so why bother paying more for the tip. If they made a cue play better, for the extra $5 it would cost to put one on (raising the price of a $500-$1500 cue $5) would not be a deal breaker.
If you made and sold a product for $1000 and a $5 item will make it a much better product you wouldn't do it? You're not going to pay $15 for a layered tip if you order 1000 of them at a time. Johnnyt
Nope.
Just like hi-end bicycles don't generally come with similar quality pedals. It is such a user-specific item that the makers just put something on there and let the buyer make the decision about wht will be on there in the longer run.
I was also going to comment on your theory that some pros dont go layered...they are around tip doctors all the time, so replacement isn't ever a hassle. for lotsa folks, getting a tip replaced isn't as easy, so the life of the tip needs to be longer.
The economics of high end pool makers, is very interesting, but I am interested in why layered tips are better.
I hear maintenance, but a pressed LePro, or a Triangle is low maintenance. Not to mention, you should be inspecting and caring for your tip anyway.
I hear consistency, but I see posts all the time complaining about the inconsistency of Moori, and Kumai medium tips.
I don't mind paying more for something, if it does a better job. Please fill me in on the benefits that make it worthwhile.
I hear maintenance, but a pressed LePro, or a Triangle is low maintenance. Not to mention, you should be inspecting and caring for your tip anyway.
I hear consistency, but I see posts all the time complaining about the inconsistency of Moori, and Kumai medium tips.
I don't mind paying more for something, if it does a better job. Please fill me in on the benefits that make it worthwhile.
I switched from layered tips to Milk Duds a couple of years ago. Finally found a tip that I just love everything about, and does just what I ask of it.
The Milk Duds I have been using have been very consistent from tip to tip. I have had mine of my current cue for a year now, and they're still just as good as when they were installed. I have experienced no mushrooming or flattening of the tip, and I use my player to break with. Glazing has not been an issue either.
Bear in mind, not all Milk Duds are created equal. I have tried some that were just awful and inconsistent, and would never tell anyone to purchase them.
Lisa
The Milk Duds I have been using have been very consistent from tip to tip. I have had mine of my current cue for a year now, and they're still just as good as when they were installed. I have experienced no mushrooming or flattening of the tip, and I use my player to break with. Glazing has not been an issue either.
Bear in mind, not all Milk Duds are created equal. I have tried some that were just awful and inconsistent, and would never tell anyone to purchase them.
Lisa
Did you know there is a patent on file for soaking cue tips in milk? According to the patent, the process makes the leather hold chalk better and prevent miscues.
Can that be?
I don't know patent law, but unless you are the maker of the tip (or under an agreement with), how can you use it for gain?
I can't patent soaking a twinkie in Jaeger...or can I?:sorry:
hmmmmmmmmmm
Soak a twinkie in Yager?.... You sir just moved up a few notches! Kudos :thumbup:
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almost anything can be patented these days
Almost anything can be patented these days. A patent for milkduds won't stand up in court since the process has been in common usage for many many years, at least since the early eighties and I think it was an old trick then. However the patent office probably will release a patent without doing much in the way of research themselves then other people have to fight the patent if they choose to. Similar things have happened in the recent past in pool where someone patented something that had been in common usage for years. The same is true of copyright. The only reason Trump was denied a copyright on "you're fired" is that it was too close to a copyright someone already had on "you're hired".
Hu
Almost anything can be patented these days. A patent for milkduds won't stand up in court since the process has been in common usage for many many years, at least since the early eighties and I think it was an old trick then. However the patent office probably will release a patent without doing much in the way of research themselves then other people have to fight the patent if they choose to. Similar things have happened in the recent past in pool where someone patented something that had been in common usage for years. The same is true of copyright. The only reason Trump was denied a copyright on "you're fired" is that it was too close to a copyright someone already had on "you're hired".
Hu