What is the deal with players wanting refunds??
- Thread starter Peanutbutr
- Start date
so you would be ok with 2 players that are getting staked to get together before their match and decide that whoever wins, they throw the other player some "walking around money"? it doesn't matter if it happens before or after the match, if a player did that to me while i was backing them...they need not ever expect me to back them again. "savers" are a form of doing business.
HUH???things are so differant when I was coming up
NO!its not OK between the players!but he was a backer(in the Original Post it looks like one of several)!
I can't remember the year, but there was a pool tournament at Q-Masters in Norfolk, Virginia. In fact, this may have been one of the first so-called "pro-caliber" tournaments I attended on the road, so to speak. 
It was an interesting tournament for me, in more ways than one. I hardly knew anybody there, with the exception of a few local Virginia players. Billy Stephens and the late Jimmy Mack were there.
It was a great tournament, and there was a slew of pro players in attendance. It was a double-elimination 9-ball event. Keith McCready was hitting 'em stronger than ever that weekend. I remember being a little taken aback when a few pool people remarked to me in private that I must have done something good for Keith because they had never seen him behave so well. LOL :grin-square:
At any rate, Keith was hitting 'em like Grant taking Richmond. He was in the winners' bracket the entire tournament. In the finals, he had to face Michael Coltrain in an extended race. This was my first experience in seeing a double-elimination tournament with an extended race at the end. I didn't think it was fair that the guy in the winners' bracket -- Keith -- didn't get to lose a round, like all the other competitors. Michael Coltrain defeated Keith and took the honors of first place in that tournament, with Keith being the bride's maid. :frown:
That evening, the festivities were in full bloom. There was Action Jackson in the pool room. Keith was celebrating and, shall I say, feeling no pain consuming his favorite beverage.
Sam Monday approached Keith and said he'd like to play for 2 dimes, if Keith spotted him the wild 8 in 9-ball, a 15-ahead game. Sam Monday was backed by a committee, and one of the committee members was Michael Coltrain who seemed to really like Sam's end of it.
Keith asked me to hand him the cheese that he just won for his second place in the tournament, and I put up an argument, explaining we were stuck for the trip and should try to come home winner. He didn't want to hear any of that kind of talk, and I gave in.
The 15-ahead game commenced. It seesawed back and forth for a few hours. I remember it being about 2 or 3 in the morning at this juncture. Michael Coltrain and the rest of the committee members were clapping and cheering after every good shot made by Sam Monday. On Keith's side of the room, he had one cheerleader. Me.
At one point, Sam Monday was 12 games ahead, and I knew the end for Keith was near. I decided rather than be all bummed out about it, I'd just enjoy the show. Keith was dancing around the table, talking smack after every shot a la Minnesota Fats. It was kind of funny, I thought, even though we were just about to lose.
And then it happened. It was as if Keith got a second wind. The more he yapped and the more he drank, the better he played. Keith started running racks, and before I knew it, it was Even Steven. Within minutes, Keith won the whole shebang. WOW! I was so happy. We were going to leave Norfolk with a nice chunk of cheese.
Meanwhile, Sam Monday looked like a wet puppy, as he was unscrewing his cue. I was exhausted. It was daylight outside, and I had to drive all the way back to D.C. from Norfolk, about 3.5 hours, with no sleep, but who cares. We were winners!
Sam went to the bathroom, and Keith went there soon after. When Keith returned, I said, "Well, you better give me the dough for safekeeping." He handed it to me and said, "I gave Sam a jelly roll for giving me action." I looked at him in disbelief. I said, "You did what? How much did you give him? I'm sure he wouldn't have given you a tip." Keith explained that without Sam Monday playing for so many hours, that Keith wouldn't have gotten any action and the chance to win. Most importantly, though, he said, "You never leave a pool player broke after you bust him."
I still didn't like it that he gave Sam Monday a jelly roll at that time, but, today, I understand the logic much better. This is old-school etiquette between players, and it's a sign of respect.
There was no funny business going on. I don't know how much of Sam's money was in the committee money, but he had a piece of it. There was no dumping. Each player in this match gave it their all, and the best man, as it turned out, won!
Here's a cute shot of the Carolina Contingency, starting from left to right, Keith, Sam Monday, Laura Turrone, and Dennis Strickland (no relation to Earl).
It was an interesting tournament for me, in more ways than one. I hardly knew anybody there, with the exception of a few local Virginia players. Billy Stephens and the late Jimmy Mack were there.
It was a great tournament, and there was a slew of pro players in attendance. It was a double-elimination 9-ball event. Keith McCready was hitting 'em stronger than ever that weekend. I remember being a little taken aback when a few pool people remarked to me in private that I must have done something good for Keith because they had never seen him behave so well. LOL :grin-square:
At any rate, Keith was hitting 'em like Grant taking Richmond. He was in the winners' bracket the entire tournament. In the finals, he had to face Michael Coltrain in an extended race. This was my first experience in seeing a double-elimination tournament with an extended race at the end. I didn't think it was fair that the guy in the winners' bracket -- Keith -- didn't get to lose a round, like all the other competitors. Michael Coltrain defeated Keith and took the honors of first place in that tournament, with Keith being the bride's maid. :frown:
That evening, the festivities were in full bloom. There was Action Jackson in the pool room. Keith was celebrating and, shall I say, feeling no pain consuming his favorite beverage.
Sam Monday approached Keith and said he'd like to play for 2 dimes, if Keith spotted him the wild 8 in 9-ball, a 15-ahead game. Sam Monday was backed by a committee, and one of the committee members was Michael Coltrain who seemed to really like Sam's end of it.
Keith asked me to hand him the cheese that he just won for his second place in the tournament, and I put up an argument, explaining we were stuck for the trip and should try to come home winner. He didn't want to hear any of that kind of talk, and I gave in.
The 15-ahead game commenced. It seesawed back and forth for a few hours. I remember it being about 2 or 3 in the morning at this juncture. Michael Coltrain and the rest of the committee members were clapping and cheering after every good shot made by Sam Monday. On Keith's side of the room, he had one cheerleader. Me.
At one point, Sam Monday was 12 games ahead, and I knew the end for Keith was near. I decided rather than be all bummed out about it, I'd just enjoy the show. Keith was dancing around the table, talking smack after every shot a la Minnesota Fats. It was kind of funny, I thought, even though we were just about to lose.
And then it happened. It was as if Keith got a second wind. The more he yapped and the more he drank, the better he played. Keith started running racks, and before I knew it, it was Even Steven. Within minutes, Keith won the whole shebang. WOW! I was so happy. We were going to leave Norfolk with a nice chunk of cheese.
Meanwhile, Sam Monday looked like a wet puppy, as he was unscrewing his cue. I was exhausted. It was daylight outside, and I had to drive all the way back to D.C. from Norfolk, about 3.5 hours, with no sleep, but who cares. We were winners!
Sam went to the bathroom, and Keith went there soon after. When Keith returned, I said, "Well, you better give me the dough for safekeeping." He handed it to me and said, "I gave Sam a jelly roll for giving me action." I looked at him in disbelief. I said, "You did what? How much did you give him? I'm sure he wouldn't have given you a tip." Keith explained that without Sam Monday playing for so many hours, that Keith wouldn't have gotten any action and the chance to win. Most importantly, though, he said, "You never leave a pool player broke after you bust him."
I still didn't like it that he gave Sam Monday a jelly roll at that time, but, today, I understand the logic much better. This is old-school etiquette between players, and it's a sign of respect.
There was no funny business going on. I don't know how much of Sam's money was in the committee money, but he had a piece of it. There was no dumping. Each player in this match gave it their all, and the best man, as it turned out, won!
Here's a cute shot of the Carolina Contingency, starting from left to right, Keith, Sam Monday, Laura Turrone, and Dennis Strickland (no relation to Earl).
Attachments
![carolinecontingency[1].JPG](/data/attachments/83/83347-dde8b9f5f5298f6b62ddff4ff0ec290d.jpg?hash=3ei59fUpj2)
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its the same difference unless the losing player splits the walking stick with his backer.
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![coltrainfamily[1].JPG](/data/attachments/83/83348-08922a66e0a756894c3a5616c0eda493.jpg?hash=CJIqZuCnVo)
I have to ask(and not being smarta$$ either)have you ever had to live on money won at pool???
Aw, shucks. Thank you, Baby Cakes!
You know, this thread reminds me of a slogan that was used by The Washington Post newspaper, and it goes like this: If you don't get it, then you don't get it. :wink:
yes and i have backed many players as well to learn valuable lessons. now, there are only 2 or 3 players i will back and they usually like to put up half of their own money. i know how it is making money playing pool. that's why i finished college and got a career.
'nuff said!!its just the way it "USED" to be!winning 2 large and cant spread a little jelly around sure seems nit to me though!hell Ive spread it on $100 before and it sure made life easier on me!!
lol, i'm a nit. if we won,i would spread the jelly around..to the player i backed. guess that's why i will never have to worry about being accused of "doing business".
lol I understand!Im never going to be a writer cant type what I want to say its just beyond me
There are some folk that are okay to gamble with, and then there are some who just ain't worth the time. No matter how high they stack it, there's going to be problems and arguments. That has been my experience. Recognizing who they are is a talent.
BTW, I see you're from Dalton. In the '70s, we were on the road shooting pool. My partner only liked going to pool rooms, but, me, I liked the taverns and bars. Georgia at that time had quite a few cool pool bars.
At any rate, we were in some bar in Dalton and got in action. There were a few railbirds who wanted to bet on the side with me against my partner, to which I complied. After my partner started winning, one of the railbirds opened his coat and showed me a gun tucked in his pants. He said, "What are you going to do now?"
I was pretty green at that time, and I started crying. LOL My partner pulled up. There was an uncomfortable pause, when everybody just stood there, with me crying. Finally, the bartender came over and said, "Hey, don't worry about Bobby. He won't harm you. I'll walk you out to your car, if you want." We left immediately.
Needless to say, we didn't give the stranger that my partner was playing a jelly roll.
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When I owned my poolroom I watched this BS all the time. People making enemies over a f%$#ing game of pool.
Regardless of whether you should or shouldn't have given him the money, or regardless of who is going to be knocking who's game, and regardless of who's acting like an A@ole, this thread has defined in each and every word posted, why betting on pool games simply ends in worthless BS.
Next time both of ya IMO should just go play some poker at the local casino and forget about all this horse this, horse that, stake this box that BS.
You'll end up with more friends and just as much money in the end. And ths my friends is why pool remains in the gutter.
Regardless of whether you should or shouldn't have given him the money, or regardless of who is going to be knocking who's game, and regardless of who's acting like an A@ole, this thread has defined in each and every word posted, why betting on pool games simply ends in worthless BS.
Next time both of ya IMO should just go play some poker at the local casino and forget about all this horse this, horse that, stake this box that BS.
You'll end up with more friends and just as much money in the end. And ths my friends is why pool remains in the gutter.
Yeah, that's about the era for sure. I can remember getting a lot of action in Rome and Valencia too.
In Savannah, I think it was -- and I may be wrong -- there was a player named Rocky Creek who was a well-known high-stakes pool player. Everybody that came to Georgia would hunt down Rocky Creek.
All these nicknames are coming back to me. There was another action player named Groundhog. :grin-square:
Every bar you walked in during this era had multible tables in it down South. Up my way, in Maryland, very few bars had mutliple tables. Mostly, the bars only had one table; two or three at the most. When I went to Georgia and saw all of these bars loaded up with tables, I thought I'd died and gone to heaven.
Some of the most interesting experiences I had on the road was in Georgia. Anyone who gambled in Georgia knows the phrase. "Stack it up as high as the Georgia pine." :wink:
Leigh, I don't have a link, but it goes like this:
Direct Examination
Cross-Examination (some don't use a hyphen, but I do)
Further Direct Examination (if there is no Cross-Examination)
Further Cross-Examination (if there is no Redirect Examination)
Redirect Examination
Recross-Examination
Further Redirect Examination
Further Recross-Examination
And then you have these occasionally:
Rebuttal Examination (used to rebut previously entered evidence)
Surrebuttal Examination (response to Rebuttal Examination)
Voir Dire Examination (used to determine if a witness is a subject-
matter expert)
HTH!
Direct Examination
Cross-Examination (some don't use a hyphen, but I do)
Further Direct Examination (if there is no Cross-Examination)
Further Cross-Examination (if there is no Redirect Examination)
Redirect Examination
Recross-Examination
Further Redirect Examination
Further Recross-Examination
And then you have these occasionally:
Rebuttal Examination (used to rebut previously entered evidence)
Surrebuttal Examination (response to Rebuttal Examination)
Voir Dire Examination (used to determine if a witness is a subject-
matter expert)
HTH!
jelly
If I busted somebody that had been a good guy to play with a little jelly was a given. If I busted a guy that spent most of his time gambling a little jelly was almost automatic just because as HoumaTroy said, you have to seed the field so you can harvest it again. I did that with one guy for about six months. I lost to him for small stakes when he was broke and gave him enough jelly to get back into action when I busted him. I also trimmed his roll for him every week or two. :grin:
Guys that asked for jelly, it depended on the situation. They often got it but not always. Somebody that had pulled every move in the book probably wasn't going to get it, particularly if they were local. I had a little bit of a soft spot for people on the road. I had some guys demand jelly after losing. Those I sent down the road busted and disgusted, jelly was a gift not a right in my mind. I gave whatever I wanted, sometimes very generously. Nobody demanded anything and got it.
Hu
If I busted somebody that had been a good guy to play with a little jelly was a given. If I busted a guy that spent most of his time gambling a little jelly was almost automatic just because as HoumaTroy said, you have to seed the field so you can harvest it again. I did that with one guy for about six months. I lost to him for small stakes when he was broke and gave him enough jelly to get back into action when I busted him. I also trimmed his roll for him every week or two. :grin:
Guys that asked for jelly, it depended on the situation. They often got it but not always. Somebody that had pulled every move in the book probably wasn't going to get it, particularly if they were local. I had a little bit of a soft spot for people on the road. I had some guys demand jelly after losing. Those I sent down the road busted and disgusted, jelly was a gift not a right in my mind. I gave whatever I wanted, sometimes very generously. Nobody demanded anything and got it.
Hu
I can't remember the year, but there was a pool tournament at Q-Masters in Norfolk, Virginia. In fact, this may have been one of the first so-called "pro-caliber" tournaments I attended on the road, so to speak.
It was an interesting tournament for me, in more ways than one. I hardly knew anybody there, with the exception of a few local Virginia players. Billy Stephens and the late Jimmy Mack were there.
It was a great tournament, and there was a slew of pro players in attendance. It was a double-elimination 9-ball event. Keith McCready was hitting 'em stronger than ever that weekend. I remember being a little taken aback when a few pool people remarked to me in private that I must have done something good for Keith because they had never seen him behave so well. LOL :grin-square:
At any rate, Keith was hitting 'em like Grant taking Richmond. He was in the winners' bracket the entire tournament. In the finals, he had to face Michael Coltrain in an extended race. This was my first experience in seeing a double-elimination tournament with an extended race at the end. I didn't think it was fair that the guy in the winners' bracket -- Keith -- didn't get to lose a round, like all the other competitors. Michael Coltrain defeated Keith and took the honors of first place in that tournament, with Keith being the bride's maid. :frown:
That evening, the festivities were in full bloom. There was Action Jackson in the pool room. Keith was celebrating and, shall I say, feeling no pain consuming his favorite beverage.
Sam Monday approached Keith and said he'd like to play for 2 dimes, if Keith spotted him the wild 8 in 9-ball, a 15-ahead game. Sam Monday was backed by a committee, and one of the committee members was Michael Coltrain who seemed to really like Sam's end of it.
Keith asked me to hand him the cheese that he just won for his second place in the tournament, and I put up an argument, explaining we were stuck for the trip and should try to come home winner. He didn't want to hear any of that kind of talk, and I gave in.
The 15-ahead game commenced. It seesawed back and forth for a few hours. I remember it being about 2 or 3 in the morning at this juncture. Michael Coltrain and the rest of the committee members were clapping and cheering after every good shot made by Sam Monday. On Keith's side of the room, he had one cheerleader. Me.
At one point, Sam Monday was 12 games ahead, and I knew the end for Keith was near. I decided rather than be all bummed out about it, I'd just enjoy the show. Keith was dancing around the table, talking smack after every shot a la Minnesota Fats. It was kind of funny, I thought, even though we were just about to lose.
And then it happened. It was as if Keith got a second wind. The more he yapped and the more he drank, the better he played. Keith started running racks, and before I knew it, it was Even Steven. Within minutes, Keith won the whole shebang. WOW! I was so happy. We were going to leave Norfolk with a nice chunk of cheese.
Meanwhile, Sam Monday looked like a wet puppy, as he was unscrewing his cue. I was exhausted. It was daylight outside, and I had to drive all the way back to D.C. from Norfolk, about 3.5 hours, with no sleep, but who cares. We were winners!
Sam went to the bathroom, and Keith went there soon after. When Keith returned, I said, "Well, you better give me the dough for safekeeping." He handed it to me and said, "I gave Sam a jelly roll for giving me action." I looked at him in disbelief. I said, "You did what? How much did you give him? I'm sure he wouldn't have given you a tip." Keith explained that without Sam Monday playing for so many hours, that Keith wouldn't have gotten any action and the chance to win. Most importantly, though, he said, "You never leave a pool player broke after you bust him."
I still didn't like it that he gave Sam Monday a jelly roll at that time, but, today, I understand the logic much better. This is old-school etiquette between players, and it's a sign of respect.
There was no funny business going on. I don't know how much of Sam's money was in the committee money, but he had a piece of it. There was no dumping. Each player in this match gave it their all, and the best man, as it turned out, won!
Here's a cute shot of the Carolina Contingency, starting from left to right, Keith, Sam Monday, Laura Turrone, and Dennis Strickland (no relation to Earl).
Old school vs new school is one way to describe it. Another way is big time vs small time.