Hi guys and gals I only play on the barbox but havent played in leagues for about ten years but would consider myself a C+ B- 8 ball player . When I played I did the" team " first as in not always playing to my potential, I was considered the strongest 6 "APA" in my area not thats to brag about.I've recently started playing again and started trying to think of the skills neede to be a barbox specialist.PLease dont coment if you are gonna beatup the barbox.My list might seem alittle strange on a couple of the skills I've been working on but they seem important to me because of the size of the barbox "7 footer" Heres my list please add or critiqe.1 "cue ball control" small area ball spead and control important.2" break control with power" I can 2nd ball break also but my spread is alot better with power control break.3 "Defense" congested and you will need to make 2 way shots,safety break shots. 4 kicks,when you are left safe.5 cluster work,barbox has alot of clusters.6 carom and combos, I think these 2 are way under used in the games I see.7 banks.......ok heres it is short version 1 cue bal control..2Break control...3Defense...4kicks...5cluster work...6carom and combos...7 banks. please add or tell me your opinions. thank you.:smile:
What skills are needed to be a 8 ball barbox monster
- Thread starter oldschool2791
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The'Enter'keyonyourkeyboardisagoodstart.Imight-agotpastthe2ndline,ifitwaren'talljumbledup
Know what I mean?
Know what I mean?
IMHO the most important skill in BB 8-ball is analyzing the table after the break and choosing the right group. I'm amazed how often I see the first shooter choose a group only because it has the easiest opening shot or two; after that it's all uphill in clusters, rails, etc.
Well I think 8,9,12 footers need less cluster work,cue ball control, and alot less carom shots and like I said 8 ball so it is pretty congested. The big tables need alot more ball making skill. My table is a valley with pockets reduced to 3.5 inches for my ball making eye,lol. BUt when I play in bars I do cheat the pocket but only when needed.PLease don't think I'm dissing the big tables,I'm just trying to get as far as I can on the barbox
I definately should have added that one.I do carefully choose my set. I agree about seeing people picking the wrong set with problem balls
If you're an APA 6, this may be hard to hear but I'm sure you have plenty to work on. APA 6's typically average about 2-3 innings per game which is great amongst casual pool players but to be a barbox monster, you'll have to halve that average at least.
In a race to 5 on a barbox with 4" pockets or bigger, it should be expected that you run-out at least once. In fact, if you don't, you should consider it a poorly played set. Two to three should be your average and all five should be your goal.
There is no defense. Defense is a luxury afforded to a player whose opponent failed to run-out and pocketed too many balls in the process. If your opponent has all his balls on the table, you simply can't think about defense unless you are without options and there's almost always an option.
To be a monster, you have to routinely run out. That means don't miss, keep your patterns simple and predictable and never lose the cue ball. I regard myself as an above-average player in the BCA Open tournaments and I might have 2 or 3 misses in an entire set. That's the most I'm going to give-up. I've faced guys nobody on this board have ever heard of who played perfect on me. You want to be a monster? On a barbox, you'll need to be perfect at everything.
In a race to 5 on a barbox with 4" pockets or bigger, it should be expected that you run-out at least once. In fact, if you don't, you should consider it a poorly played set. Two to three should be your average and all five should be your goal.
There is no defense. Defense is a luxury afforded to a player whose opponent failed to run-out and pocketed too many balls in the process. If your opponent has all his balls on the table, you simply can't think about defense unless you are without options and there's almost always an option.
To be a monster, you have to routinely run out. That means don't miss, keep your patterns simple and predictable and never lose the cue ball. I regard myself as an above-average player in the BCA Open tournaments and I might have 2 or 3 misses in an entire set. That's the most I'm going to give-up. I've faced guys nobody on this board have ever heard of who played perfect on me. You want to be a monster? On a barbox, you'll need to be perfect at everything.
Five national 8-ball barbox champions, with 13 national titles between them, were interviewed (individually), to see what they thought was most important in 8-ball...and in what order. Every one of them identified "8-ball liability" as number 1! That means is there a pocket for the 8-ball right now, coming into the rack, or does the player have to create a path for the 8-ball. The link or key ball, to set up on the game ball, was number 2 (ideally should be a stop shot).
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
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I was recently watching these Valley Forge matches on youtube. Here's one of them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UK1PKFiyer4
These are "barbox monsters" playing a not-so-perfect set with rather complex lay-outs. What I especially like about these videos is the commentary. JR Calvert is spot-on most of the time. Although there were a few scenarios where players were allowed to breeze through the rack, most of the time there was a lot of traffic to get through and their success-rate is still kind of amazing.
Just a warning though, if at any time you feel comforted by watching these guys fail to run-out, bear in mind that in order to beat either of them, perfection is usually required. I've seen both of these guys play near-perfect for very long stretches.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UK1PKFiyer4
These are "barbox monsters" playing a not-so-perfect set with rather complex lay-outs. What I especially like about these videos is the commentary. JR Calvert is spot-on most of the time. Although there were a few scenarios where players were allowed to breeze through the rack, most of the time there was a lot of traffic to get through and their success-rate is still kind of amazing.
Just a warning though, if at any time you feel comforted by watching these guys fail to run-out, bear in mind that in order to beat either of them, perfection is usually required. I've seen both of these guys play near-perfect for very long stretches.
I don't know about being a monster but a few bits of advice I think are important.
Go for the breakouts early... in case it doesn't work out you have other options.
I see a lot of guys run racks and set up their breakout shots at the end of the run, if they miss it they screw themselves and leave their opponent a wide open set of balls.
If you can't run out... don't try.
Be honest about your chances of running out... a well played safety wins games.
Go for the breakouts early... in case it doesn't work out you have other options.
I see a lot of guys run racks and set up their breakout shots at the end of the run, if they miss it they screw themselves and leave their opponent a wide open set of balls.
If you can't run out... don't try.
Be honest about your chances of running out... a well played safety wins games.
Jude I extremeley agree about the needing of getting better.Just not wanting to waiste my time on practicing skills that I could use that time for something more relevant.My skill level was a six but I started backup recently and can beat the 6's and half the 7's I see in my area.But this isnt a huge pond.Scott I agree about picking the right set.I see it all the time.
oldschool2791...Reread my post. Picking your side is down the list a ways from what's most important.
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Then I would focus on shot selection. In 8ball, selecting the best pattern is often the most important thing. In situations where one player has pocketed all of his group and the other has his entire group remaining on the table, shot selection is less important (for both players) but minus these, the way to effectively move through a rack has more to do with knowing which shots to take than great shot-making or cue-ball movement.
8 ball
Knowing how to break out clusters is important.
I would not classify 8 ball liability as number 1, because usually one or more of your group balls is usually near the 8. Also, if you have good cue ball control, you can usually get on the 8.
One of my pet peeves is that I do not shoot what I call 'no future' shots, in other words what good does it do you to make a shot, and not have any shot after that, plus even if you attempt a shot on the ball after, it will end up selling out. I, will instead, opt for a safety, a tie up, or a leave that will put the table back to my advantage, and especially when their are only 2 balls of your group left. Knowing your opponent skill level helps in these situations.
1) Evaluating the layout after the break.
2) Breaking good. Although this is important, I have found in some instances, I prefer to have the balls tied up a little, even if playing someone on my skill level or even better, because I have experience over them, usually, in breaking up clusters, to the point that I think I must have a more complex mind than they do.
3) Knowing how to shoot the shot to break up a cluster.
4) Knowing when to shoot a ball or play a safety.
5) Kicking. If you can not kick and hit a ball with 4 rails, you need to practice some more.
6) Banking. I have played so many players that were good open shooters, but couldn't bank worth a shit. Love those guys, I will leave them a hard bank everytime. And even if they can bank a little, they usually are not good on bank shots of more than 1 rail. They usually don't kick very well either. I can not stress enough how important banking skills are in Pool. When I practice, 90% of my practice is devoted to banking. You have to stay 'tuned up' in your banking skills.
I must admit that I have a little sadistic streak, because I will evaluate a player, spot his weaknesses, and play to his weaknesses in the game. I like to show my opponents what they need to practice on.
Oh, and one other thing, you ever play guys that always take solids after the break, no matter the table layout... I love those guys too.
Knowing how to break out clusters is important.
I would not classify 8 ball liability as number 1, because usually one or more of your group balls is usually near the 8. Also, if you have good cue ball control, you can usually get on the 8.
One of my pet peeves is that I do not shoot what I call 'no future' shots, in other words what good does it do you to make a shot, and not have any shot after that, plus even if you attempt a shot on the ball after, it will end up selling out. I, will instead, opt for a safety, a tie up, or a leave that will put the table back to my advantage, and especially when their are only 2 balls of your group left. Knowing your opponent skill level helps in these situations.
1) Evaluating the layout after the break.
2) Breaking good. Although this is important, I have found in some instances, I prefer to have the balls tied up a little, even if playing someone on my skill level or even better, because I have experience over them, usually, in breaking up clusters, to the point that I think I must have a more complex mind than they do.
3) Knowing how to shoot the shot to break up a cluster.
4) Knowing when to shoot a ball or play a safety.
5) Kicking. If you can not kick and hit a ball with 4 rails, you need to practice some more.
6) Banking. I have played so many players that were good open shooters, but couldn't bank worth a shit. Love those guys, I will leave them a hard bank everytime. And even if they can bank a little, they usually are not good on bank shots of more than 1 rail. They usually don't kick very well either. I can not stress enough how important banking skills are in Pool. When I practice, 90% of my practice is devoted to banking. You have to stay 'tuned up' in your banking skills.
I must admit that I have a little sadistic streak, because I will evaluate a player, spot his weaknesses, and play to his weaknesses in the game. I like to show my opponents what they need to practice on.
Oh, and one other thing, you ever play guys that always take solids after the break, no matter the table layout... I love those guys too.
to work on cluster work I have started practicing 14.1,for defense Ive tried to make most problem balls 2 way shots so if it works I continue if I miss they are safed,but also the problem is worked out before 1-2 of my balls are gone.
Except for the two instances above, this seems to be a pretty thorough list and will get the OP pretty far. But I will point out that each of those items also apply equally as important to the big tables.
Scott Lee referenced it best about the 8 ball. The 2 most important things to evaluate after the break are the 8 ball and the potential key balls. If you do this poorly, you run a huge risk of removing most of your balls from the table, and getting out of line late in your run, then you are an absolute dog to win the game.
My problem on the box is that the Valleys in the bar are much looser than my Diamond. Shots that go at the bar don't go at home. Shots that don't go at home mean I am less likely to try them at the bar (they don't go) and less likely to recognize the shit shot that will go when I lay down a safety. The precision of the Diamond seems to have a detrimental effect on my play on a generous bar table.
ThatswhatIwasthininkingThishappenssomuchthatIcantunderstandmanyofthesepostshereParagraphsaresoimportantwhenposting.
If you really want to learn how to play 8 ball well, go order the 8 Ball Bible RIGHT NOW. This is the best book ever on shootding 8 ball on a bar box. The concepts even apply to playing on a big table.
IMHO the pros take a long time looking at the layout of the table at first. Then, once they have decided what to do, they shoot the balls all in, or figure out a way to play some lockup safes that also give them an advantage.