scott frost's windmill wind up makes me dizzy.
Who has the worst fundamentals?
- Thread starter poolnoob
- Start date
scott frost's windmill wind up makes me dizzy.
This thread cracks me up! 
Granted, my stroke is Hopkins-esque, so I'm a little one-sided here. I don't get through the ball as cleanly. All things considered....I think Allens stroke is pure as can be....with all the "junk" removed, and just only what you need to get the job done.....not to mention hold the World 9ball, and 14.1 titles in the same year, and be one of the most ducked road agents of all time.
Seriously? Ortman?....are you HIGH! you need to go watch his run on you tube back when he was a kid......350 some odd balls of pure straight pool perfection....M'F'in FEARLESS! We should all be so lucky to have that ugly stroke
Quake?......I started playing pool at 6 or 7 and grew up with the exact same sidearm deal......got rid of it ....maybe sadly 3 years ago. Direct quote from Allen Hopkins....."Kiether gets through the ball as cleanly as any player that ever lived....just watch the last stroke"......He said that 2 years ago at the Expo while having beers with us.
I dunno....I guess it's better to look good then to play good. Sounds like a t-shirt quote.
I talked to a few coaches before re-tooling my stroke. The basic deal is not what it looks like, but can you repeat it EVERY time!
Who knows? maybe if we all tried to copy the "ugly strokes" we might just stuble on to something that takes us to the next level, something you might never find with the "proven" fundamentals.
G.
Granted, my stroke is Hopkins-esque, so I'm a little one-sided here. I don't get through the ball as cleanly. All things considered....I think Allens stroke is pure as can be....with all the "junk" removed, and just only what you need to get the job done.....not to mention hold the World 9ball, and 14.1 titles in the same year, and be one of the most ducked road agents of all time.
Seriously? Ortman?....are you HIGH! you need to go watch his run on you tube back when he was a kid......350 some odd balls of pure straight pool perfection....M'F'in FEARLESS! We should all be so lucky to have that ugly stroke
Quake?......I started playing pool at 6 or 7 and grew up with the exact same sidearm deal......got rid of it ....maybe sadly 3 years ago. Direct quote from Allen Hopkins....."Kiether gets through the ball as cleanly as any player that ever lived....just watch the last stroke"......He said that 2 years ago at the Expo while having beers with us.
I dunno....I guess it's better to look good then to play good. Sounds like a t-shirt quote.
I talked to a few coaches before re-tooling my stroke. The basic deal is not what it looks like, but can you repeat it EVERY time!
Who knows? maybe if we all tried to copy the "ugly strokes" we might just stuble on to something that takes us to the next level, something you might never find with the "proven" fundamentals.
G.
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The late Tony Ellin. RIP
This thread cracks me up!
Granted, my stroke is Hopkins-esque, so I'm a little one-sided here. I don't get through the ball as cleanly. All things considered....I think Allens stroke is pure as can be....with all the "junk" removed, and just only what you need to get the job done.....not to mention hold the World 9ball, and 14.1 titles in the same year, and be one of the most ducked road agents of all time.
Seriously? Ortman?....are you HIGH! you need to go watch his run on you tube back when he was a kid......350 some odd balls of pure straight pool perfection....M'F'in FEARLESS! We should all be so lucky to have that ugly stroke
Quake?......I started playing pool at 6 or 7 and grew up with the exact same sidearm deal......got rid of it ....maybe sadly 3 years ago. Direct quote from Allen Hopkins....."Kiether gets through the ball as cleanly as any player that ever lived....just watch the last stroke"......He said that 2 years ago at the Expo while having beers with us.
I dunno....I guess it's better to look good then to play good. Sounds like a t-shirt quote.
I talked to a few coaches before re-tooling my stroke. The basic deal is not what it looks like, but can you repeat it EVERY time!
Who knows? maybe if we all tried to copy the "ugly strokes" we might just stuble on to something that takes us to the next level, something you might never find with the "proven" fundamentals.
G.
Is Ortmann's technique something you would teach a student?
the only thing I teach is this......if what you are doing is putting the ball in the hole consistently, then keep doing it. What you might be forgetting is even though someones stroke might look funny to you.....to them it feels perfectly natural. Which is probably why the more accomplished the player, the harder it is to adjust to anything new in your game.
How many people here in the states had a stroke like the Phillipinos BEFORE they invaded?......few to none I would say. How many have it now? It's because they saw a new way of doing it that just might be unusual, but damn good! Same thing goes for players putting thier chin on the cue. Not many players did that back in the day, but maybe after seeing some of the Euro/snooker players they figured they would try it, and it works for some people.
If we all did it the same way forever, the game would never evolve IMO. The road less traveled......right?
G.
Sorry, I don't know how to interpret that.
Was your answer yes or no?
Would you say that up and down movement of the cue is a good way of learning pool? Is the style itself good, or does the player make it seem good?
Was your answer yes or no?
Would you say that up and down movement of the cue is a good way of learning pool? Is the style itself good, or does the player make it seem good?
I think the whole point of this thread is to discuss and marvel over how some players have achieved bigtime success while employing what most would consider terrible fundamentals. Whether it be Paez with his jack-in-the-box jump-up and side-sweeping cue, or Django's locomotion, Mike Davis's sawstroke, or Keith's sideways arm; these are all pretty much in conflict with what we have been taught was the "right way" to shoot pool. You know, stay down on the shot and have an absolutely quiet pendulum.
As Jay pointed out, it's funny how the guys we consider to have the worst of the worst fundamentals could be an all-star pool lineup.
I don't think anyone here is condemning any of these players for their odd habits at the table, just that it's ironic how successful they can be despite their unusual strokes. I certainly don't condemn them - I'm honestly amazed by it.
Yep, the bottom line is whether or not you're potting balls. Everything else is an aside. :thumbup:
Best,
Brian kc
As Jay pointed out, it's funny how the guys we consider to have the worst of the worst fundamentals could be an all-star pool lineup.
I don't think anyone here is condemning any of these players for their odd habits at the table, just that it's ironic how successful they can be despite their unusual strokes. I certainly don't condemn them - I'm honestly amazed by it.
Yep, the bottom line is whether or not you're potting balls. Everything else is an aside. :thumbup:
Best,
Brian kc
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ME!
lol. i have a weird strokeand i marvel i can make a ball sometimes
lol. i have a weird strokeand i marvel i can make a ball sometimes
Talk about bad fundamentals, check out Charles Barkley at a golf tournament: Golf Swing. :grin-square:
I'm very familiar with it!!
He recently had a show on the golf channel with one of the best instructors (Hank) in the game. Tiger's old coach.....Barkely was beyond help!!
I watched every show.
Charles B. used to be a good golfer a few yrs back. It's all mental, in his case.
Charles and M. Jordan. used to bet it up on the course.
there is no "seems good" ....there is only pocketing the ball with shape or not. All I'm saying is there is no one perfect way to play or learn the game. If "different" didn't work.....every great player would have the same style.....which we know is the exact opposite of the truth. Come to think of it....there are more great players with unorthodox styles then not.
Now, if you are talking about taking a first time banger and molding
theminto a player?....yes I would guide them towards the path of the accepted "proper" way to play, but this thread was a jab at "unorthodox" strokes IMO
But my point is, why would you teach the accepted way when the majority of pros use unorthodox styles.
The problem starts with respect. How dare we to criticise the fundamentals of Keith, Ortmann and Bustamante? "The pros are so great that they must have flawless fundamentals." But this pro X moves his cue up and down, and his arm is all over the place. "Yeah, but at the moment his cue contacts the white, his stroke is straight and flawless." You didn't say that, but I've heard this a countless number of times. And it is false. There are many pros who don't move their cue on a straight line. I don't care how many balls they can run in 14.1. Not moving the cue straight is a flaw, unless we are willing to change our views and say it doesn't matter whether you move your cue straight or not.
The problem starts with respect. How dare we to criticise the fundamentals of Keith, Ortmann and Bustamante? "The pros are so great that they must have flawless fundamentals." But this pro X moves his cue up and down, and his arm is all over the place. "Yeah, but at the moment his cue contacts the white, his stroke is straight and flawless." You didn't say that, but I've heard this a countless number of times. And it is false. There are many pros who don't move their cue on a straight line. I don't care how many balls they can run in 14.1. Not moving the cue straight is a flaw, unless we are willing to change our views and say it doesn't matter whether you move your cue straight or not.