i have been only using DHL and FedEx ever since, DHL more often now as it is a bit lower in rates and much faster by experience. these couriers have never failed us - not even once. :smile: for lower value declaration on commercial invoice, customer is aware of the accountability in case anything unfortunate arises.
Who is responsible --- for items not received
- Thread starter Pool Player 101
- Start date
yes "buyer"... looks like I confused myself just a lil bit.
Bull Shit....ups cannot call usps and ask for address information over the phone and its illegal for the postal service to provide that info. A request can be made by sending a post card with the screwed up address to the postal service and hope that they forward it to the customer it belongs to but they are under no obligation to correct ups error's...and if they do ups will charge the shipper 10.00 for sending it to the wrong address which is the shippers problem.
I have sent several cues to Europe and Canada. Everytime the buyer wanted me to delcare a much lower value on the cue. I told them I could only insure it then for the declared value and they all agreed to it via a PM. I keep the PMs until the receive the cue and so far everything has been fine but if it a cue did get damaged its at their cost and they all clearly understood the risk.
One more point for thought, unless an item is getting lost in transit, it should not get damaged at all if it's packed well.
Yes, cues can get warped because of weather conditions during air transport but it'll hardly the case on well constructed cues such as most custom cues that are sold here.
I bought a few cues from fellow AZ's and they all packed the cues really nice, cues came in as described without a flaw and trust me when I say that the local post/ups/fedex workers over here are not the most gentles people I've met in my life.
So nothing can be done in case for lost goods besides suing the declared value but when it comes to damage control, pack it well my friends :grin:
Yes, cues can get warped because of weather conditions during air transport but it'll hardly the case on well constructed cues such as most custom cues that are sold here.
I bought a few cues from fellow AZ's and they all packed the cues really nice, cues came in as described without a flaw and trust me when I say that the local post/ups/fedex workers over here are not the most gentles people I've met in my life.
So nothing can be done in case for lost goods besides suing the declared value but when it comes to damage control, pack it well my friends :grin:
seller is responsible for delivery of the merchandise in perfect condition.
if the buyer agrees in writing to take full responsibility in case of problems then it can be transferred to him.
no seller should send anything without a return signature required unless he is willing to resend another product at his expense based on the buyers word. since it will tarnish his reputation no matter what happens if the goods are lost.
if the buyer agrees in writing to take full responsibility in case of problems then it can be transferred to him.
no seller should send anything without a return signature required unless he is willing to resend another product at his expense based on the buyers word. since it will tarnish his reputation no matter what happens if the goods are lost.
Should not even have to be discussed
How is this a question or a discussion?
The seller is responsible unless there has been some negotiation and agreement between the two about the shipping costs, currier, ect.... and still even then the seller needs to supply some sort of proof of shipment, if you are selling something always protect yourself, its usually only a couple bucks for insurance.
Nate.
How is this a question or a discussion?
The seller is responsible unless there has been some negotiation and agreement between the two about the shipping costs, currier, ect.... and still even then the seller needs to supply some sort of proof of shipment, if you are selling something always protect yourself, its usually only a couple bucks for insurance.
Nate.
Always!! purchase shipping/delivery confirmation $.80
Who is responsible for making sure you have something for sale before you post in the for sale section.
We are. Please Guys don't make it Daves job.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=129013
Now as far as your question, You can never A$$ U ME
Seller is always responsible for proving it was shipped.
I use usps delivery confirmation it is only $.80. DC system has gotten much more complete in tracking your package along the way and its arrival.
I insure anything over $75. I would suggest using Signature required on high ticket items.
Who is responsible for making sure you have something for sale before you post in the for sale section.
We are. Please Guys don't make it Daves job.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=129013
Now as far as your question, You can never A$$ U ME
Seller is always responsible for proving it was shipped.
I use usps delivery confirmation it is only $.80. DC system has gotten much more complete in tracking your package along the way and its arrival.
I insure anything over $75. I would suggest using Signature required on high ticket items.
I don't know one way or the other, that is what I was told by Bell Forest. I don't think I like your opening tone, it appears as if you're calling me a liar.
You can read the following and explain what this means perhaps:
These are the notes that UPS has on the package:
THE UPS INITIATED DELIVERY INTERCEPT REQUEST FOR THIS PACKAGE WAS SUCCESSFULLY COMPLETED
THE ADDRESS HAS BEEN CORRECTED. THE DELIVERY HAS BEEN RESCHEDULED
TULSA, OK, US
10/20/2009
9:32 PM
DESTINATION SCAN
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/20/2009
8:00 PM
THE UPS INITIATED DELIVERY INTERCEPT REQUEST FOR THIS PACKAGE WAS SUCCESSFULLY COMPLETED / THE ADDRESS HAS BEEN CORRECTED. THE DELIVERY HAS BEEN RESCHEDULED
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/20/2009
1:34 PM
TRACER REQUEST / LOST PACKAGE TRACER
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/20/2009
12:36 PM
UPS HAS REQUESTED A DELIVERY INTERCEPT FOR THIS PACKAGE / DELIVERY TO AN ALTERNATE ADDRESS WAS REQUESTED
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/19/2009
6:48 PM
DELIVERY
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/19/2009
6:44 AM
OUT FOR DELIVERY
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/19/2009
6:44 AM
POST OFFICE BOX ADDRESS. UPS IS ATTEMPTING TO OBTAIN AN ADDRESS TO WHICH DELIVERY CAN BE MADE, NOT DELIVERED / THE ADDRESS HAS BEEN CORRECTED. THE DELIVERY HAS BEEN RESCHEDULED
<image001.gif>
<image002.gif>
10/19/2009
3:32 AM
OUT FOR DELIVERY
I asked the UPS rep where they got the Broken Arrow address, and he told me it was from the postal service so you may want to contact the post office there in Tulsa to see if their records are correct. Here is the address they dropped it off at originally:
.... . IRONWOOD PL
BROKEN ARROW, OK 74012
It looks like it was successfully picked back up and is now on it’s way to you. If I hear anything else on it, I will let you know. If you don’t receive it in the next day or two, please let me know. Again, thank you for your patience and understanding with this delay.
I have received the package as of yesterday and the seller took care of everything like they were supposed to. Kudos to the guys at Bell Forest, especially Cory.
I have one now that was shipped , With Tracking , and the PO say it is on the truck for delivery, it does not say delivered only on truck for delivery. Customer asked his PO , and only reply was " we know notheing about it." I would ask PO "why the Hell you notheing. " Customer is getting quite Rude with my wife now. Don't know what is next, I'm out of town a lot, and find this has been going on now for a couple weeks. ???????? Jim
I would never fault a buyer for an item not received, the price of insurance and delivery confirmation are included in the sale price of any item I sell. In my opinion in any transaction if the buyer never receives an item the seller is responsible, so the best way to cover your ass is to include insurance and tracking in any transaction.
JIMO
It sounds like you have never lost anything. Using USPS if something gets lost it is like 3 months before you can even file a claim and like 9 months before you get any payment if you ever do. The USPS insurance is pretty much worthless. It is more of a scam then anything else. They never want to pay.
I have not had that experience with claims inside the USA, it did take a month but my claim was taken care of. However, I would never use USPS for shipment outside of the USA, and that includes Canada, I had a very bad experience shipping to our Northern neighbors that cost me a couple of thousand dollars!!!!
The seller is responsible for the goods until they are in the buyers hands. The goods belong to the seller until such time and it is the seller that initiates the shipment with the shipping company. As such the transaction to deliver is between the seller and the shipping company. Therefore the burden to insure the shipment is on the seller and not the buyer. This is not an opt-out type of situation simply because of the nature of the transaction.
There are many many things that can go wrong to prevent the buyer from receiving the goods. In the past 20 years I have seen them all. The burden of proof is all on the seller to prove that they shipped the package. At that point the package can be lost, stolen, delivered to the wrong place and simply left with no signature, or the buyer can even get the package and claim he didn't get it.
So that brings up the next point - what is the downside?
Reputation. When a seller sells something then his whole reputation resides in that sale. He takes money and has both the money and the product. IF the product does not reach the buyer then he should be obligated to give the money back. But then he is out the product as well so where will he get the money for the lost product?
From the shipping company. It's that simple. The seller should cover himself by insuring EVERY PACKAGE ALL THE TIME NO MATTER WHAT. It's a small price to pay and a smart seller factors it into the price he is charging and makes it invisible to the customer.
That way the reputation of the seller remains intact with no argument, no hand wringing, no back and forth with the customer about responsibility.
The seller handles it all with the shipping company, they make restitution - everyone's happy.
In 20 years I have had probably more than 20 claims and in just about every case the shipping company paid off with no fuss.
That's just my opinion on the matter and the way I handle my business. I have seen UPS leave a box sitting out on the hot Florida sand leaning against a gate which contained $20,000 in cues and had tape all over it that said "Adult Signature Required". The box was fully insured. - the driver signed for it himself and left it at the gate. Not even inside the fence. This happened to me with a shipment of very high end Blue Book featured cues on a shipment out of California to Florida sent next day air early am.
The point is that the onus of delivery is on the seller. He contracts an agent to carry out the delivery. While he might be able to get away with possibly shifting responsibility to the buyer by giving them the option to pay more for insurance or forgo it I believe that morally and ethically the seller should carry 100% of the responsibility for getting the product to the buyer. Anytime the product is lost in transit or for whatever reason does not get to the buyer then the seller and his shipping agent are responsible for it. IMO.
John Barton
www.jbcases.com
There are many many things that can go wrong to prevent the buyer from receiving the goods. In the past 20 years I have seen them all. The burden of proof is all on the seller to prove that they shipped the package. At that point the package can be lost, stolen, delivered to the wrong place and simply left with no signature, or the buyer can even get the package and claim he didn't get it.
So that brings up the next point - what is the downside?
Reputation. When a seller sells something then his whole reputation resides in that sale. He takes money and has both the money and the product. IF the product does not reach the buyer then he should be obligated to give the money back. But then he is out the product as well so where will he get the money for the lost product?
From the shipping company. It's that simple. The seller should cover himself by insuring EVERY PACKAGE ALL THE TIME NO MATTER WHAT. It's a small price to pay and a smart seller factors it into the price he is charging and makes it invisible to the customer.
That way the reputation of the seller remains intact with no argument, no hand wringing, no back and forth with the customer about responsibility.
The seller handles it all with the shipping company, they make restitution - everyone's happy.
In 20 years I have had probably more than 20 claims and in just about every case the shipping company paid off with no fuss.
That's just my opinion on the matter and the way I handle my business. I have seen UPS leave a box sitting out on the hot Florida sand leaning against a gate which contained $20,000 in cues and had tape all over it that said "Adult Signature Required". The box was fully insured. - the driver signed for it himself and left it at the gate. Not even inside the fence. This happened to me with a shipment of very high end Blue Book featured cues on a shipment out of California to Florida sent next day air early am.
The point is that the onus of delivery is on the seller. He contracts an agent to carry out the delivery. While he might be able to get away with possibly shifting responsibility to the buyer by giving them the option to pay more for insurance or forgo it I believe that morally and ethically the seller should carry 100% of the responsibility for getting the product to the buyer. Anytime the product is lost in transit or for whatever reason does not get to the buyer then the seller and his shipping agent are responsible for it. IMO.
John Barton
www.jbcases.com
Chock Full
This thread is one of the best I've read on here.
Discussions like this one can only make the board a better economy for everyone, buyers and sellers. Lots of good info in this one.
Thanks Guys!
FTR, I believe you should just require insurance. Everything is insured, period. It's an easy and smart upgrade imo.
Ray
This thread is one of the best I've read on here.
Discussions like this one can only make the board a better economy for everyone, buyers and sellers. Lots of good info in this one.
Thanks Guys!
FTR, I believe you should just require insurance. Everything is insured, period. It's an easy and smart upgrade imo.
Ray