why are most custom cues not steel jointed?

The majority of top players, play with a steel joint, and the vast majority of top builders primarily use steel joints. It's been this way forever, and will remain so forever, and for good reason. I laugh at people that say steel jointed cues play dead, they've obviously never played with a good one. If you want a cue with all the feel, and without all the vibration, a steel joint is your best bet. I'm sure George Balabushka, Gus Szamboti, and many other master builders would've used phenolic, and wood to wood joints if they thought they played as good as steel jointed ones;)

Can anyone tell me what joint is primarily used by Barry, Tasc, Herceck, and the other top ten builders?:p
 
A great percentage of players who are fortunate enough to have played with cues from numerous world-class builders continue to say that the best hitting cues they have ever played with are Balabushkas and Szambotis.

To my knowledge, the vast majority of cues made by those individuals were made with SS joints and 5/16-14 pins.
 
once again its a personal opinion

i have a josswest ss joint that has been setting not screwed together, accept for show, in the last 5 years, i also played many times with my buddies ss joint tad, but yet i still DO NOT LIKE SS JOINTS.
 
This almost gets comical at times.
The same topic, steel jointed vs everything else, has been debated to death 100s of times.
Does anything really get decided??? No, just a bunch of posters giving their 'knowledgeable' opinions.
Guess what all these knowledgeable opinions are worth??? They are opinions and nothing more.
"Well, you should play with this builder's cue" or "you should try this joint because so & so built
their cues this way and they are legendary Masters". You know what??? Who cares.
To quote one of our more contemporary Masters; "A cue is nothing more than a tool for moving balls around the table".
Anyone thinking that one type of joint over another will magically improve that tool's function is only
fooling themselves and is certainly welcome to their delusion.

I don't want to build Showman cues, I don't want to build Searing cues, I don't want to build Gus' or George's cues either.
Frankly, I don't care how they build/built their cues. They're their cues, not mine.
I'm not at all interested in replicating the past. It's already happened and now it's time to move on.
If one type of joint were actually proven to better than another, don't you think that ALL cues would be built that way???

What it comes down to is a matter of 'feel' not 'function'. Are you honestly going to sit there and suggest
that I should appreciate what you feel more than what I feel??? Are you insane or just bull-headed???

BTW, anyone heard of these SouthWest cues??? What were they thinking???


KJ
 
KJ Cues said:
Anyone thinking that one type of joint over another will magically improve that tool's function is only
fooling themselves.........


KJ
Click to expand...

This makes the most sense of anything I've read in this thread! I've played with almost every style joint used in cues and I'm an above average player and I can't see where one type of joint over another makes any difference in my game. I personally like a 5/16x14 piloted SS jointed cue and I have had the chance to play with piloted ivory (which I like a lot), wood to wood, phenolic flat faced, ivory flat faced, etc and I can't deny they may have a different sound or slight vibration difference but none of them helped me move they cue ball around any better than the other joint styles. This is just my opinion and the next experienced player may not agree with me!

James
 
Some like stainless joints and some do not like them. I don't care for the overall hit of a standard stainless joint personally and I think I am in at least a slight majority on that one. Stainless joints made life easier for most cuemakers. Matching a second shaft to a stainless joint is a breeze with traditional methods. You can even face the shaft off between centers on a piloted joint shaft. But since the introduction of carbide sanding mandrels, people can now match second shafts up to the cue easy enough on other types of joints, so the stainless joint ease of construction advantage is no longer a real benefit to the builder.
 
HawaiianEye said:
A great percentage of players who are fortunate enough to have played with cues from numerous world-class builders continue to say that the best hitting cues they have ever played with are Balabushkas and Szambotis.

To my knowledge, the vast majority of cues made by those individuals were made with SS joints and 5/16-14 pins.
Click to expand...

Hi,

I agree with you concerning the steel joint. I believe that these steel jointed cues hit very good to a player because they have extra weight in the nose. Once the shaft is faced to the butt securely the difference is mass at 29" on the x. The threads are insignificant once it is faced and tensioned, IMO.

As for the old Bushkas and Szambotis', they are cues from a bygone era and cue making methods and techniques were held close to the vest in those days.

IMO, there are hundreds of cue makers today that are making cues that are far superior to these old masters only because of the wide spread cue making information and the newer glue technologies, ect, ect, ect.

These Guys like Harvey, Herman, George, Gus were pioneers in their field and inspired others to take the ball and run with it. I know there are a lot of people who will disagree but there are no mystical secrets they took with them to the grave.

Look at it this way, Miles Davis and Dizzy would not have moved the Jazz trumpet improvisation levels to Bebop and the Cool sound if it were not for a dude named Louis Armstrong. We owe a lot to these guys as they set a standard. Standards are always changing because man is a tinkerer and is always striving for a better solution.

So it goes in any discipline, there is always a natural progression and improvement to aspire to. Thank god for these great masters for leading the way.

Rick
 
Easier?

cueman said:
Some like stainless joints and some do not like them. I don't care for the overall hit of a standard stainless joint personally and I think I am in at least a slight majority on that one. Stainless joints made life easier for most cuemakers. Matching a second shaft to a stainless joint is a breeze with traditional methods. You can even face the shaft off between centers on a piloted joint shaft. But since the introduction of carbide sanding mandrels, people can now match second shafts up to the cue easy enough on other types of joints, so the stainless joint ease of construction advantage is no longer a real benefit to the builder.
Click to expand...

I suppose that is why almost all of the first tier of top level cue makers use or used stainless. They like shortcuts. I should have guessed.

Funny, but for myself I find just the opposite to be true. A perfectly fitted cue with two compression fitted shafts going into an internally and externally polished stainless steel joint takes a lot more work, time, skill, materials, and tooling than a simple flat faced joint. It's not even remotely close.

As far as carbide mandrels, some makers don't need or use them and you don't sand shafts to size using the steel joint collar as a mandrel unless you're sizing your shafts with 800 grit or finer.
 
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