Why is Efren the best?

[ShootingArts]

not really

I think of natural ability, or talent if you will, as defining the limit of one's abilities. Not everyone realizes their full potential, and clearly Efren has realized a great deal of his potential. But you have to have the potential to begin with--if you didn't, you could never have gotten that good. And natural ability is what delineates the boundary of our potential.

Natural ability doesn't really define our limits. As a quick example, I have bettered a world aggregate record with a rifle. It had nothing at all to do with natural ability, everything to do with acquired knowledge, acquired skills, and perfectly tuned equipment. There may be hundreds of thousands of people out there with as much natural ability as Efren, or he may be unique. It is easy to say that he is unique in his natural gifts but I do think that is taking the easy way out for those of us who haven't equaled him.

I doubt there was anything magical about Efren physically or in the way his thought process worked when he started playing pool. Obviously the total package has developed into something awesome. However I would bet there are thousands of nine year olds out there today with the same potential that he had at nine, maybe even more potential considering he almost certainly was a product of poor and improper nutrition from conception.

Secretariat was a mutant, a freak, a sport. This simply means a one off. Because he was a physical freak with a healthy heart far larger than normal not a product of breeding, his performance in the breeding barn never came close to his performance on the track. Many seem to think that Efren is a similar freak of nature. Although this is possible, I doubt it. Looking over the little bit of his life history I know reveals that he did not spring full blown onto the pool scene. He put many years of development into the phenomenon that he has became. I strongly suspect that those saying that he has a natural gift above and beyond all others are selling him short by not fully acknowledging heart, hard work, dedication, and love of the game.

Hu

 

[The Beginner]

The reason why efren is good because he dreams about pool

 

[sjm]

Natural ability doesn't really define our limits. As a quick example, I have bettered a world aggregate record with a rifle. It had nothing at all to do with natural ability, everything to do with acquired knowledge, acquired skills, and perfectly tuned equipment. There may be hundreds of thousands of people out there with as much natural ability as Efren, or he may be unique. It is easy to say that he is unique in his natural gifts but I do think that is taking the easy way out for those of us who haven't equaled him.

I doubt there was anything magical about Efren physically or in the way his thought process worked when he started playing pool. Obviously the total package has developed into something awesome. However I would bet there are thousands of nine year olds out there today with the same potential that he had at nine, maybe even more potential considering he almost certainly was a product of poor and improper nutrition from conception.

Secretariat was a mutant, a freak, a sport. This simply means a one off. Because he was a physical freak with a healthy heart far larger than normal not a product of breeding, his performance in the breeding barn never came close to his performance on the track. Many seem to think that Efren is a similar freak of nature. Although this is possible, I doubt it. Looking over the little bit of his life history I know reveals that he did not spring full blown onto the pool scene. He put many years of development into the phenomenon that he has became. I strongly suspect that those saying that he has a natural gift above and beyond all others are selling him short by not fully acknowledging heart, hard work, dedication, and love of the game.

Hu

Great post.

 

[PoolBum]

Natural ability doesn't really define our limits. As a quick example, I have bettered a world aggregate record with a rifle. It had nothing at all to do with natural ability, everything to do with acquired knowledge, acquired skills, and perfectly tuned equipment.

Secretariat was a mutant, a freak, a sport. This simply means a one off. Because he was a physical freak with a healthy heart far larger than normal not a product of breeding, his performance in the breeding barn never came close to his performance on the track. Many seem to think that Efren is a similar freak of nature. Although this is possible, I doubt it. Looking over the little bit of his life history I know reveals that he did not spring full blown onto the pool scene. He put many years of development into the phenomenon that he has became. I strongly suspect that those saying that he has a natural gift above and beyond all others are selling him short by not fully acknowledging heart, hard work, dedication, and love of the game.

Hu

I think we are using the term "natural ability" differently. The way I am using the term, you cannot do what is beyond your natural ability. This does not mean that you will reach the limits of your natural ability, as reaching your potential requires much more than just natural talent. But it does mean that you cannot accomplish what is beyond your potential in the first place.

Secretariat had more than just physical talent or natural ability as well--he seemed perfectly attuned psychologically to the world of thoroughbred racing and competition. He was an incredibly smart horse, as William Nack and others have attested to. This incredible combination of attributes all contributed to his amazing workouts which were legendary, and which prepared him for his race day performances. Still, it was not within his natural ability to be able to run a mile and a half on dirt in, say, under two minutes. There is a limit to one's natural ability, and although we can never say precisely what that limit is, we can with assurance point to some accomplishments that we know are beyond it.

I would say that you had to have the natural ability or potential to compete for that world record with a rifle, although it took a lot more--by way of acquiring knowledge, developing skills, and having access to perfectly attuned equipment--than just potential, to actually accomplish.

Also, the way I am using the term "natural ability" does not mean that Efren has more natural ability than everyone else, or that I attribute his success solely to his natural ability. Far from it. I'm just saying that you can't get there if you don't have the natural ability, or potential, in the first place. This seems like a truism to me.

 

[jeffwinters]

double post, sorry....

 

[jeffwinters]

Efren might have said that he peaked during his 20's but i believed that after another 30 or more years of playing pool, he would and could only get better. He might not have realized that yet, how can your skills decline when you only practice pool all the time? Maybe age is catching up on him, but i can still see him dominating the pool scene maybe for the next 4-7 years...

very hopeful to see him play competitive pool longer, i love and appreciate his games....

 

[JoeyInCali]

That's a very good point. A good local player in Chicago made the comment once that Efren didn't look that tough but once he was involved in a match with him he said he totally drained him mentally and physically.
He said he couldn't believe the pressure he had to deal with. I think your comment explains this. Philw

You mean like Tony Chohan missing his winning ball against Efren at DCC last year?
Then Efren stole the match.
The best I saw Efren was back in his smoking days in the mid 90's. He would give local hotshots the orange crush or someone like Jerry Brunsetter the 5-ball and the breaks. Jerry gets on the hill with Efren needing 4 games. Suddenly Jerry can't make anything in the breaks and Efren just ran out each rack without getting nervous.

 

[iralee]

balkline

Personally, I believe one major reason is because none of Efren's competitors have exposure to balkline billiards, a carom game that trains the speed control of three balls simultaneously - every millimeter matters. Anyone who's ever seen this game practiced at a high level will understand exactly what I'm talking about.

Most of his competition doesn't even know what the game is, never mind play it - and to their detriment. 18.2 balkline, one of the oldest forms of carom, happens to be one of Efren's favorite games.

 

[ShootingArts]

"natural ability" recapped

I would say that you had to have the natural ability or potential to compete for that world record with a rifle, although it took a lot more--by way of acquiring knowledge, developing skills, and having access to perfectly attuned equipment--than just potential, to actually accomplish.

Also, the way I am using the term "natural ability" does not mean that Efren has more natural ability than everyone else, or that I attribute his success solely to his natural ability. Far from it. I'm just saying that you can't get there if you don't have the natural ability, or potential, in the first place. This seems like a truism to me.

I agree with what you are saying, that is if you realize that well over fifty percent of the people in the world have the natural abilities needed to better a world record with a rifle. Few will, but it won't be because of the limitations of natural abilities. Likewise I believe in all likelihood many out there have the same or greater natural abilities to play pool than Efren.

A percentage in the world is of course impossible to guess at but I believe that at least one in twenty have as much natural talent. The percentages could be far higher. Even if you felt that only one in a million had that much natural talent there would still be thousands of Efrens worldwide. Either he is truly a freak or much more than natural talent created Efren the player with natural talent playing a comparatively minor role. That is what I am trying to say in my posts, it is very unlikely that superior natural gifts are the defining factor in Efren's game making his achievements even more outstanding in my mind.

Hu

(a little clarification concerning my shooting for those interested)
I didn't set a world record myself. I shot better than the record, and did it at the legal distance, with legal equipment, within legal timeframes, and firing into legal target tag.(paper) I very significantly bettered the world record making measuring error great enough to account for my group sizes extremely unlikely. However I didn't do it in a registered match so officially it didn't happen. I bettered the record just like several are reported to have bettered Willie Mosconi's but like them I don't hold the record and never have. Several others are reported to have bettered the rifle world record too but a friend, Jef Fowler, did it when it counted and his official record has stood for several decades.

 

[Hail Mary Shot]

Most of you guys wonder why Efren's opponents somewhat chokes during the match. it's not actually choking or the feeling of intimidation. It was Efren creating some form of an illusion that distracts or divert the true perception of his opponents. that's what magicians do for a living!

 

[cuetechasaurus]

It's a combination of things, some obvious, and some not that make Efren the best, and greatest ever, in my opinion.

There are two aspects of the game Efren has that nobody else has. His high gear is higher than any player out there. When he gets in stroke, he beats everybody in a dominating fashion. He can make the cueball do things so accurately that it makes some players just want to quit pool, because they feel they won't have enough time in a single lifetime to learn to do what he can do. He also has a low gear that still gets him to the finish line, better than any player out there. What separates him in this aspect, is that when Efren is struggling, he still gets out. All the pros have a low gear where they struggle to run out what would normally be a simple rack. Efren still wins tournaments even when he is "off" his game.

Some obvious reasons that make Efren the best also include his kicking ability. That's unparalleled by any pro. His shotmaking, particularly "come" shots, i.e. shots that are extremely difficult enough to pocket without having to play position, but require lots of english and/or speed to get position. He is better at shots of this nature than anyone. His safety game is unparalleled. His patterns are better than anyone elses. His intelligence, and ability to think many shots ahead in games like one pocket. There are so many things to list that make Efren the best. He has every quality of the game that makes a great player a legend.

 

[cuetechasaurus]

You mean like Tony Chohan missing his winning ball against Efren at DCC last year?
Then Efren stole the match.
The best I saw Efren was back in his smoking days in the mid 90's. He would give local hotshots the orange crush or someone like Jerry Brunsetter the 5-ball and the breaks. Jerry gets on the hill with Efren needing 4 games. Suddenly Jerry can't make anything in the breaks and Efren just ran out each rack without getting nervous.

Tony came up real short for position on his out ball. IIRC it wasn't an easy shot. And Tony wasn't outmoving Efren, he shot low-percentage shots and made them to win the games that got him on the hill, correct me if I'm wrong, It might be another match I'm thinking of.

 

[rikdee]

Carom billiards

Personally, I believe one major reason is because none of Efren's competitors have exposure to balkline billiards, a carom game that trains the speed control of three balls simultaneously - every millimeter matters. Anyone who's ever seen this game practiced at a high level will understand exactly what I'm talking about.

Most of his competition doesn't even know what the game is, never mind play it - and to their detriment. 18.2 balkline, one of the oldest forms of carom, happens to be one of Efren's favorite games.

Developing any level of carom billiard skill will add handsomely to anyone's pocket games. It is very demanding in areas of cueball control (direction), ball speed, cushion angles (think kicks), and the need to hit balls extemely thin. And, these skills can be developed on a pocket table. Get a set of billiard balls and try it. No time on the table will be better spent.

_Rick

 

[PoolSharkAllen]

He has every quality of the game that makes a great player a legend.

They say that the most important shot of the game is the break shot. If Efren has a "weakness," I would say it's his break (in both 8-ball and 9-ball), as it oftentimes isn't as powerful as his opponents'.

Whereas Efren's top-notch opponents may make 2-3 balls on the 9-ball break, Efren may make just one, sometimes 2. In 8-ball, I've noticed that Efren's break doesn't spread the balls as widely as some of his opponents do (compared to Rodney Morris, for example).

Since Efren's break isn't as powerful as his opponents, he has to work a little bit harder to win games but he still manages to get the job done...and make it look easy too!

 

[cuetechasaurus]

They say that the most important shot of the game is the break shot. If Efren has a "weakness," I would say it's his break (in both 8-ball and 9-ball).

Efren's break isn't nearly as powerful as his other top-notch opponents. Efren often doesn't make more than one ball on the 9-ball break as his opponents do. In 8-ball, I've noticed that Efren's break doesn't spread the balls as widely as some of his opponents do (compared to Rodney Morris, for example).

Because Efren's break isn't as powerful as his opponents, he has to work a little bit harder to win games but he still manages to get the job done...and make it look easy too!

Efren posseses what is considered an average breakshot by pro standards. However, he can smash the rack if he really wants to. He rarely does it, because he prefers to break with control. If anyone thinks that Efren doesn't have a powerful break in his arsenal, watch the last tape of The Color of Money match between him and Earl. He was breaking like Bustamante.

 

[parvus1202]

It would be fun if Reyes was reading all these notes and opinions about his greatness and then say, " They don't know, I am just lucky". That what he always say anyway.

 

[DiamondDave]

A friend of mine called me a few months back to give me a tourney update. Race to 11, Allen Hopkins 10, Efren Reyes 0. He took a few minutes to explain to me that Hopkins may not e as good as he once was but as I could now tell he could still be a giant killer in a tournament. Later on that day he called me again to tell me that the final of that match was Hopkins 10, Reyes 11. Astonished I asked if he ran 10 straight racks or what?! Fred says no he couldn't have, it was alternating break.

Its hard to imagine someone actually coming back from that much of a deficit in that format! Most TV matches you see the loser shutting down when they are only behind 2-3 racks. I believe the positive attitude is the key to his success. I was at my pool leagues national tourny and I was down Hill-5 and I just grinned and stayed positive and came back to win. I think people really underestimate the powers of the mind.

Dave

 

[Samiel]

A quick thought on why some pros may have a "mental block" against Efren. I think it's fear. If you cannot fully estimate the skills and potential of your opponent, you are prone to make mistakes IMHO.

For example, I get scared playing local A players, especially playing one-pocket. There will be many times when I'll take a shot, thinking to myself, if I miss, he won't have a shot or will only get one ball. Time and and time again I am proven wrong when the A player somehow runs eight and out from a position I thought was safe or relatively safe. Over time, that wears on a person to the point where they get scared.

I think DCC 2006 (haven't seen DCC 2007 tapes yet) is a good example of Efren being left one shot, yet somehow he gets eight and out. I think all pros are aware that if they make the smallest mistake, Efren will get out on them. Worse, I think that pros may be afraid of any leave they leave Efren because time and time again he's shown that he can do something innovative and get out. I can only assume that must wear on pros playing Efren as much as it's worn on me playing against my A player.

 

[Russ Chewning]

They say that the most important shot of the game is the break shot. If Efren has a "weakness," I would say it's his break (in both 8-ball and 9-ball), as it oftentimes isn't as powerful as his opponents'.

Whereas Efren's top-notch opponents may make 2-3 balls on the 9-ball break, Efren may make just one, sometimes 2. In 8-ball, I've noticed that Efren's break doesn't spread the balls as widely as some of his opponents do (compared to Rodney Morris, for example).

Since Efren's break isn't as powerful as his opponents, he has to work a little bit harder to win games but he still manages to get the job done...and make it look easy too!

People always look at making less balls as a handicap for Efren..

Tell me.. If you knew you were the best in the world at handling clusters AND running out difficult layouts, as well as playing safe from the most difficult positions....

Would you really be all that keen to make multiple balls on the break?

I personally think that Efren's break works just fine for him.. If he makes a ball and isn't hooked, he's either got you dead behind a ball, or he's out. So, let's say his win percentage from a successful break is 70%..

Now, when he breaks and doesn't make a ball, at least 20% of the time, his opponent will have to push. I would say Efren will win in this position 70% of the time as well.

Also, has no one noticed that Efren actually controls the 1 ball on the break? If he doesn't make it in the side, it often ends up in the middle of the bottom rail. Do you know anyone better than Efren at playing the table length safe on the one ball in these situations? I think the 1 ball ends up there for a reason, because it plays to Efren's strengths..

Efren breaks with control, because he feels that is the best way to break. And I think his winning percentages bear this out. Most of the other pros are used to coming to the table with the one ball WHEREever, balls well spread, for an easy run out. If their opponent made a bll and has no run out, they are facing a safe usually weaker than Efren's.

With Efren's deep knowledge of how to play his particular break, his opponent has to run a 3-4 pack every time they are up against Efren. Oh yeah, and don't miss a ball after that 4 pack..

Russ

 

[Russ Chewning]

Developing any level of carom billiard skill will add handsomely to anyone's pocket games. It is very demanding in areas of cueball control (direction), ball speed, cushion angles (think kicks), and the need to hit balls extemely thin. And, these skills can be developed on a pocket table. Get a set of billiard balls and try it. No time on the table will be better spent.

_Rick

Funny you should say this.. When I was first learning to play, I liked kicking two and three rails to make balls.. Also, playing off a bll two or three rails to pocket a hanging ball.

I think it was the beauty of moving the balls long distances, and accomplishing something after all that movement. The abilities developed during this time really helped me out later on.

Check out this shot I pulled in a bar one time..

Opponent has my last ball blocked from a bank in either pocket.. I realized that a lot of time when I banked a ball at this angle back under me, I would scratch two rails in the same pocket..

So I called "I'm gonna bank the 3 ball into your 12, and the cue ball is gonna come two rails and pocket my 3.."

My opponent laughed at me. I hit the shot, which rolled slightly outward as the bank headed for the 12.. It cut the 12 in instead of hitting it full in the face.

Result? When the cue ball came towards the 3, it double kissed the three, freezing behind it, not even leaving my opponent a kick at the 8. How in the freak do you win from where I was?

In short, I believe practicing three cushion and other carom games gives you a sharper idea of angles, and actually allows you to use this knowledge to pull off outstanding safes and eyepopping shots..

Russ