why

desi2960

desi2960

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
as many of you know i get most of my shafts from old one piece house cues, as i like the old wood. but now and then i have a customer that wants a whiter shaft. so i buy a few near finished shafts to have on hand for them.
i just bought 4 shafts of this dealers highest quality for $33.00 each, dry, white maple, near size and ready to finish.
i ordered and payed for them from their website and after about a month i emailed them asking where they were, as i thought they had them in stock. i got a call in a couple days and the owner explained to me, how hard the quailty was to get, and it was going to take time if i wanted their top quality. after he explained, i told him to send them when the wood was ready.

i got the 4 shafts in about another month. they were packed in a plastic sleeve and in a post office triangle box. no padding, nothing but the sleeve. just rattling around in the box. i thought that was strange. i opened the package and they looked o.k. i put them on the lathe spun them and 1 of the 4 was straight.
my question is WHY do people do things like that ? why would a shaft dealer send his top quality shafts knowing they were not straight?

i sent them back and he said that never happens and would refund my money.
 
Lesson learned .

As Mike Webb once said, seasoning starts in your shop.
 
Last edited:
desi2960 said:
as many of you know i get most of my shafts from old one piece house cues, as i like the old wood. but now and then i have a customer that wants a whiter shaft. so i buy a few near finished shafts to have on hand for them.
i just bought 4 shafts of this dealers highest quality for $33.00 each, dry, white maple, near size and ready to finish.
i ordered and payed for them from their website and after about a month i emailed them asking where they were, as i thought they had them in stock. i got a call in a couple days and the owner explained to me, how hard the quailty was to get, and it was going to take time if i wanted their top quality. after he explained, i told him to send them when the wood was ready.

i got the 4 shafts in about another month. they were packed in a plastic sleeve and in a post office triangle box. no padding, nothing but the sleeve. just rattling around in the box. i thought that was strange. i opened the package and they looked o.k. i put them on the lathe spun them and 1 of the 4 was straight.
my question is WHY do people do things like that ? why would a shaft dealer send his top quality shafts knowing they were not straight?

i sent them back and he said that never happens and would refund my money.
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Chuck, its a shame but Its the economy and the fact some people are willing to lose there integrity and good name rather than be forthright in business. I'm struggling right now like never before, BUT, I will not compromise my principles and integrity just to pay a bill and ruin my good name. I had to tell a customer, just 2 months ago, that he couldn't come get his cue as it wasn't up to my standards. The customer understood and was pleased when he received his cue, after I made another one! The first cue met a quick death lol.

Tony
 
Hi,

It takes me 5 years to get near finished tapered shafts.

These shafts may have been good when shipped but were still cut down too fast and they moved.

Shafts are very tricky business.

Rick
 
I bought 10 from a very well respected supplier a few years ago when my taper setup was broke and I was appalled at the lack of quality. They were all 14.5mm and up instead of finish size like I asked for, most had wobbles, and worst was the fact that it looked like a beaver chewed them to that size. I contacted him right away and explained my dismay and he apologized and blamed it on a dull cutter and sent me 10 more replacements for free. I got those and they were about 13.5mm which is good, but still had chatter marks and wobbles, just not as bad. I ended up tossing almost all 20 shafts and have learn't not to buy shafts, even when I'm in a bind.
I was bothered by his explaination about a dull cutter, but no apology for the person that packed and shipped crappy shafts... I don't understand that behaivour, how can they not notice that they are packing crap? Especially if your small company has been in business for 20 plus years and all you do is supply quality shaft and cue woods? :confused:
Dave
 
I usually buy 1in dowels in with a good quality. I have bought them from several suppliers. There is one supplier that sells 33 in dowels, When I buy them I usually toss half of them.

Lately, I have been buying tapered dowels that are .750 - .900............. I buy them in lots of 20. Of those I may lose 1 out of the 20 when I uncover a spot when turning them down. I have lost only 1 that got a very small roll in it when my humidity dropped to 30%. Other than that, they are excellent.............

kim
 
If the suppliers wood is super nice, but not straight at final sanding size, then the best thing in the future would be to buy them at 15 to 16mm and finish them in your shop.
 
after 15 plus years

just to clarify, i was not looking for a finished shaft to put on a cue and sell next week. i have about 100 shafts hanging at this time. i was trying to buy some quality shafts 13.5 - 14 mm to replace the ones that i will use that have been in my shop for at least a year. i continually buy shaft wood from 8/4 wood to dowels to almost finished pieces can never have enough.
 
desi2960 said:
just to clarify, i was not looking for a finished shaft to put on a cue and sell next week. i have about 100 shafts hanging at this time. i was trying to buy some quality shafts 13.5 - 14 mm to replace the ones that i will use that have been in my shop for at least a year. i continually buy shaft wood from 8/4 wood to dowels to almost finished pieces can never have enough.
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In my opinion 13.5 to 14mm is too small of a size to send across climates and then allow to stabilize in your climate. 15 to 16mm would be better.
 
Shaft wood, unfortunately, is graded by aesthetics alone. Players think it has to be pretty and white and straight tight grain, so we builders go through the trouble to give them what they want. Subsequently, our suppliers sort that wood out & put a premium on it. Then when we pay premium for it, we expect it to be better wood and stay straight and play awesome forever. Fact is, it's wood just like what a pallet is made from, and is subject to stress and poor quality just the same. It's a circus based around myth & falsities.

Next time you buy shafts, buy an equal amount of top grade & bottom grade. Process them the same way at the same time, and store them exactly the same. You will absolutely be surprised at how many straight grain shafts warp, and how many wavy grain shafts stay straight. Furthermore, you will be pleasantly surprised at how awesome a shaft full of sugar lines will play, especially compared to a very clean, pristine shaft. Turns out sugar maple should have sugar in it. Who'd have thunk that? Don't get me wrong, a really pretty shaft can play great & stay straight. In fact, it has equally as much chance at being good wood as the ugly shaft, which means the ugly shaft has equally as much chance at being good or bad as the pretty wood. Aesthetics are just that, aesthetics. The way a shaft looks has absolutely nothing to do with it's quality. And time merely reveals stress. That's all. Time does absolutely nothing to enhance or stabilize the wood. If it's good wood, you can cut it to size in a day & it'll be straight forever. If it's junk then you can cut it over decades and it'll never be straight. The only time it should ever take 5 years to cut a shaft is because you simply don't have the time to do it. Taking 5 years will not make any difference in whether it's good wood or not. Just another myth. I challenge anybody to show legitimate data that indicates time does anything to affect wood. It's myth.

Point being, you must choose wood for quality first, aesthetics last. If you pay for aesthetics and then expect the wood to be high quality because you paid a lot, then you're setting yourself up for disappointment. That's not how it works. It's unfortunate that our industry is driven by false beliefs, but it's our own fault. We need to educate ourselves, then educate our buyers.
 
qbilder said:
Shaft wood, unfortunately, is graded by aesthetics alone. Players think it has to be pretty and white and straight tight grain, so we builders go through the trouble to give them what they want. Subsequently, our suppliers sort that wood out & put a premium on it. Then when we pay premium for it, we expect it to be better wood and stay straight and play awesome forever. Fact is, it's wood just like what a pallet is made from, and is subject to stress and poor quality just the same. It's a circus based around myth & falsities.

Next time you buy shafts, buy an equal amount of top grade & bottom grade. Process them the same way at the same time, and store them exactly the same. You will absolutely be surprised at how many straight grain shafts warp, and how many wavy grain shafts stay straight. Furthermore, you will be pleasantly surprised at how awesome a shaft full of sugar lines will play, especially compared to a very clean, pristine shaft. Turns out sugar maple should have sugar in it. Who'd have thunk that? Don't get me wrong, a really pretty shaft can play great & stay straight. In fact, it has equally as much chance at being good wood as the ugly shaft, which means the ugly shaft has equally as much chance at being good or bad as the pretty wood. Aesthetics are just that, aesthetics. The way a shaft looks has absolutely nothing to do with it's quality. And time merely reveals stress. That's all. Time does absolutely nothing to enhance or stabilize the wood. If it's good wood, you can cut it to size in a day & it'll be straight forever. If it's junk then you can cut it over decades and it'll never be straight. The only time it should ever take 5 years to cut a shaft is because you simply don't have the time to do it. Taking 5 years will not make any difference in whether it's good wood or not. Just another myth. I challenge anybody to show legitimate data that indicates time does anything to affect wood. It's myth.

Point being, you must choose wood for quality first, aesthetics last. If you pay for aesthetics and then expect the wood to be high quality because you paid a lot, then you're setting yourself up for disappointment. That's not how it works. It's unfortunate that our industry is driven by false beliefs, but it's our own fault. We need to educate ourselves, then educate our buyers.
Click to expand...


My favorite shaft that Trav had with the cue in my signature that you made has marks and dark spots all over it.

I absolutely LOVE the shafts I see that have sugar marks and dark "spots" on them. They give the shaft character IMO.


I sent ya an email by the way, hope you still check that address. Happy new year,

Danny
 
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