WPBA 3 years later - observations.

Williebetmore

Member, .25% Club
Silver Member
Since the WPBA Peoria event was cancelled 3 years ago, I have not had the opportunity to view a women's event until the recent Michigan City stop (I had attended the Peoria tournament every year of it's existence). We often hear of the progress of the women's tour, and I wondered if the product has essentially changed. Here are my observations.

Tables:
The Brunswick GCV tables were very nice, and seemed significantly more difficult than the tables used previously. Definitely a good trend for the best players in the game.

Wardrobe:
Though I am definitely the anti-OMGWTF, and have NO fashion sense at all, I do appreciate the well dressed competitors. Overall I thought there was definitely a more widespread attempt at being neat, presentable, professional, and dare I say even fashionable among the players. There were many players "dressed to kill" even in the early rounds and daytime rounds - Pan, Lee, Paglia, Laurance as usual were exceptionally stylish (I often wonder if Ewa is even overdressed for the occasion, or perhaps just stopped to play by accident on her way to some photo shoot for Glamour magazine).

There were several notably underdressed competitors - what the heck happened to Jennifer Chen (the former China Doll often looked distressingly casual - almost didn't recognize her - what a change)???

It was comforting to see that Susan Mello continued her tradition; and was spied wearing a propeller beanie on Friday.

Pace of Play:
The play was in general slow, slower, and glacial. The usual exceptions were Vivian and Kelly - always enjoyable to watch (though Kelly's game seemed more deliberate and thoughtful than before - definitely a force to be reckoned with).

The last matches of the day (which are usually not subject to the shot clock) are often so slow as to be unwatchable to many of the fans; myself included. Is it really a good trend to see spectators filtering out of the final round matches late Saturday night? At one point, all 4 matches were on break, and a fair percentage of the spectators left with the final 4 still undecided. I didn't time them, but those matches were LONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.

It still seems that the fairness of the competition suffers from having some matches timed and others not. Also, the "volunteer" timekeepers are often inappropriately dressed (myself included) and lend an amateurish air to the proceedings.

It would be a lot better to recruit 8 AZB volunteers, dress them in black, train them to rack/time/observe; then time ALL of the matches. Perhaps a 40 second shot clock with 2 extensions per rack. The play would not suffer, and things would move along fairly and smoothly

Racking:
What a farce. The endless racking, twiddling, griping, and waiting was just very unprofessional and NOT entertaining for the fans in any way. In one 2 hour match, they spent about 25-30 minutes racking (table #6). The product would improve immensely with designated rackers, or tapped/trained tables, or Sardo racks (used properly, not left to the contestants as in previous years). It seemed even worse than I remembered 3 years ago; definitely an area that could be improved.

Skill level:
Wow is all I can say. The level of play definitely continues to improve; there are a LOT of women with game; and a lot more threats to win than in past years. In this tournament Rousey, Cha, Kostanian, Ouschan, Minerich, and Paglia all looked significantly improved over several years ago. The usual suspect top players are still awesome. The number of great matches was impressive - I doubt many spectators were disappointed (unless they just really hate watching interminable racking).

Venue:
I thought it was decent, even with all of the construction. The food was adequate, though expensive. I LIKED the seating (padded individual seats with no empty VIP row like in Peoria).

I was distressed that almost no one I talked to had visited the Dunes National Park in the 3 years of the tournament. It is less than 2 minutes from the hotel, and is close to being one of the great natural wonders of the world (climb to the top of the Mt. Baldy dune and tell me if you've ever seen anything like it).

The bar areas and dance floor were serviceable and definitely got a work out. I will emphatically deny any allegations that I was involved in a drunken Hand Jive exhibition late Saturday night (though Monica Webb was definitely spotted). Deny, deny, deny.

Apologies:
To all the AZB'ers that I saw and did not have time to chat with - Da Poet and friend, Ragbug, Frankenstroke, Wally in Cincy and Kathy. Everytime I saw them I was in a hurry on my way somewhere. Very sorry.

I did get to sweat a few matches with Mark Griffin and spouse. I assume he's trying to pick up a few pointers (which end of the cue to hold, make-up tips, etc.) before contesting for the Betmore Cup.

I hope the tournament returns next year, I will definitely attend.
 
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Williebetmore said:
Racking:
What a farce. The endless racking, twiddling, griping, and waiting was just very unprofessional and NOT entertaining for the fans in any way. In one 2 hour match, they spent about 25-30 minutes racking (table #6). The product would improve immensely with designated rackers, or tapped/trained tables, or Sardo racks (used properly, not left to the contestants as in previous years). It seemed even worse than I remembered 3 years ago; definitely an area that could be improved.

I watched some of the BCA event a few weeks ago and noticed the racking issues are well. I don't recall the constant racking problems when they were using the Sardo which is less expensive than the aluminum wonder. Were they using an aluminum rack in Michigan?
 
They were using Meuller wooden triangle racks, nothing special or mechanical about them. Black with white Mueller's lettering. They must be supplied for tour use as Mueller's doens't have such a styled rack listed on their website.

The racking issues weren't limited to just the players not being able to push up a good rack. Mark and Steve spent more than a few minutes at any given time getting a good rack. I'm not sure why, but this seemed to be the case on Friday. Sunday, the balls seemed to rack pretty good on the TV table.
 
ragbug74 said:
They were using Meuller wooden triangle racks.

Thanks for the quick response. On the TV tables the players are not allowed to check the rack. This may be why the balls appeared to rack better Sunday. Many of the women players are VERY particular about the number of balls frozen.
 
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Williebetmore said:
....
Pace of Play:
The play was in general slow, slower, and glacial. The usual exceptions were Vivian and Kelly - always enjoyable to watch (though Kelly's game seemed more deliberate and thoughtful than before - definitely a force to be reckoned with).

The last matches of the day (which are usually not subject to the shot clock) are often so slow as to be unwatchable to many of the fans; myself included. Is it really a good trend to see spectators filtering out of the final round matches late Saturday night? At one point, all 4 matches were on break, and a fair percentage of the spectators left with the final 4 still undecided. I didn't time them, but those matches were LONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.

It still seems that the fairness of the competition suffers from having some matches timed and others not. Also, the "volunteer" timekeepers are often inappropriately dressed (myself included) and lend an amateurish air to the proceedings.

It would be a lot better to recruit 8 AZB volunteers, dress them in black, train them to rack/time/observe; then time ALL of the matches. Perhaps a 40 second shot clock with 2 extensions per rack. The play would not suffer, and things would move along fairly and smoothly
...
Until that is fixed in both men's and women's pool, it will never have a chance of making it as a mainstream sport. If people who love the game can't stand to wait it out, how can it be expected to draw casual fans?
 
Roadkill said:
Thanks for the quick response. On the TV tables the players are not allowed to check the rack. This may be why the balls appeared to rack better Sunday. Many of the women players are VERY particular about the number of balls frozen.

I thought I remember seeing someone check the rack once or twice on Sunday, but I don't recall them asking for anything to be changed or "fixed" with the rack. They should read Charlie Bond/Joe Tucker's The Great Break Shot/Racking Secrets books and take advantage of those gaps.
 
Steve Ellis said:
If people who love the game can't stand to wait it out, how can it be expected to draw casual fans?

Steve,
I couldn't agree more. I consider myself a more than rabid fan, but I was getting a bit bored late Saturday. One of my friends was still playing, and I only stuck it out until her match was completed. I did not stay for the remainder of the matches (though in past years I have stayed till the very end, no matter the time.....I could be getting old).
 
Williebetmore said:
Since the WPBA Peoria event was cancelled 3 years ago, I have not had the opportunity to view a women's event until the recent Michigan City stop (I had attended the Peoria tournament every year of it's existence). We often hear of the progress of the women's tour, and I wondered if the product has essentially changed. Here are my observations.

Tables:
The Brunswick GCV tables were very nice, and seemed significantly more difficult than the tables used previously. Definitely a good trend for the best players in the game.

Wardrobe:
Though I am definitely the anti-OMGWTF, and have NO fashion sense at all, I do appreciate the well dressed competitors. Overall I thought there was definitely a more widespread attempt at being neat, presentable, professional, and dare I say even fashionable among the players. There were many players "dressed to kill" even in the early rounds and daytime rounds - Pan, Lee, Paglia, Laurance as usual were exceptionally stylish (I often wonder if Ewa is even overdressed for the occasion, or perhaps just stopped to play by accident on her way to some photo shoot for Glamour magazine).

There were several notably underdressed competitors - what the heck happened to Jennifer Chen (the former China Doll often looked distressingly casual - almost didn't recognize her - what a change)???

It was comforting to see that Susan Mello continued her tradition; and was spied wearing a propeller beanie on Friday.

Pace of Play:
The play was in general slow, slower, and glacial. The usual exceptions were Vivian and Kelly - always enjoyable to watch (though Kelly's game seemed more deliberate and thoughtful than before - definitely a force to be reckoned with).

The last matches of the day (which are usually not subject to the shot clock) are often so slow as to be unwatchable to many of the fans; myself included. Is it really a good trend to see spectators filtering out of the final round matches late Saturday night? At one point, all 4 matches were on break, and a fair percentage of the spectators left with the final 4 still undecided. I didn't time them, but those matches were LONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.

It still seems that the fairness of the competition suffers from having some matches timed and others not. Also, the "volunteer" timekeepers are often inappropriately dressed (myself included) and lend an amateurish air to the proceedings.

It would be a lot better to recruit 8 AZB volunteers, dress them in black, train them to rack/time/observe; then time ALL of the matches. Perhaps a 40 second shot clock with 2 extensions per rack. The play would not suffer, and things would move along fairly and smoothly

Racking:
What a farce. The endless racking, twiddling, griping, and waiting was just very unprofessional and NOT entertaining for the fans in any way. In one 2 hour match, they spent about 25-30 minutes racking (table #6). The product would improve immensely with designated rackers, or tapped/trained tables, or Sardo racks (used properly, not left to the contestants as in previous years). It seemed even worse than I remembered 3 years ago; definitely an area that could be improved.

Skill level:
Wow is all I can say. The level of play definitely continues to improve; there are a LOT of women with game; and a lot more threats to win than in past years. In this tournament Rousey, Cha, Kostanian, Ouschan, and Paglia all looked significantly improved over several years ago. The usual suspect top players are still awesome. The number of great matches was impressive - I doubt many spectators were disappointed (unless they just really hate watching interminable racking).

Venue:
I thought it was decent, even with all of the construction. The food was adequate, though expensive. I LIKED the seating (padded individual seats with no empty VIP row like in Peoria).

I was distressed that almost no one I talked to had visited the Dunes National Park in the 3 years of the tournament. It is less than 2 minutes from the hotel, and is close to being one of the great natural wonders of the world (climb to the top of the Mt. Baldy dune and tell me if you've ever seen anything like it).

The bar areas and dance floor were serviceable and definitely got a work out. I will emphatically deny any allegations that I was involved in a drunken Hand Jive exhibition late Saturday night (though Monica Webb was definitely spotted). Deny, deny, deny.

Apologies:
To all the AZB'ers that I saw and did not have time to chat with - Da Poet and friend, Ragbug, Frankenstroke, Wally in Cincy and Kathy. Everytime I saw them I was in a hurry on my way somewhere. Very sorry.

I did get to sweat a few matches with Mark Griffin and spouse. I assume he's trying to pick up a few pointers (which end of the cue to hold, make-up tips, etc.) before contesting for the Betmore Cup.

I hope the tournament returns next year, I will definitely attend.

Great Post! I loved your "tournament review". Very insightful stuff here. Now you have to do it at all tourneys you attend! :)
 
Williebetmore said:
Since the WPBA Peoria event was cancelled 3 Here are my observations.



QUOTE]

u wrote it like a Journalist and it is excellant.I enjoyed reading it.:cool:
 
ragbug74 said:
They were using Meuller wooden triangle racks, nothing special or mechanical about them. Black with white Mueller's lettering. They must be supplied for tour use as Mueller's doens't have such a styled rack listed on their website.

Thanks for the report. When I was at the WPBA San Diego event a few years ago I asked the Mueller rep why they don't sell them. He said they were too expensive to manufacture, so I suppose they didn't see a big enough market to be worth the production costs for them. They just do it for the sponsorship exposure.

Then again for all I know it's just a Diamond rack painted black!
 
Williebetmore said:
Tables:
The Brunswick GCV tables were very nice, and seemed significantly more difficult than the tables used previously. Definitely a good trend for the best players in the game.

The women play on equipment that is much tougher than most people realize. This has been the case for a couple of years now.

Wardrobe:
Though I am definitely the anti-OMGWTF, and have NO fashion sense at all, I do appreciate the well dressed competitors...

I, too, admire the ladies for the attractive way that they present themselves. Still, I'd like to see them well dressed anytime they are in the playing arena, not just when they are competing - some were and some were not.

Pace of Play:
The play was in general slow, slower, and glacial. The usual exceptions were Vivian and Kelly - always enjoyable to watch (though Kelly's game seemed more deliberate and thoughtful than before - definitely a force to be reckoned with)....Perhaps a 40 second shot clock with 2 extensions per rack. The play would not suffer, and things would move along fairly and smoothly.

I think that Ga Young Kim plays faster than either of these, but you are right about the slow play being an issue. I like your shot clock idea.

Racking:
What a farce. The endless racking, twiddling, griping, and waiting was just very unprofessional and NOT entertaining for the fans in any way....

This has become a real problem. It's tough not to sympathize with players that don't want their chances compromised by a loose rack, but there comes a point where it just looks absurd, and the endless complaining, as you suggest, makes the ladies look unprofessional.

Skill level:
The number of great matches was impressive - I doubt many spectators were disappointed (unless they just really hate watching interminable racking).

Agreed, the ladies are playing well and provided some great theater. Two very memorable matches were a) Monica Webb's superb win over Jasmin Ouschan with a spot in single elimination riding on it and b) the brilliantly played double hill thriller win by Kelly Fisher over Xiaoting Pan with a TV round spot riding on it.

Great post. My thoughts are above in red.
 
We expect more from you...

Okay, thank you very much for the write-up, it was done very well....BUT....you know, we are becoming accustomed to a little bit more from you....you know....can you say PICTURES!

(Yeah I know, others have posted some good pictures...but more never hurt anyone) :grin:
 
Stu - it was great to see you again! You are looking fitter than a fiddle...and just to see your good-natured smile during my matches was very comforting. I'm sorry we didn't get to chat more!

Hope you make it to another event soon!

Melissa
 
Mr. Betmore....you cannot deny the dance floor performance sir. I saw you there. Not just there, but leading the whole thing!!

Anyway, it was great to see everyone again. It was almost a reunion of the Peoria crowd.

Thank you for your kind words about the play. I agree with you, everyone is playing better. The bar has been raised. We just have to see who can keep it up.

You're shot clock idea is a good one as well. I think we are lucky to have people on hand to do the shot clock operations for us. For the most part, everyone does a great job.

Thanks for your review of the tournament for everyone that couldn't be there. I hope everyone that went enjoyed themselves.

Sarah
 
sarahrousey said:
Mr. Betmore....you cannot deny the dance floor performance sir. I saw you there. Not just there, but leading the whole thing!!


Sarah

Never happened. You must be confused. Perhaps it was just someone that looked like me (poor schmuck). Please don't spread such malicious rumors (and can I pay you to keep quiet in case you have photos???).
 
Oops.....I received a PM wondering why I was being so harsh in describing the event. No harshness intended.

I think the WPBA offers an excellent product; one that I enjoy immensely. My suggestions were only intended to make things even more enjoyable; and my descriptions intended only to give a flavor of the event for those that might be considering attending in the future.

I believe that the women's events are more enjoyable than the men's events - sorry if there was any confusion.
 
Williebetmore said:
Since the WPBA Peoria event was cancelled 3 years ago,

I thought it was two


The Brunswick GCV tables were very nice, and seemed significantly more difficult than the tables used previously.

When a well-srtruck ball by AF is spit out by the pockets, that is a pretty good indication they are tight. There were a lot of misses but I am surprised there were not more. Those tables looked tough as Diamonds


I do appreciate the well dressed competitors.

Definitely an overall very noticeable improvement there. Special kudos to Stacy Hurst, Ewa, and J Lee, who have been ahead of the curve for many years in that regard.

The play was in general slow, slower, and glacial.

As always, a lot of safety play. It would be interesting to see them be a bit more aggressive. Kudos to Helena, Lee, and VV in that regard.

Racking:
What a farce.

That was the worst part of my weekend. It was like watching a dozen Karen Corrs, with all the complaining about the rack.


Venue:
I thought it was decent, even with all of the construction.

I thought the construction was beautiful, considering my employer furnished the exterior glass and metal skin for that building :D

The food was adequate, though expensive.

For future reference, w e got carry-out from Frosty's BBQ Shack about 3 miles east on Rt. 12. It was real good. The place right across the bridge (named "The Bridge" ironically) was very good and reasonably priced too.

Nothing like the Burger Barge in Peoria thiough :grin: :grin:



I was distressed that almost no one I talked to had visited the Dunes National Park in the 3 years of the tournament.

That was cool. An excellent Friday morning trip.


The bar areas and dance floor were serviceable and definitely got a work out.

It was just too crowded for us Saturday night. Too bad they closed down the small bar. That was nice. Maybe next year they can leave it open a bit later

Apologies:
To all the AZB'ers that I saw and did not have time to chat with - Da Poet and friend, Ragbug, Frankenstroke, Wally in Cincy and Kathy. Everytime I saw them I was in a hurry on my way somewhere. Very sorry.

We understand your status as BMOC :D


I hope the tournament returns next year, I will definitely attend

Definitely
 
Melissa Herndon said:
Stu - it was great to see you again! You are looking fitter than a fiddle...and just to see your good-natured smile during my matches was very comforting. I'm sorry we didn't get to chat more!

Hope you make it to another event soon!

Melissa

Thanks, Melissa. You've always been one of my personal favorites and it is always nice to see you. I was pleased I caught up with so many of my WPBA buddies, nearly all of whom greeted me very cordially.
 
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I was watching the WPBA event in San Diego on ESPN a couple of days ago, I was so happy the tables were playing normally tough, it almost brought tears to my eyes. The reason I say normally tough is because in comparison to the pockets they had been playing on they seem really tight, even though it just happens be what they should have been playing on the whole time.
 
Williebetmore said:
Since the WPBA Peoria event was cancelled 3 years ago, I have not had the opportunity to view a women's event until the recent Michigan City stop (I had attended the Peoria tournament every year of it's existence). We often hear of the progress of the women's tour, and I wondered if the product has essentially changed. Here are my observations.

Tables:
The Brunswick GCV tables were very nice, and seemed significantly more difficult than the tables used previously. Definitely a good trend for the best players in the game.

Wardrobe:
Though I am definitely the anti-OMGWTF, and have NO fashion sense at all, I do appreciate the well dressed competitors. Overall I thought there was definitely a more widespread attempt at being neat, presentable, professional, and dare I say even fashionable among the players. There were many players "dressed to kill" even in the early rounds and daytime rounds - Pan, Lee, Paglia, Laurance as usual were exceptionally stylish (I often wonder if Ewa is even overdressed for the occasion, or perhaps just stopped to play by accident on her way to some photo shoot for Glamour magazine).

There were several notably underdressed competitors - what the heck happened to Jennifer Chen (the former China Doll often looked distressingly casual - almost didn't recognize her - what a change)???

It was comforting to see that Susan Mello continued her tradition; and was spied wearing a propeller beanie on Friday.

Pace of Play:
The play was in general slow, slower, and glacial. The usual exceptions were Vivian and Kelly - always enjoyable to watch (though Kelly's game seemed more deliberate and thoughtful than before - definitely a force to be reckoned with).

The last matches of the day (which are usually not subject to the shot clock) are often so slow as to be unwatchable to many of the fans; myself included. Is it really a good trend to see spectators filtering out of the final round matches late Saturday night? At one point, all 4 matches were on break, and a fair percentage of the spectators left with the final 4 still undecided. I didn't time them, but those matches were LONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG.

It still seems that the fairness of the competition suffers from having some matches timed and others not. Also, the "volunteer" timekeepers are often inappropriately dressed (myself included) and lend an amateurish air to the proceedings.

It would be a lot better to recruit 8 AZB volunteers, dress them in black, train them to rack/time/observe; then time ALL of the matches. Perhaps a 40 second shot clock with 2 extensions per rack. The play would not suffer, and things would move along fairly and smoothly

Racking:
What a farce. The endless racking, twiddling, griping, and waiting was just very unprofessional and NOT entertaining for the fans in any way. In one 2 hour match, they spent about 25-30 minutes racking (table #6). The product would improve immensely with designated rackers, or tapped/trained tables, or Sardo racks (used properly, not left to the contestants as in previous years). It seemed even worse than I remembered 3 years ago; definitely an area that could be improved.

Skill level:
Wow is all I can say. The level of play definitely continues to improve; there are a LOT of women with game; and a lot more threats to win than in past years. In this tournament Rousey, Cha, Kostanian, Ouschan, Minerich, and Paglia all looked significantly improved over several years ago. The usual suspect top players are still awesome. The number of great matches was impressive - I doubt many spectators were disappointed (unless they just really hate watching interminable racking).

Venue:
I thought it was decent, even with all of the construction. The food was adequate, though expensive. I LIKED the seating (padded individual seats with no empty VIP row like in Peoria).

I was distressed that almost no one I talked to had visited the Dunes National Park in the 3 years of the tournament. It is less than 2 minutes from the hotel, and is close to being one of the great natural wonders of the world (climb to the top of the Mt. Baldy dune and tell me if you've ever seen anything like it).

The bar areas and dance floor were serviceable and definitely got a work out. I will emphatically deny any allegations that I was involved in a drunken Hand Jive exhibition late Saturday night (though Monica Webb was definitely spotted). Deny, deny, deny.

Apologies:
To all the AZB'ers that I saw and did not have time to chat with - Da Poet and friend, Ragbug, Frankenstroke, Wally in Cincy and Kathy. Everytime I saw them I was in a hurry on my way somewhere. Very sorry.

I did get to sweat a few matches with Mark Griffin and spouse. I assume he's trying to pick up a few pointers (which end of the cue to hold, make-up tips, etc.) before contesting for the Betmore Cup.

I hope the tournament returns next year, I will definitely attend.

Great post. I think you just missed one thing. After three years the prize money still stinks. I'm sure they were hoping to pick up more or wealthier sponsors. The ladies really have improved their play considerably and the money hasn't followed.
 
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