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Controversial European Open Push Shot Call – The Myths Busted

dr_dave
iusedtoberich said:
View attachment 889398

The video was super good. I meant what I wrote in the YT comment.

From a production standpoint, It had a good flow and script, and kept my attention the whole time. I only slightly lost interest during the VNEA segment. I felt it took a lot of portion of the overall video to counter a very minor comment that Karl made (jacked up).

I was also right that few watched it in its entirety, or even at all. You can tell by the YT comments that they didn't. I read them all, and I believe 2 of them didn't know it was frozen, yet you said in the first 15 seconds that you confirmed it was frozen with Marcel. Another comment said he thought it was a foul because the CB went a bit sideways, and a person who DID watch the whole thing replied to him you covered that in your VNEA 45 deg analysis, showing that the CB can go in almost any direction depending on the hit direction.

One guy who DID watch it had an interesting comment. He said the snooker/blackball definition of the word "push" is different than the WPA definition of the word "push", and that is where some of the confusion might arise from. He said in the snooker/blackball games if all 3 are in contact at once (which they were) it's a push.

I'll retract my recommendation to make it 3 min, partially. Most don't have the attention span to watch the 20 min. If I hadn't stuck my nose into this thread, I probably wouldn't have watched it once I saw it was 20 min. I think the people who would watch the whole thing are super pool fanatics (like us), but probably already knew everything you discussed. So who is the video for? A beginning pool fanatic who is not familiar with frozen ball rules?

To help get more views (if that matters to you), maybe do make a YT short version, 45-60 second range?
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Thank you the positive feedback, observations, and suggestions. If I have the time and energy tomorrow, maybe I’ll try to create a short to post.
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Controversial European Open Push Shot Call – The Myths Busted

mikepage
GideonF said:
The problem with a 1 to 3 minute version is I think it would just have to be declarative: its a foul if not frozen, but if declared frozen the rules allow you to shoot into balls. The balls were declared frozen. Its not a push, that’s a very different thing.

The problem is that many many people have been saying exactly that since it happened. Not just people like me but also Bob Jewett (and a a few pros) and so many people reject it. Aside from Dr Dave’s reputation and pool fame maybe convincing a few people, it wouldn’t help much. All the detail and video clips are the actual evidence, as opposed to just an appeal to authority.
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I agree. It is tempting for Dr. Dave to just weigh in with a short easy-to-digest clip that relies partly on his established authority.

But we also have to recognize he established that authority by opting instead for succinct but thorough analysis. One way to think of his approach is not as reaching the most people directly but as reaching the people willing to invest a little who will then reach others.
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Underappreciated Cue Makers Section

Bavafongoul
I came up with the title since there isn’t any forum for just unrecognized cue makers. If there was, my concept for it would be to focus on new, upcoming cue makers that are taking orders, producing cues for at least over a year and their customers can post positive, or less than positive, reviews on the workmanship, cue maker demeanor, how the cue plays, would they ever do repeat business if they wanted another cue….that kind of stuff.

The intention is to discover and promote new cue makers that would be good for the cue maker and helpful to readers as well. I have always found threads illustrating someone’s pleasure over receiving their new cue to be the most enjoyable and also consequential.

Yeah, I know there are other forums but those aren’t frequented as often as the Main Forum which covers pool related subjects. Well, to my way of thinking, the more readers this thread gets will yield better results, i.e., replies and interest. That would be a good thing, IMO. So having this thread in the Main Forum makes it easier for readers to participate so that’s why I posted it in this forum

More viewers, easier to by reply…..hopefully with photo attachments…..provides input about cue makers otherwise not known very well, readers can express opinions or questions…..there are lots of reasons for posting this new thread in the Main Forum. Now the real question is whether there’s enough cue makers known more locally than nationally that deserve to be recognized for their excellence or affordability. Time will tell the outcome but here’s a chance to help educate others by actual illustrations of entrepreneurial cue making at its best.
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In honor of my first follower on AZB

R
Good evening. I wanted to share an experience that I had in honor of my first follower on AZB. I recently picked up (somewhat of an impulse buy) a Jacoby cue and since it was an in stock item, it came with a Jacoby v4 12.3mm carbon fiber shaft. Pretty standard stuff. I noticed someone on the forum was looking for that model shaft and I shared that I had said shaft. I committed a crime though fellow AZBers. That crime of being a newer member w/ a side of perhaps encroaching on an established members sales territory. I won’t apologize for being new or for reaching out without having an official post offering the shaft. I get it, basically everyone is a scammer until they have a reputation of not being a scammer. If you are on this site, you are likely a male (being an adult is debatable) and you either are interested in pool or some facet of the game or equipment. If you see concerning behavior, absolutely speak up. Be it on the net or in real life, look out for your fellow man when you can. But, damn people, please refrain from scumbag behavior. My favorite example is bringing into question my integrity and then almost immediately offering a similar shaft. In my publicly stated opinion, you are exhibiting the behavior of someone missing their testicles. #1 follower, that is for you and you know who you are. Admins, the unnamed individual is more than welcome to address this offsite. No one was named, but I didn’t see sharing a bad experience that happened on this site against the rules. If you host a marketplace, who is ultimately responsible for what happens through it? I would think that has been well established.
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Controversial European Open Push Shot Call – The Myths Busted

GideonF
iusedtoberich said:
View attachment 889398

The video was super good. I meant what I wrote in the YT comment.

From a production standpoint, It had a good flow and script, and kept my attention the whole time. I only slightly lost interest during the VNEA segment. I felt it took a lot of portion of the overall video to counter a very minor comment that Karl made (jacked up).

I was also right that few watched it in its entirety, or even at all. You can tell by the YT comments that they didn't. I read them all, and I believe 2 of them didn't know it was frozen, yet you said in the first 15 seconds that you confirmed it was frozen with Marcel. Another comment said he thought it was a foul because the CB went a bit sideways, and a person who DID watch the whole thing replied to him you covered that in your VNEA 45 deg analysis, showing that the CB can go in almost any direction depending on the hit direction.

One guy who DID watch it had an interesting comment. He said the snooker/blackball definition of the word "push" is different than the WPA definition of the word "push", and that is where some of the confusion might arise from. He said in the snooker/blackball games if all 3 are in contact at once (which they were) it's a push.

I'll retract my recommendation to make it 3 min, partially. Most don't have the attention span to watch the 20 min. If I hadn't stuck my nose into this thread, I probably wouldn't have watched it once I saw it was 20 min. I think the people who would watch the whole thing are super pool fanatics (like us), but probably already knew everything you discussed. So who is the video for? A beginning pool fanatic who is not familiar with frozen ball rules?

To help get more views (if that matters to you), maybe do make a YT short version, 45-60 second range?
Click to expand...

The problem with a 1 to 3 minute version is I think it would just have to be declarative: its a foul if not frozen, but if declared frozen the rules allow you to shoot into balls. The balls were declared frozen. Its not a push, that’s a very different thing.

The problem is that many many people have been saying exactly that since it happened. Not just people like me but also Bob Jewett (and a a few pros) and so many people reject it. Aside from Dr Dave’s reputation and pool fame maybe convincing a few people, it wouldn’t help much. All the detail and video clips are the actual evidence, as opposed to just an appeal to authority.
Click to expand...

Controversial European Open Push Shot Call – The Myths Busted

iusedtoberich
1773374850997.png


The video was super good. I meant what I wrote in the YT comment.

From a production standpoint, It had a good flow and script, and kept my attention the whole time. I only slightly lost interest during the VNEA segment. I felt it took a lot of portion of the overall video to counter a very minor comment that Karl made (jacked up).

I was also right that few watched it in its entirety, or even at all. You can tell by the YT comments that they didn't. I read them all, and I believe 2 of them didn't know it was frozen, yet you said in the first 15 seconds that you confirmed it was frozen with Marcel. Another comment said he thought it was a foul because the CB went a bit sideways, and a person who DID watch the whole thing replied to him you covered that in your VNEA 45 deg analysis, showing that the CB can go in almost any direction depending on the hit direction.

One guy who DID watch it had an interesting comment. He said the snooker/blackball definition of the word "push" is different than the WPA definition of the word "push", and that is where some of the confusion might arise from. He said in the snooker/blackball games if all 3 are in contact at once (which they were) it's a push.

I'll retract my recommendation to make it 3 min, partially. Most don't have the attention span to watch the 20 min. If I hadn't stuck my nose into this thread, I probably wouldn't have watched it once I saw it was 20 min. I think the people who would watch the whole thing are super pool fanatics (like us), but probably already knew everything you discussed. So who is the video for? A beginning pool fanatic who is not familiar with frozen ball rules?

To help get more views (if that matters to you), maybe do make a YT short version, 45-60 second range?
Click to expand...

Push shot foul?

Bob Jewett
GideonF said:
... The WNT not allowing replay is bad (and weird, because WST snooker allows it and WNT is often influenced by WST policies). ...
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I was told that it is an expense issue. I think that if they used a 4k webcam and some kind of cheap computer as a storage/display device, it could be really cheap. Other tournaments stream every match, somehow.

They should be able to bring up any streamed table almost for free -- even on their cell phone. You can scroll back easily to the incident. Of course, the view may not be ideal, but it is something, and in the case at hand, I think it would have been enough.
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Overcoming Frustration

BRKNRUN
bbb said:
how do you know which of the 4(5) things is the cause of the problem?
Click to expand...
Well technically you don't....otherwise you would not do it......but you do know it is one of those things that is throwing your stroke off......by adjusting one you can see if it makes an improvement. Ideally at some point in practice you found a gear where everything clicks and you analized your G,S,P,A....so if you are off you can check if one is not the same as when you were on.

Sometimes your natural stroke changes....perhaps a grip that one day was naturally producing a straight stroke is now days (or even hours) later not producing a straight stroke but by changing it just slightly it now does produce a natural straight stroke.

I suspect pros make slight tweaks to their grip all the time...same as pro golfers.....I have seen video of Earl looking at his grip hand just prior to getting down on a shot....(especially the break shot)....That tells me that there are some specifics to his set up even though it looks completely natural.

Problem is......perfection is very hard to achieve and even harder to hold on to.....but by focusing on things you can control vs things you can't...in the long run you will perform better.
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Aramith Ball Weights

Bob Jewett
His scale may have a 1% error, but that's not random on each reading. Comparing weights near each other is going to be far more precise than the overall error. He seems to have a scale that reads to 0.5 gram. That should be fine for showing 4 gram differences.

Balls are known to get lighter over time. Some of that is due to wear, but I have a report from a reliable technical guy that he has an unused set that has gotten lighter over time. Some kind of outgassing/evaporation? Maybe he stored them next to his heater.

I wonder if the buyer can actually notice the difference in play. You mention 7 grams, but the important thing is the range of ball weights. If they are all 162 grams, he is unlikely to notice any problem. However, on a few shots, if the player is very skilled, it is possible that 4 grams difference -- the actual spread of ball weights you mentioned -- will be noticeable. I doubt he plays that well, or he would not be buying used balls.

There is a problem he might run into with those balls. If he gets a new cue ball, it will be 169-170, probably. That will not work so well with the lighter balls for draw shots. Again, he may not notice.
mdc said:
True, and yes, I already agreed to take the set back and refund his money. It just seems strange to me.
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Good move. The best way to handle crazy people is get away from them before you catch whatever they have.
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Can any wood be repurposed?

R
Positively Ralf said:
Don't know if it would be much help, but here are some pictures I took. With the exception of the first piece which has been inside the company van since it was disassembled, Unfortunately I was too busy to put the other parts away. They were covered in snow and now some rain that dropped here in southern NY. They are still very solid but maybe I just let them get past the point of no return.

Again, I'm no expert but I figured maybe some of you guys wanted to see what I would have been working with.
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Looks like particle board with veneer. Take it to the dump.
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EUROPEAN OPEN 2026, Sarajevo, Bosnia and Herzegovina, March 10-15

mikepage
sjm said:
[...] Matchroom and WPA/Predator won't collaborate on the world pool calendar until it is mutually beneficial to both of them and that day can't come before each of them accepts that the top pros will sometimes choose one over the other when their events run concurrently.
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WPA is not Predator. They play fundamentally different roles.

The problem with framing this as some kind of negotiation over the calendar is that framing is an unstable equilibrium. As soon as any private entity believes they are in a position they don't need to negotiate, they won't. At that point they will either 100% "win," or the fans and the players will pay the price. Neither is a good outcome.

To go where we want to go, there must be a disinterested calendar authority. And we as fans must expect and require fealty to it. If some organization dominates the battle to produce high quality high engagement high dollar events, then great. But if we allow an organization who is at some moment in the lead to wield the calendar club, then shame on us.

NOBODY who cares first and foremost about pool--player, fan, promoter--should fear a calendar authority.
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