What's wrong with pool? Look no further than NCIS 14.1championship

N

NYC cue dude

Banned
Because of the late hour, the final match was cancelled. Congrats to Steve lipsky and Dan Louie for fighting all weekend to reach the finals, but it seems there were some involved that didn't feel it necessary to complete the event. Dan Louie had a plane to catch and Steve finally forfeited.

The fans and sponsors deserved better. To hear the commentators complaining about how late it was for the last half of the lipsky/tetrault match was a travesty. To see pat Fleming point to his watch at the end of the broadcast couldn't have been more unprofessional.

Pool has tournaments with a $1500 prize for the winner, for a reason.

Randy Goldwater
 
Not to mention all the players who won the qualifiers and didn't show up.

The quality of the web broadcast stream was excellent though.
 
Frankly I thought that with the exception of Bourouty, Lipsky, Louis, and a few others, the level of play was quite poor. A national championship should have national championship quality players in it. Obviously, the purse precluded the participation of better players.

I've seen local tournaments offer larger purses. If I remember correctly, only 7 people showed up for the Colorado qualifier (and pretty much none of Colorado's top players).
 
Salamander said:
Frankly I thought that with the exception of Bourouty, Lipsky, Louis, and a few others, the level of play was quite poor. A national championship should have national championship quality players in it. Obviously, the purse precluded the participation of better players.

I've seen local tournaments offer larger purses. If I remember correctly, only 7 people showed up for the Colorado qualifier (and pretty much none of Colorado's top players).
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No matter who is playing it should go to the finish. imo.

BVal
 
I agree that the fans and sponsors deserved to have the final played out. However, let's keep in mind that a final going to 200 would probably have taken another 2-3 hours or more to complete.

Match play started about 11AM on Sunday and they finally called it quits around midnight. If the final would have been played, the tournament would have gone on past 3AM, which is ridiculous. To complete the final, Dan would probably have had to miss his 4AM flight.

So while it was disappointing that the final wasn't played, I think that somehow the fault lies within the grueling schedule. In the future, the tournament organizers may need to start the games earlier in the day or perhaps shorten the races and possibly impose a shot clock.
 
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So does this mean that Steve Lipsky doesn't have a spot in the World 14.1? That totally blows if true. Why don't they play to 125 or 150? If it's Dan Louie who has to leave then he should be the one to forfeit not the local guy. Well I hope Steve somehow gets a spot.

John
 
JB Cases said:
So does this mean that Steve Lipsky doesn't have a spot in the World 14.1? That totally blows if true. Why don't they play to 125 or 150? If it's Dan Louie who has to leave then he should be the one to forfeit not the local guy. Well I hope Steve somehow gets a spot.

John
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Actually, the top two got an invite, so that part did not matter. Steve already had an invite, so he did not really need that part of the prize but his finish paid his entry.

1st - Spot to the 2009 14.1 World Championship (value $565), an OB Cue exclusively designed by Danny Janes of Joss Cues for OB Cues (value $812.50), custom engraved Delta-13 rack, custom engraved solid crystal trophy, and $1550. (total package $3207.50)

2nd - Spot to the 2009 World 14.1 Championship (value $565), the new OB Cues Breakcue (value $385), and $1270. (total package $2220)
 
Playing the finals of 14.1 with a shot clock:o
I don't have anything against shot clocks but 14.1 shouldn't be clocked Imo.
It must be funny as shit to enter a tournament, fight till the final and then it's all over.Sorry we don't have the time to finish it.how bad can it get:eek:
 
dmgwalsh said:
Actually, the top two got an invite, so that part did not matter. Steve already had an invite, so he did not really need that part of the prize but his finish paid his entry.

1st - Spot to the 2009 14.1 World Championship (value $565), an OB Cue exclusively designed by Danny Janes of Joss Cues for OB Cues (value $812.50), custom engraved Delta-13 rack, custom engraved solid crystal trophy, and $1550. (total package $3207.50)

2nd - Spot to the 2009 World 14.1 Championship (value $565), the new OB Cues Breakcue (value $385), and $1270. (total package $2220)
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Looking at the prize packages, I suspect that neither player was really interested in the cues or the rack. The trophy looked nice, but the main pizes were the cash and the paid entry into the World Championship. The difference in the cash was only $270. Both players may have lost that much by either rescheduling a flight or missing a days work.

Although I would have loved to see the final match, I understand why they made the decision they made.

I suspect Steve bit the bullet and took the forfeit, because Dan had beaten him for the hot seat earlier in the day.

If you must point fingers in this situation, I think you have to point at the organizers for not keeping the tournament moving during the day. It seemed like slow play was not kept in check. IIRC, one of Dan Louie's matches took over 4 1/2 hours. It also seemed like players were allowed long breaks between matches. I understand that a player can't be expected to play back to back matches without a break, but the breaks have to be kept to a resonable amount of time.

This was the first national straight pool event for the NCS and I hope they will learn from it. All in all, it was a great event.
 
NYC cue dude said:
Because of the late hour, the final match was cancelled. Congrats to Steve lipsky and Dan Louie for fighting all weekend to reach the finals, but it seems there were some involved that didn't feel it necessary to complete the event. Dan Louie had a plane to catch and Steve finally forfeited.

The fans and sponsors deserved better. To hear the commentators complaining about how late it was for the last half of the lipsky/tetrault match was a travesty. To see pat Fleming point to his watch at the end of the broadcast couldn't have been more unprofessional.

Pool has tournaments with a $1500 prize for the winner, for a reason.

Randy Goldwater
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I will try to comment more in-depth later today but for now, I want to make it clear that the decision to stop play was entirely my own. Dan's flight was actually at 6am, not 4am, so he could have played.

That said, when I pulled holly, bill haley, and dan aside to talk about my decision, it met absolutely no resistance at all. It seemed to be understood by all that starting a final match at 12:30 am on a Sunday night was not a reasonable expectation I could have had when entering the tournament.

Had it not been for the almost FIVE hour match played at the start of day 2, the finals would have gotten underway no later than 10pm, which I certainly could have played.

Anyway, I do want to apologize to everyone watching the live stream, who were expecting one more match. All I can say is my hands were tied and I had no choice. I want to thank everyone involved as well, especially all my supporters who were following the matches online.

- Steve
 
Steve Lipsky said:
I will try to comment more in-depth later today but for now, I want to make it clear that the decision to stop play was entirely my own. Dan's flight was actually at 6am, not 4am, so he could have played.

That said, when I pulled holly, bill haley, and dan aside to talk about my decision, it met absolutely no resistance at all. It seemed to be understood by all that starting a final match at 12:30 am on a Sunday night was not a reasonable expectation I could have had when entering the tournament.

Had it not been for the almost FIVE hour match played at the start of day 2, the finals would have gotten underway no later than 10pm, which I certainly could have played.

Anyway, I do want to apologize to everyone watching the live stream, who were expecting one more match. All I can say is my hands were tied and I had no choice. I want to thank everyone involved as well, especially all my supporters who were following the matches online.

- Steve
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No reason to apologize, Steve.

Those of us that know you, could see the fatigue setting in on both you and Matt - so it understandable as to why you guys came to that decision.

I really enjoyed the stream yesterday - Pat and his staff should be commended - I'm so glad the storms didn't interrupt the stream! Holly did an outstanding job all weekend - and you played one hell of a tournament!

Just concentrate on getting yourself ready for the World Championships!
 
Great shooting Stevie, i was quite impressed with what i saw of you on the Live Stream.

You demeanor and tempo were dead on. You looked completly focussed and took total command of the Cue-Ball.

You showed all the ingrediants of a true Champion !!

And you certainly do not have to appologize, if i were in the same position i probably would of done the same.

Once again, Congrats and Great To See You Play!........ :thumbup:

Steve
 
john schmidt said:
shot clock would fix all that
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I agree. One of the matches to 150 took 5 hours.:eek:

They had a 45 second shot clock at one of the US Open finals and it worked out fine. The commentators were remarking that some of the more deliberate players seemed to be playing better when they were forced to get into a rhythm.

With the high numbers that Straight pool matches typically go to, I think a shot clock is a necessity if you are ever going to want to keep an audience.
Didn't someone say that there was a match between Mizerak and Lassiter on NBC or one of the networks that took forever and since then the networks quit broadcasting 14.1?
 
john schmidt said:
shot clock would fix all that
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John, a shot clock is a good idea. A better idea is to invite players who can run some balls so it isn't 3 and miss all day and then 10 bad safeties. The fact is there are very few young great straight pool players like yourself. At least 75% percent of the field was 9 ball players pretending they know how to play straight pool and some of those 9 ball players can't even play 9ball.

We need to leave straight pool to the real pro's the game requires a dedication and knowledge most don't have. To show up at this event like you can play the game and you have no idea is just a joke.
 
Didn't Sigel do his 150 and out versus Zuglan with a shot clock? I think a 45 second shot clock is more than fair.
 
GMAC said:
John, a shot clock is a good idea. A better idea is to invite players who can run some balls so it isn't 3 and miss all day and then 10 bad safeties. The fact is there are very few young great straight pool players like yourself. At least 75% percent of the field was 9 ball players pretending they know how to play straight pool and some of those 9 ball players can't even play 9ball.

We need to leave straight pool to the real pro's the game requires a dedication and knowledge most don't have. To show up at this event like you can play the game and you have no idea is just a joke.
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GMAC,

There are two issues here - the first was the level of play and the second was the lateness of the tournament.

The level of play should definitely have been higher, but this could easily have been solved by the players themselves. All they had to do was qualify. Any room could hold a qualifier for a small fee, and they had at least a few months to do it. That said, a qualifying system does present some challenges - many pro level players won't want to qualify, and I do understand that. Perhaps next year, a set of invites should be considered.

However, the lateness of the tournament was not related to this issue. The weaker players were weeded out on Saturday; Sunday's play was marred by one match which killed everything. It should be mathematically impossible for two guys who have each run 100 balls about a thousand times to play a race to 150 in 4 hours and 40 minutes. The fault was all with one player, who has a reputation for being a grinder. He's a fierce competitor and a great guy off the table, but in my mind he cost me a chance to play the finals. You have a responsibility to your fellow competitors when you play a tournament, and almost a five hour match from such a strong player is inexcusable and inconsiderate.

- Steve
 
john schmidt said:
shot clock would fix all that
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100% agree......a reasonable shot clock is part of ALL sports, why is pool immune from people that like to stall.....set a shot clock, provide an appropriate number of timeouts and extensions, and enforce it....you'll get more players, a larger audience, and better time management for all involved...

Sorry you had to drop out Steve, but it sounds like a FIVE hour match robbed you of a fair opportunity....

Congrats on the bid into worlds....
 
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