Hubert Cokes and Titanic Thompson

Hambone

Hambone

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I found this story in one of my books and thought some of you would enjoy it. This took place in Evansville Illinois. Evansville was described as a sort of Disneyland for gamblers after the discovery of oil there.

Always a pool player of some talent, Ti was no match for the premier players. He spent hours in the company of Hubert Cokes, regarded as one of the games best, hoping to find a way of improving his own skills, but to little avail. "Ti," Cokes once said, "I've been watching you play pool since California, and you aren't the worst I've ever seen. But dammit, you gotta face the fact that you aint ever gonna get no better. Pool's not something you've improved on, so my advice to you is to watch and bet your money on me. You're about the best card mechanic I know, and I wouldn't play you head-up with a gun in my back. But I'm the pool player around here."

It was hardly a false claim. On several occasions the legendary Minnesota Fats had traveled to Evansville to play one-pocket with Cokes and went home loser more often than not. Still, Fats was the recognized king of the game. For every trick Titanic Thompson had with a golf club, Minnesota Fats had two he could work on a pool table.

"Dammit, Hubert," Ti said, "I just got to try the Fat Man next time he comes to town. You set it up, okay?"

"Your a grown man," Cokes replied, "so I aint gonna lecture you on stupidity. You aint gonna beat him in a hundred years, but if you want to play him for a price, I'm sure he'd be more than happy to take your money.

It took a half dozen games and a total loss of $25,000 to finally convince Ti Thompson that he could find better ways to spend his time and money than playing one-pocket with Minnesota Fats.

"I reckon I got me an education," Ti told the amused Cokes. "I got to figure that guy's about half crazy in addition to being a helluva pool player. God, he never shut up. All the time he was playing he kept up this constant string of chatter. Not making much sense, just talking to hear his damn head rattle. Like to have drove me crazy."

"Ti," Cokes smiled, "that's just part of his game. Hell he had you so shook up and nervous he could have beat you with one hand."

Ti looked Cokes square in the eye. " If you ever tell this to a soul, I'll blow your brains out, but the god-awful truth of the matter is that's what the Fat Man did. The sonuva***** beat me one-handed."



Hope you enjoyed it. I've got another tale of Ti and Cokes when they were not on such good terms that I may post later. I'm tired of typing for right now.
 
The great Titanic Thompson, just one more who was no match for the Fat Man. I've been trying to tell you he was unique. There was never another pool hustler like Fats. He did know how to get the money. And don't ever make the mistake of thinking he couldn't play. Those "exhibitions" he put on later for television with Mosconi didn't amount to anything more than entertainment. Mosconi was glad to get the work, believe me.
 
Hambone,
Thanks for posting the story. "Daddy Warbucks" has a cult-like following to this day and when you get a moment, do a search of him on the AZB forums. Lot's of good info and stories.

My all-time #1 favorite Tush-Hog!
 
Thanks for the story. I hadn't heard that one before.

There's a whole book about Titanic Thompson by Carlton Stowers. It's available here: Palmer Magic. I have no connection except as a satisfied customer.
 
That is a great story! There is an out of print book about Ti called "The Unsinkable Titanic Thompson". It is full of stories like that.
 
jay helfert said:
The great Titanic Thompson, just one more who was no match for the Fat Man. I've been trying to tell you he was unique. There was never another pool hustler like Fats. He did know how to get the money. And don't ever make the mistake of thinking he couldn't play. Those "exhibitions" he put on later for television with Mosconi didn't amount to anything more than entertainment. Mosconi was glad to get the work, believe me.
Click to expand...

I agree with you Jay. I've often thought that if Fatty were alive and in his prime during the Derby City Classic's, people would be amazed at three things....1. His banking ability 2. His vastly under-rated 1P skills and 3. His persona would over-whelm many of the young hustler's who never had to fade the barrage of never-ending banter, comical bragadoccio and his ENDURANCE. In his prime, he had major league staying power. In his later (TV) years, Fats was satisfied just to get the check for appearing, torment the heck out of Sir Willie and just have fun playing his schtick to the crowd. Fatty loved animals and people almost the same. Maybe in that order!

So as not to hijack Coke's w/ Fatty stories, it's a fact that Hubert and Fatty were about as close as to each other as those two guys could get with anyone. Freddy* has an all time classic line regarding Cokes mentoring Varner. Freddy and I were going back and forth over how great a gambler Nick was. Cokes took him around and got him seasoned once Nick left Purdue University. In Freddy's two great books, he mentions that Cokes bestowed the time-honored moniker of "The Little Gorilla" on Varner because he (Cokes) had turned him into such a ferocious gambler. That's because Cokes took him under his wings and showed him the ropes of playing on the road. Well, I knew a lot of all that way before cause I've especially liked Cokes and love Varner. Anyway, me and the Beard were sparring, debating how "hard" a gambler Nick was. (I'm saying he was tough and I brought up his time w/ Hubert) As usual, he has the uncanny, almost God given ability, to use logic in the most unexpected places when debating the merits of the echelon of players from pooldom. He's got me dizzy on the ropes in our debate when he TKO's me with this time-capsule comment...."His (Hubert Cokes) road experience with Varner consited of him taking Nicky around town and making him the champion of the Evansville, Indiana Elk's Club"
:D
*Of all the pool players I've ever known, Freddy the Beard has the most unique way of debating. It's really a highly evolved art-form for him now. I've never seen him lose any debate with anyone, ever. I doubt he's EVER lost an argument or debate, going back to when he was in his Captain America outfit! I consider Freddy a true and very unique treasure to those of us who love our great sport. The only one I know of who can hang with him and has battled it out evenly on the keyboard w/ him has been San Jose Dick McMoran (SJDinPHX). He has the funniest cut up lines you'll ever hear and yet they just bounce of the Beard like wet peas off a boxcar!
 
Evansville

Hambone said:
I found this story in one of my books and thought some of you would enjoy it. This took place in Evansville Illinois. Evansville was described as a sort of Disneyland for gamblers after the discovery of oil there.

Always a pool player of some talent, Ti was no match for the premier players. He spent hours in the company of Hubert Cokes, regarded as one of the games best, hoping to find a way of improving his own skills, but to little avail. "Ti," Cokes once said, "I've been watching you play pool since California, and you aren't the worst I've ever seen. But dammit, you gotta face the fact that you aint ever gonna get no better. Pool's not something you've improved on, so my advice to you is to watch and bet your money on me. You're about the best card mechanic I know, and I wouldn't play you head-up with a gun in my back. But I'm the pool player around here."

It was hardly a false claim. On several occasions the legendary Minnesota Fats had traveled to Evansville to play one-pocket with Cokes and went home loser more often than not. Still, Fats was the recognized king of the game. For every trick Titanic Thompson had with a golf club, Minnesota Fats had two he could work on a pool table.

"Dammit, Hubert," Ti said, "I just got to try the Fat Man next time he comes to town. You set it up, okay?"

"Your a grown man," Cokes replied, "so I aint gonna lecture you on stupidity. You aint gonna beat him in a hundred years, but if you want to play him for a price, I'm sure he'd be more than happy to take your money.

It took a half dozen games and a total loss of $25,000 to finally convince Ti Thompson that he could find better ways to spend his time and money than playing one-pocket with Minnesota Fats.

"I reckon I got me an education," Ti told the amused Cokes. "I got to figure that guy's about half crazy in addition to being a helluva pool player. God, he never shut up. All the time he was playing he kept up this constant string of chatter. Not making much sense, just talking to hear his damn head rattle. Like to have drove me crazy."

"Ti," Cokes smiled, "that's just part of his game. Hell he had you so shook up and nervous he could have beat you with one hand."

Ti looked Cokes square in the eye. " If you ever tell this to a soul, I'll blow your brains out, but the god-awful truth of the matter is that's what the Fat Man did. The sonuva***** beat me one-handed."



Hope you enjoyed it. I've got another tale of Ti and Cokes when they were not on such good terms that I may post later. I'm tired of typing for right now.
Click to expand...
Cokes was from Evansville, Indiana not Illinois. No such place.
 
The book "Fast Company: How Six Master Gamblers Defy the Odds and Always Win" by John Bradshaw has chapters devoted to Titanic Thompson and Minnesota Fats. Also, Pug Pearson, Bobby Riggs, Tim Holland, and Johnny Moss.
 
Terry Ardeno said:
I agree with you Jay. I've often thought that if Fatty were alive and in his prime during the Derby City Classic's, people would be amazed at three things....1. His banking ability 2. His vastly under-rated 1P skills and 3. His persona would over-whelm many of the young hustler's who never had to fade the barrage of never-ending banter, comical bragadoccio and his ENDURANCE. In his prime, he had major league staying power. In his later (TV) years, Fats was satisfied just to get the check for appearing, torment the heck out of Sir Willie and just have fun playing his schtick to the crowd. Fatty loved animals and people almost the same. Maybe in that order!

So as not to hijack Coke's w/ Fatty stories, it's a fact that Hubert and Fatty were about as close as to each other as those two guys could get with anyone. Freddy* has an all time classic line regarding Cokes mentoring Varner. Freddy and I were going back and forth over how great a gambler Nick was. Cokes took him around and got him seasoned once Nick left Purdue University. In Freddy's two great books, he mentions that Cokes bestowed the time-honored moniker of "The Little Gorilla" on Varner because he (Cokes) had turned him into such a ferocious gambler. That's because Cokes took him under his wings and showed him the ropes of playing on the road. Well, I knew a lot of all that way before cause I've especially liked Cokes and love Varner. Anyway, me and the Beard were sparring, debating how "hard" a gambler Nick was. (I'm saying he was tough and I brought up his time w/ Hubert) As usual, he has the uncanny, almost God given ability, to use logic in the most unexpected places when debating the merits of the echelon of players from pooldom. He's got me dizzy on the ropes in our debate when he TKO's me with this time-capsule comment...."His (Hubert Cokes) road experience with Varner consited of him taking Nicky around town and making him the champion of the Evansville, Indiana Elk's Club"
:D
*Of all the pool players I've ever known, Freddy the Beard has the most unique way of debating. It's really a highly evolved art-form for him now. I've never seen him lose any debate with anyone, ever. I doubt he's EVER lost an argument or debate, going back to when he was in his Captain America outfit! I consider Freddy a true and very unique treasure to those of us who love our great sport. The only one I know of who can hang with him and has battled it out evenly on the keyboard w/ him has been San Jose Dick McMoran (SJDinPHX). He has the funniest cut up lines you'll ever hear and yet they just bounce of the Beard like wet peas off a boxcar!
Click to expand...

Thanks Terry. all these young kids who bet it up today at DCC and other places would have stood no chance with Fats. Put him in the midst of them all in the TAR Pit at DCC, and pretty soon he would be the only one talking, and the rest would be listeners. Once he had them in his grasp they were goners. They might as well just hand over their bankrolls. That's how much chance they would have. He mesmerized people and kept them in a daze until they were empty. :shrug:
 
jay helfert said:
Thanks Terry. all these young kids who bet it up today at DCC and other places would have stood no chance with Fats. Put him in the midst of them all in the TAR Pit at DCC, and pretty soon he would be the only one talking, and the rest would be listeners. Once he had them in his grasp they were goners. They might as well just hand over their bankrolls. That's how much chance they would have. He mesmerized people and kept them in a daze until they were empty. :shrug:
Click to expand...

Not all Jay.

I would have left my wallet in the safe deposit box and enjoyed the show. :thumbup:

Jim
 
jay helfert said:
Thanks Terry. all these young kids who bet it up today at DCC and other places would have stood no chance with Fats. Put him in the midst of them all in the TAR Pit at DCC, and pretty soon he would be the only one talking, and the rest would be listeners. Once he had them in his grasp they were goners. They might as well just hand over their bankrolls. That's how much chance they would have. He mesmerized people and kept them in a daze until they were empty. :shrug:
Click to expand...

...unless one of the pool players wasn't a pool player at all but a card shark and Fatty was his mark.
 
Right about that

jay helfert said:
TRUE! Fatty was a card sucker, I won't deny that.
Click to expand...

I watched Fatty get clipped by a hold out artist from Chicago. An Italian boy, first name Tony. (Even 50 years later I cant reveal a hustler's last name) He was playing Fatty, Knock Rummy, behind the bleachers in the tournament room in Johnston City. I think Fatty thought he was safe playing in the middle of all the spectators wandering around in back of the bleachers. But Tony was just too good, he was able to move right under the noses of those sweaters. Fatty dropped about $2500, a very nice taste in the 60s. I knew Tony and knew his MO, so I asked him if he had played Fatty on the square because of all the traffic around him. "You kiddin? I never play on the square. If he'd play, I'd try and move on God."

Beard
 
Thanks again, Terry

Terry Ardeno said:
I agree with you Jay. I've often thought that if Fatty were alive and in his prime during the Derby City Classic's, people would be amazed at three things....1. His banking ability 2. His vastly under-rated 1P skills and 3. His persona would over-whelm many of the young hustler's who never had to fade the barrage of never-ending banter, comical bragadoccio and his ENDURANCE. In his prime, he had major league staying power. In his later (TV) years, Fats was satisfied just to get the check for appearing, torment the heck out of Sir Willie and just have fun playing his schtick to the crowd. Fatty loved animals and people almost the same. Maybe in that order!

So as not to hijack Coke's w/ Fatty stories, it's a fact that Hubert and Fatty were about as close as to each other as those two guys could get with anyone. Freddy* has an all time classic line regarding Cokes mentoring Varner. Freddy and I were going back and forth over how great a gambler Nick was. Cokes took him around and got him seasoned once Nick left Purdue University. In Freddy's two great books, he mentions that Cokes bestowed the time-honored moniker of "The Little Gorilla" on Varner because he (Cokes) had turned him into such a ferocious gambler. That's because Cokes took him under his wings and showed him the ropes of playing on the road. Well, I knew a lot of all that way before cause I've especially liked Cokes and love Varner. Anyway, me and the Beard were sparring, debating how "hard" a gambler Nick was. (I'm saying he was tough and I brought up his time w/ Hubert) As usual, he has the uncanny, almost God given ability, to use logic in the most unexpected places when debating the merits of the echelon of players from pooldom. He's got me dizzy on the ropes in our debate when he TKO's me with this time-capsule comment...."His (Hubert Cokes) road experience with Varner consited of him taking Nicky around town and making him the champion of the Evansville, Indiana Elk's Club"
:D
*Of all the pool players I've ever known, Freddy the Beard has the most unique way of debating. It's really a highly evolved art-form for him now. I've never seen him lose any debate with anyone, ever. I doubt he's EVER lost an argument or debate, going back to when he was in his Captain America outfit! I consider Freddy a true and very unique treasure to those of us who love our great sport. The only one I know of who can hang with him and has battled it out evenly on the keyboard w/ him has been San Jose Dick McMoran (SJDinPHX). He has the funniest cut up lines you'll ever hear and yet they just bounce of the Beard like wet peas off a boxcar!
Click to expand...

Thanks for the plug, Terry, but before people get the wrong idea, Nickie Varner the Little Gorilla, is a stone killer. Sum***** still plays great. Anybody who can go to the Phillipines and play race to 120 with Efren Reyes and beat him is sumpthin' special.

Beard

San Jose Dick need to find himself a hobby in his dotage, like house cleaning or watering the lawn, and spend less time taxing his small brain on the forums.
 
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