Bad Commentary...

One thing is certain about pool commentary. No matter what you do someone is not going to like it and someone will say its awesome.

Doing a multi day event by yourself is tough. It is also boring as hell after awhile. For every great interesting match there is at least as many snoozers. Usually the streamer is all on his own and at the mercy of whoever volunteers to sit in. Sometimes the people who most want to sit in are not the ones who should. Tough spot.

The other thing is I dont know too many pro player level streamers. It gets kind of old for a B player to provide analysis after awhile. After the first 10 or 12 hours trying to do a "professional" job (forgetting that professionals get paid) it is VERY easy to start talking to the chat room. If just to keep you awake.

Anymore if I am streaming and stuck doing commentary I will just tell people "If you are looking for Billy Incardona or Grady I am not that guy and I can barely hit the end rail, nothing I tell you is going to improve your game, so go ahead and hit mute if you don't want to talk about how hairy Disco is or who got hammered and went off like a rocket at the dice table last night."

It is a really tough thing. I do not know the answer. The novelty of doing commentary has worn off and many pro's would rather just go rest or do whatever instead of sitting down to call a match. I cant say as I blame them. Even the ones who do sit down regularly can not be scheduled or counted on because their focus is not on the stream, they are there to play a tournament.

When you do things on very little to no money it is what it is. You ever see the credits after a tv show or football game and wonder what in the hell all those people do? They are the reason those broadcasts look and sound the way they do and it takes most of them to do it. And they all are paid a good wage to do it. To compare one guy with a little gear to them or even Accu-Stats is unfair.

justin,imho your 1 of the best,when you start getting bored or tired you get the chatters involved & its for the most part all pool related,even if it gets off track you always stay with the match thats streaming,i guess what im tring to say is you keep it fun & interesting & pool related,its a talent,learned,earned or just natural but you got it & your guests may know shopping,ect. but they talk pool.
 
One thing is certain about pool commentary. No matter what you do someone is not going to like it and someone will say its awesome.

Doing a multi day event by yourself is tough. It is also boring as hell after awhile. For every great interesting match there is at least as many snoozers. Usually the streamer is all on his own and at the mercy of whoever volunteers to sit in. Sometimes the people who most want to sit in are not the ones who should. Tough spot.

The other thing is I dont know too many pro player level streamers. It gets kind of old for a B player to provide analysis after awhile. After the first 10 or 12 hours trying to do a "professional" job (forgetting that professionals get paid) it is VERY easy to start talking to the chat room. If just to keep you awake.

Anymore if I am streaming and stuck doing commentary I will just tell people "If you are looking for Billy Incardona or Grady I am not that guy and I can barely hit the end rail, nothing I tell you is going to improve your game, so go ahead and hit mute if you don't want to talk about how hairy Disco is or who got hammered and went off like a rocket at the dice table last night."

It is a really tough thing. I do not know the answer. The novelty of doing commentary has worn off and many pro's would rather just go rest or do whatever instead of sitting down to call a match. I cant say as I blame them. Even the ones who do sit down regularly can not be scheduled or counted on because their focus is not on the stream, they are there to play a tournament.

When you do things on very little to no money it is what it is. You ever see the credits after a tv show or football game and wonder what in the hell all those people do? They are the reason those broadcasts look and sound the way they do and it takes most of them to do it. And they all are paid a good wage to do it. To compare one guy with a little gear to them or even Accu-Stats is unfair.

You always do a great job. Graddy,Danny D and Billy do real good work to IMO.It cant be easy to watch match after match,some of which arent very exciting and stay possitive so keep up the good work guys! Its appreciated!
 
My turn to vent, kicken made a good point on 1 subject & all we get is "its a free stream or turn off the sound", dont anyone stay on subject here. He's not knocking free streaming or anything else so save all the spin & i agree with what he's saying & i'll say it was the wpba stream,dustin does a great job commentating till he gets some giggling want to be who couldnt play a radio much less run 5 balls that wants to talk about shoes,hair styles & where theres a sale on latetest fashions.JoeyA knows how to do it & sneek in a story or ect. but stays focused on whats at hand.If you interested,theres a free buffet & all the free beer you can drink but all the food is burnt to a crisp & the beer went flat 2 years ago but whos complaining right, its FREE.

Unfortunately, I didn't hear the commentary and I try not to complain about much of anything. I try to look at the bright side of most things.

The truth of the matter is that everyone has different skill sets and some people are better at some things than others. The problem with livestreaming is that at a minimum there is a need for THREE people:
Number 1 is someone who is technically experienced or highly capable of trouble shooting live streaming problems. Experience with cameras is a big plus because if it doesn't look good, few want to watch. Number 2 is a coordinator or production manager. This person needs to be able to orchestrate and keep the live stream on schedule. Their duties should also include obtaining information for the commentators, (scoring on other matches, updates on what's happening elsewhere in the tournament room) and this information needs to be fed to the commentator(s) on an as needed basis. Finally there is the commentator who is kind of like the party guy who keeps the audience up to date as to what is going on and that person must also give THEIR perspective as to what they see at the table. The commentators need to be able to interact with their co-commentators in a positive fashion and keep the conversation interesting and on occasion, fun. It is their job to keep the party going strong.

None of these jobs are easy for one person to do, let alone all three. I feel certain that if I applied myself I could learn how to handle the production and the technical aspects of live streaming but it is not something that I am innately good at and would hate to have to wear that hat as well as that of the commentator. Providing data to the commentators has to be a labor of love and it is a vastly overlooked and important part of the successful live stream.

The bottom line is quality Live Streaming requires multiple people performing their respective jobs in a consistent manner. You can't do all three jobs over a long period of time and even if you do all three for a long period of time, you will fade from time to time and it will show to anyone who pays attention to what is happening with the stream. The guest commentators are a CRITICAL part of the Live Stream and choosing those people and making them feel and look good is another important part of the stream but the bottom line is if you want the best live stream with great production, great information and great commentary, you are going to have to pony up some dough to pay for it because at this time Live Streaming is struggling to pay for ONE person, let alone THREE or FOUR people.

It is fair to cut the live streamers (all of them) some slack because it is very difficult for one person to provide consistent high quality in all of these important areas.

There's nothing wrong with expressing some constructive criticism but I hope that everyone would be fair to the people who practically GIVE their time to OUR BENEFIT by providing the live streams and give credit where credit is due and appreciate the things that these different people do well and condone some of the areas where they don't meet up to speed with others.

ALSO, VERY IMPORTANT, if you are going to make public, negative comments about the streams, then what are you doing to make it better.
you purposefully supporting the stream with donations?

Are you regularly supporting the SPONSORS by purchasing their products or talking positively about their products?

Are you taking time out of your day to contact the sponsors about the live stream that they are paying for, at the very least thanking them for what they do?

Are you encouraging your friends and fellow poolplayers to visit the livestream?

How many of you have taught someone else how to find the streams or showed someone else how to join the chat room.

How many of you have talked to the league players in your room and told them about the Live STreams?

Feel free to add some other suggestions that could improve the live streams::::::

The list can go on and on. I'm not trying to admonish anyone but if you really like live streaming, consider helping with the problem. Maybe if we are all pulling in the same direction, Live Streamers will be able to afford to hire quality help. Until then, I say, cut them all a little slack.

Best Regards,
JoeyA
 
<snip> ALSO, VERY IMPORTANT, if you are going to make public, negative comments about the streams, then what are you doing to make it better.
you purposefully supporting the stream with donations?

Yes.

Are you regularly supporting the SPONSORS by purchasing their products or talking positively about their products?

I wouldn't say "regularly", but definitely, I do buy as needed and consider those mfg's who sponsor our sport.

Are you taking time out of your day to contact the sponsors about the live stream that they are paying for, at the very least thanking them for what they do? No, I haven't.

Are you encouraging your friends and fellow poolplayers to visit the livestream?

Absolutely, yes.

How many of you have taught someone else how to find the streams or showed someone else how to join the chat room.

I have.

How many of you have talked to the league players in your room and told them about the Live STreams?

I have.

Feel free to add some other suggestions that could improve the live streams::::::

The list can go on and on. I'm not trying to admonish anyone but if you really like live streaming, consider helping with the problem. Maybe if we are all pulling in the same direction, Live Streamers will be able to afford to hire quality help. Until then, I say, cut them all a little slack.

Best Regards,
JoeyA

Joey, believe it or not, I also like to look on the brighter side of things and am hardly a negative person. At the same time I am also a realist who knows that if you have something you are trying to sell, like live streaming of pool, packaging matters.

As a number of people mentioned, I could have just hit the mute button and watched the match allowing the pool to do the talking. And we can also do the same during football, baseball, basketball games, etc. However, isn't it a lot more enjoyable and exciting with the added dimension of knowledgeable, witty, humorous commentary?

Am I grateful for the privilege to see live streaming pool? You bet I am! I said so in my original post. I am also interested in seeing our sport, not only survive, but thrive, if possible. If the number of live stream viewers dwindle for any reason, this would be very discouraging to potential sponsors.

Looking through rose-colored glasses and ignoring something that seems to be broken isn't a good strategy IMO.

I did correspond with someone yesterday behind the scenes and shared some constructive criticism. And I wish the streamers nothing but success.

Best,
Brian kc
 
Joey, believe it or not, I also like to look on the brighter side of things and am hardly a negative person. At the same time I am also a realist who knows that if you have something you are trying to sell, like live streaming of pool, packaging matters.

As a number of people mentioned, I could have just hit the mute button and watched the match allowing the pool to do the talking. And we can also do the same during football, baseball, basketball games, etc. However, isn't it a lot more enjoyable and exciting with the added dimension of knowledgeable, witty, humorous commentary?

Am I grateful for the privilege to see live streaming pool? You bet I am! I said so in my original post. I am also interested in seeing our sport, not only survive, but thrive, if possible. If the number of live stream viewers dwindle for any reason, this would be very discouraging to potential sponsors.

Looking through rose-colored glasses and ignoring something that seems to be broken isn't a good strategy IMO.

I did correspond with someone yesterday behind the scenes and shared some constructive criticism. And I wish the streamers nothing but success.

Best,
Brian kc

Most COOL, Brian!
 
Maybe we shouldn't use criticism with the live streamers at all; whether it be constructive, or not. Maybe, instead, we should just make suggestions and requests. For example, I would like hear more commentary on the actual match in place, particularly the score. I know the score is shown on the screen of many streams and I could just look at that; but the score is also showing on the screen for the Bears-Giants game that is on TV right now, and I don't have to constantly check it because the announcers are keeping me updated so I can still follow the game while I'm typing this.

So this could possibly be a suggestion that the live streamers might want to consider?

Roger
 
I've given Rick Sanchez a tweet and he has agreed to provide commentary for the Mika vs SVB match. provided he receives recognition for his unmatched dictation skills and great personality. he says he can give John Stewart the seven and the breaks.
 
I've given Rick Sanchez a tweet and he has agreed to provide commentary for the Mika vs SVB match. provided he receives recognition for his unmatched dictation skills and great personality. he says he can give John Stewart the seven and the breaks.

Is this the Rick that called Obama, a cotton-picking president? A little infamy can go a long way in pool commentary or not.
 
Is this the Rick that called Obama, a cotton-picking president? A little infamy can go a long way in pool commentary or not.

your number of posts is infamous, the weight of knowing I might never catch up with you on post volume is heavy. I guess I will drown my inadequacy in jack daniels and reruns of cops. you win Joey! why do you and people like John Stewart keep relegating me to the second tier in posting prowess when I clearly deserve to be a first rate poster! Is it because you people can't relate to me growing up in the slums of the phillipines, scraping by on money won giving Efren, Jose and Francisco the 6 and the breaks, its unfair! (sobbing hysterically)
 
Seems like 8 of 10 live streams are actually social chat rooms that happen to have a live moderator and....Oh by the way there is some pool going on in the background........Some don't have a commentator at all....

No big deal to me

I just put the stream on split screen...I can do other things on the laptop while watching a stream.....If it does happen to have a good commentator that is more than just answering online questions....I will listen in.
 
Seems like 8 of 10 live streams are actually social chat rooms that happen to have a live moderator and....Oh by the way there is some pool going on in the background........Some don't have a commentator at all....

No big deal to me

I just put the stream on split screen...I can do other things on the laptop while watching a stream.....If it does happen to have a good commentator that is more than just answering online questions....I will listen in.

The point that is often missed on these forums is that a potential sponsor would care very much what is said on the stream because if they're putting money into an event they have this crazy thought that whatever happens is a reflection on them. Go figure. It's a pretty simple concept in the business world really but the streams continue on catering to the 15 percent of the audience that always shows up in the chat room. The heck with any professionalism and potential sponsors. The chat should happen somewhere other than on the actual broadcast. For the good of the sport.
 
I second that

No way can it be Pro-pool-broadcasting. Dustin it doing a fabulous job all around. I think his work in the booth is second to none. He knows how to cover all the bases. Talking with guests. Promoting sponsers. Solo commentary. Keep in mind he is doing the WPBA event all by himself !

Plus the video quality and overall set up ,color , etc.. was second to none .:thumbup:
 
Maybe we shouldn't use criticism with the live streamers at all; whether it be constructive, or not. Maybe, instead, we should just make suggestions and requests. For example, I would like hear more commentary on the actual match in place, particularly the score. I know the score is shown on the screen of many streams and I could just look at that; but the score is also showing on the screen for the Bears-Giants game that is on TV right now, and I don't have to constantly check it because the announcers are keeping me updated so I can still follow the game while I'm typing this.

So this could possibly be a suggestion that the live streamers might want to consider?

Roger

Roger;

One man's constructive criticism may be another man's helpful suggestions.

It could just be a matter of semantics. :thumbup:

Best,
Brian kc
 
Who the hell is John Stewart? Somebody tell me.

your number of posts is infamous, the weight of knowing I might never catch up with you on post volume is heavy. I guess I will drown my inadequacy in jack daniels and reruns of cops. you win Joey! why do you and people like John Stewart keep relegating me to the second tier in posting prowess when I clearly deserve to be a first rate poster! Is it because you people can't relate to me growing up in the slums of the phillipines, scraping by on money won giving Efren, Jose and Francisco the 6 and the breaks, its unfair! (sobbing hysterically)

Awwww, quit your sobbing Jesse. Go win a tournament and you will be back on top. :D Besides, you've got plenty of time to catch up to my pithy posts. :p

(Your one-handed videos are almost as a good as a tournament win, anyways.)

Now, you bring up John Stewart but I don't want to google him to find out who the hell he is. :p
 
The point that is often missed on these forums is that a potential sponsor would care very much what is said on the stream because if they're putting money into an event they have this crazy thought that whatever happens is a reflection on them. Go figure. It's a pretty simple concept in the business world really but the streams continue on catering to the 15 percent of the audience that always shows up in the chat room. The heck with any professionalism and potential sponsors. The chat should happen somewhere other than on the actual broadcast. For the good of the sport.

You may very well be right.

The chat room is a mine field and the streamers probably need to hire a professional chat room monitor. Live Streamers will now need more money. :D

Although, I do wonder how many people would show up for the broadcast if there was no chat.

You also make me wonder what the sponsors would prefer as far as the chat rooms are concerned because IT IS afterall, THE SPONSORS who pay for the FREE live stream broadcasts.

I can only imagine that the sponsors are trying to figure it out if the chat rooms are worth the effort.

Maybe some of the sponsors could make a contribution about this......
 
I think most people out there especially in 9 ball could really care less about someone commentating on every shot. I think one pocket the commentary is more insightful and interesting. My opinion is as long as you let people know the players, the game and what is going on like the race or money involved they are happy and interested.

Most of the stuff that goes on in the chats is not about the match and more about socializing. I try to keep the chat and commentary clean but its not easy especially if you play or step away for a moment, I have had people step in who should have not and some who step in and do an excellent job. It is what it is, low budget free shows, I am sure I could do a great play by play for a match or two but after a bit it gets old and boring sitting there. It is to each their own, some people want pro commentary on the match and others who know the game well are okay with some little updates and want to just BS.

I did probably the longest marathon match that was streamed, 30 hours with Frost and Preacher Ronn and I assure you I do not think any living human could have done a play by play for that. There were times when I just sat there totally quiet for a good amount of time, if someone asked for an update I would give it but trust me you get worn out. I do think people in the chat should be more respectful to the players, commentators and the people putting on the show instead of bashing them or acting like an idiot. I have lost patience with people who act like that and usually will just ban them. :smile:
 
For the most part, pool commentary is usually pretty good but there are instance's where the people in the booth get out of hand. Obviously it's best to have the most knowledgeable person doing the commentary but sometime's you have to take what you can get. One thing I find very classless is a commentator blantantly showing favoritism toward's one player. Everyone has a player they want to win but I can remember on several occasion's a commentator going out of their way to root for a player and against the other. It show's how unprofessional people can be, even those who have been in the business for a long period of time.
 
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