One bank fits all?
- Thread starter 3RAILKICK
- Start date
There is only one bank angle and it consistently remains the same for all banks shots. The only thing that differs from shot to shot is where you must hit the cue ball so that it is driven into the rail at that angle. Now English will certainly effect the angle of deflection from a a rail along with the speed which the ball is traveling, however, the actual angle never changes for long or short bank shot's.
Oh and by the way, my comments above only apply to single rail bank shot's.
JIMO
Last edited:
completely different skill set in my opinion.
there are very standard 2 and 3 rail shots in 1p that are played over and over again, along with the standard cross corner at the footrail.
short and full rack banks you must have a much larger knowledge of bank shots and 3 and 4 railers.
and angle in does not equal angle out...1p cueball control is essential because if you miss the other guy doesnt HAVE to bank....in banks, you will see a lot more "bank speed" shots (especially those cross sides) that you can hit naturally and not worry about finessing.
in my opinion its like comparing basketball to baseball because they are both played with balls.
Banks
I believe the biggest difference in one poc banks and banks in many other games is speed. Most 1 poc banks are with slow speed to leave OB close to your hole, and of course the use of English during that bank to not leave your opp a shot. Much more going on with cue ball in 1 poc shot. Banks in general are easier with more speed. In other games you only shoot banks when you get that almost perfect bank. In one poc you must shoot banks from odd angles which you would have avoided in other games. One poc banking requires more skill IMO. In other games a bank is usually a shot used when you miss your shape and have no other choices. In one poc you look for the bank and try not to leave your opp an easy bank. Also, again speed related, the banking of balls to YOUR side of the table in one poc. Bank on brother!
I believe the biggest difference in one poc banks and banks in many other games is speed. Most 1 poc banks are with slow speed to leave OB close to your hole, and of course the use of English during that bank to not leave your opp a shot. Much more going on with cue ball in 1 poc shot. Banks in general are easier with more speed. In other games you only shoot banks when you get that almost perfect bank. In one poc you must shoot banks from odd angles which you would have avoided in other games. One poc banking requires more skill IMO. In other games a bank is usually a shot used when you miss your shape and have no other choices. In one poc you look for the bank and try not to leave your opp an easy bank. Also, again speed related, the banking of balls to YOUR side of the table in one poc. Bank on brother!
in onepocket, being able to bank at pocket speed is crucial, same with being able to bank with total cueball control. Almost every bank shot in onepocket is getting your cueball right first, focus on the bank is second. There are some times when you get a free bank and then your focus is the bank first because of a large safe zone for the cueball.
Since in onepocket, you are only banking at one corner pocket, the other 4 pockets don't ever come into play, as far as banks are concerned. The large majority of onepocket banks are going to be short rail banks at the foot of the table. The next highest percentage would be straight backs from all different angles. Probably next would be the 2 railers that are close to the pocket uptable and the ones your shooting just past the side pocket to from the foot of the table. Then maybe the 3 railers.
Down at the foot of the table where the large majority of banks are...not only are you banking directly back to your hole, but you're also banking to come off the stack (caroms) or into the bottom rail ticki'ng off another ball. Or just banking back into a specific spot on another ball to drive balls to your hole. Down there at the foot, is where you really need to have your finesse game. You need to know every possible bank down there. All those touchy almost kiss banks that you got to put the special sauce on (remember, one small mistake down there and it could be game over)
So with onepocket... you need to know every conceivable bank there is, but your primary focus is always on the cueball. Which means that everything is twice as hard. You are trying to do 2 exact things. Leave the cueball in a exact spot and bank the ball at the perfect speed to either make it, hang it up or protect it.
In banks.. it's different. You get to hit the ball with speed because you are trying to eliminate any variables. You hit it clean and correct and it's not going to roll off or hit a spec of chalk if you hit with speed. It's easier to judge too. Onepocket has a lot of english based banks, bank pool, you want to stay away from english if you can. You are still trying to control the cueball but you have a much bigger area of where you can leave it. Bank pool is not all offense. There is a lot of defense to the game. You want to be able to take a shot at a bank, but if you miss the bank you want it going a certain area and you want the cueball a certain area. At some point you have to say I"m going to get shape on balls to run several, at the risk of selling out. You can't play 1 and duck all day.
I would say onepocket is a lot more finesse banking with emphasis on the cueball and banks is more shoot the shot strongly, but if you're going to miss, miss it on the right side and play your cueball so the other guy has no bank. Banks allow more creativity, because that's all you're trying to do is make a bank.
I love both games. Those are my 2 favorites by far.
Hope that helps. I'm rushing to type before go slave away for the man.
in onepocket, being able to bank at pocket speed is crucial, same with being able to bank with total cueball control. Almost every bank shot in onepocket is getting your cueball right first, focus on the bank is second. There are some times when you get a free bank and then your focus is the bank first because of a large safe zone for the cueball.
Since in onepocket, you are only banking at one corner pocket, the other 4 pockets don't ever come into play, as far as banks are concerned. The large majority of onepocket banks are going to be short rail banks at the foot of the table. The next highest percentage would be straight backs from all different angles. Probably next would be the 2 railers that are close to the pocket uptable and the ones your shooting just past the side pocket to from the foot of the table. Then maybe the 3 railers.
Down at the foot of the table where the large majority of banks are...not only are you banking directly back to your hole, but you're also banking to come off the stack (caroms) or into the bottom rail ticki'ng off another ball. Or just banking back into a specific spot on another ball to drive balls to your hole. Down there at the foot, is where you really need to have your finesse game. You need to know every possible bank down there. All those touchy almost kiss banks that you got to put the special sauce on (remember, one small mistake down there and it could be game over)
So with onepocket... you need to know every conceivable bank there is, but your primary focus is always on the cueball. Which means that everything is twice as hard. You are trying to do 2 exact things. Leave the cueball in a exact spot and bank the ball at the perfect speed to either make it, hang it up or protect it.
In banks.. it's different. You get to hit the ball with speed because you are trying to eliminate any variables. You hit it clean and correct and it's not going to roll off or hit a spec of chalk if you hit with speed. It's easier to judge too. Onepocket has a lot of english based banks, bank pool, you want to stay away from english if you can. You are still trying to control the cueball but you have a much bigger area of where you can leave it. Bank pool is not all offense. There is a lot of defense to the game. You want to be able to take a shot at a bank, but if you miss the bank you want it going a certain area and you want the cueball a certain area. At some point you have to say I"m going to get shape on balls to run several, at the risk of selling out. You can't play 1 and duck all day.
I would say onepocket is a lot more finesse banking with emphasis on the cueball and banks is more shoot the shot strongly, but if you're going to miss, miss it on the right side and play your cueball so the other guy has no bank. Banks allow more creativity, because that's all you're trying to do is make a bank.
I love both games. Those are my 2 favorites by far.
Hope that helps. I'm rushing to type before go slave away for the man.
excellent post
PP...Please quit talking about things you know nothing about. Manwon is essentially correct.
Scott Lee
Www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
Www.poolknowledge.com
No,there Is allways more than one angle to bank a ball.Sorry.John B.
John...I agree with you, which is why I said Craig is "essentially correct". Many banks (up to 70%) fall under the 'half ball aim' setup (which, imo, is what Manwon said). That said, speed and spin are still the determining factors for most banks. You, at least, are a champion player and banker. I've seen no proof that PP even plays pool at all, and as such, has no qualifications to make the statements he does.
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
IMO, the diggest difference is that in 1p you must be able to make every bank with every english. For various reasons you must park the cueball correctly off of most banks in 1p or you will sell out or leave your balls unprotected. More times than not I think you can find a more natural bank in bank pool where as in 1p i have to shoot that same bank with inside and overcut it, adjust speed etc.. to compensate.
IMO, the diggest difference is that in 1p you must be able to make every bank with every english. For various reasons you must park the cueball correctly off of most banks in 1p or you will sell out or leave your balls unprotected. More times than not I think you can find a more natural bank in bank pool where as in 1p i have to shoot that same bank with inside and overcut it, adjust speed etc.. to compensate.
I'm not sure if you mean that 70% of possible banks will work with a half ball aim, or if you mean that 70% of the banks you'll actually see during a game will work with a half ball aim, but either way I think you're oversimplifying the case. I almost never have a bank available for which the cue ball is perpendicular to the object ball. I'm usually hitting either nearly full or less than 1/4 of the object ball. True, you can generally line up the bank from directly across from the object ball, and find your "half ball hit" there, but the true point of aim from the cue ball is almost never half the ball.
I don't know, maybe I'm an idiot. PP is definitely an idiot, though, so I agree with that portion of your post.
Last edited:
OH OK I will leave it to the experts,
obviously many do not understand banking systems. I do not have the time to explain my comments, however, those who have been playing for a number of years clearly understand what I am saying.Oh and by the way, I am not lying to anyone and generally my posts are excepted as factual and knowledgeable. Just because you have not learned something or know something doesn't mean some one else is Lying or wrong it just means that your knowledge is limited.
Now for the future if you disagree with something I say please try and be a little more respectful in your response. Being rude serves no purpose and solves nothing it again only shows your lack of knowledge so Chill out Sparky!!!!!!
Have a wonderful day
Last edited:
John since you have answered in a manner that is respectful your post deserves discussion.
My comments were based upon single rail banks only. The angle required to make a single rail bank does certainly remain the same, however, like I said above speed, and English must be allowed for after contact with the rail which can change the angle of return off the rail to some degree.
With a center ball hit, top, middle, or bottom there is a standard angle that can be used for banks and kick shots. This is how you determine this angle and it is very simple to do. No matter if you are banking long or from side to side the angle will remain the same. To find it simply place a ball in either corner pocket and the cue ball in the opposite corner pocket with both balls being in the head string. Then shoot from the center of the corner pocket with the cue ball to the opposite side of the tables center diamond. If you have a good stroke and hit the ball center you will pocket the ball in the other corner pocket.
Next, place another ball in left side pocket (Dead Center) and place an object ball in either corner pocket on the same side of the table, shoot the cue ball to opposite side of the tables center diamond between the opposite side and corner pockets and you will make the object ball if your stroke is true and you hit the cue ball with center.
Now the angle from either one of those shots is your true bank angle. By simply taking your cue and placing it from the center of either of those pockets to the center diamond you can take that angle and apply it from different locations on any single rail bank.
Try it for yourself, it is easier to demonstrate that to explain in this manner.
Have a nice day Sir.
Hey bud,You do bring up some good points now and then but maybe you could be a little more nice about It. lol I'm not getting Into these arguments I was just stating the fact that banks can and do have more than just one angle.I mean no disrespect to Manwon.He's very right In that It Is very diffucult to explain In writing.Thanks,John B.
Ok Manwon,again sorry If I came off on that a little rough sounding.Well then let me say this, I can manipulate the angle.There's not a whole lot of times that I can't go above or below a ball that's blocking my path on the said bank. But i don't get Into or really care about the physics of pool.But I can show how to do It.You have a nice day to Sir.Thanks,John B.
Why would you quote yourself to talk about someone else's earlier post? You're not a very accurate jackass, are you?
how do you explain banks going long when hit soft and short when hit hard all with center ball hitting the same spot on the rail from the same spot with the same angle in
isnt that different angle out???
so to make it in the same pocket you would need to hit a different spot on the rail making a different angle in and out starting from the same place
Last edited:
Wait a minute.Draw on the cball makes the bank go long. Center or top english makes the bank come short.This Is no lie.This is the truth.I do know how to bank you know,right? It Is amazing alot of people been playing pool their whole lives and do not know this.If I wanted to I could turn the "teaching banks department" on It's ear,lol Anyway I'm done here.John B.