So is this a “shark attack” or not? Explain why or why not.

Pick one and please explain

  • Yes

    Votes: 41 63.1%

  • No

    Votes: 18 27.7%

  • Not sure

    Votes: 5 7.7%

  • Other

    Votes: 1 1.5%
  • Total voters
    65
As far as I'm concerned when there is a referee present the player not shooting should be sitting with his mouth shut.

Poor form on Archers part.
 
supergreenman said:
As far as I'm concerned when there is a referee present the player not shooting should be sitting with his mouth shut.

Poor form on Archers part.
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Agreed. It definitely was sharking.

When this occurred, this was debated extensively here on AZB. So the threads and interviews should still be around if someone wants to look for it...especially the interview that Samm Diep did with Johnny.
 
Agree with supergreenman. Why is there a referee there? When there is a referee present, you sit in your chair and let him do his job, like it or not.
 
I think Johnny knew it was kind of a shark move, but when he saw Ronnie's reaction, I feel from watching the video that he wish he hadn't done it and wished he could take it back.
 
You think Johnny would have done that if the ref wasnt there? try pulling that move while gambling in a back room somewhere and see how far that gets ya
 
Go to 1:50 of the interview to hear Samm interviewing Johnny about the controversy. JA wanted to ask the referee what the double hit rule was before Ronnie was ready to shoot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IP2j4TChSo

JA of all people should have known what the double hit rule was so the explanation that he gave during Samm's interview doesn't really cut it.
 
i think its a push shot by the sound of it (played it a few times) his tip hit the cue ball about 7 times.
when theres no ref you react like johnny did , does the ref know what a push shot is?
it was pretty straight and close ,he over cut it because of the fear of pushing it,thats how it was missed and he still did a push shot
 
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I don't think it was sharking at all. Is it up to the player to call a foul or does a referee call all fouls?

In all the tournaments I play in, the player calls the foul and the referee only watches and if a foul is called, the referee can agree.

Ronnie missed an easy shot and blamed it on Archer? That's too funny. My girlfriend does the same thing all the time.:smile:



After watching it again, he might of been shooting away, but without being jacked up, good chance of a double hit. I noticed he did jack up some when he did finally shoot it.

In a league I play in, if the cue ball is within a chalk width, you must jack up at least a 45 degree angle unless you are shooting away. This was almost a straight in shot so I don't blame Johnny one bit for asking.
 
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It is absolutely a shark. With a ref present, if it were a push or double hit, he will make the call. He knows the rules and doesn't need to be asked about it, expecially when JA's oppenent was just about to pull the trigger.

This is a prime example of why pool cannot get any main stream backing. Folks are always asking why can't pool get any respect, or TV exposure, and so forth.....and this is a prime example why. Total lack of class and sportsman ship.

Watch some of the snooker matches from Europe on youtube and you will see quickly why 1st place pays over $200,000 there, and pool here in the US is still rated as it is. They don't shark, they call fouls on themselves when the ref msses the call, they stay seated and quiet until it is their turn.....I could go on.....in a nut shell, it's the exact opposite of most things I see and hear in pool. I don't see pool getting out of the basement in my lifetime....it's really a sad state of affairs, and I hate that.
 
poolguy4u said:
I don't think it was sharking at all. Is it up to the player to call a foul or does a referee call all fouls?

In all the tournaments I play in, the player calls the foul and the referee only watches and if a foul is called, the referee can agree.

Ronnie missed an easy shot and blamed it on Archer? That's too funny. My girlfriend does the same thing all the time.:smile:
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If there is no referee present, I agree. You have to ask. When you are in a final match of a pro event, and the referee is present, he knows the rules and will make the call. No assistance is needed from the opposing player at the pro level providing the ref is calling the match.
 
Johnny couldn't have picked a worse time to "bring it up" than when he did.

This was a conscious deliberate action he made, not an accident. Timely sharking at its best.
 
poolguy4u said:
I don't think it was sharking at all. Is it up to the player to call a foul or does a referee call all fouls?

In all the tournaments I play in, the player calls the foul and the referee only watches and if a foul is called, the referee can agree.

Ronnie missed an easy shot and blamed it on Archer? That's too funny. My girlfriend does the same thing all the time.:smile:



After watching it again, he might of been shooting away, but without being jacked up, good chance of a double hit. I noticed he did jack up some when he did finally shoot it.

In a league I play in, if the cue ball is within a chalk width, you must jack up at least a 45 degree angle unless you are shooting away. This was almost a straight in shot so I don't blame Johnny one bit for asking.
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What tournaments do you play in that the referee sits and watches the match but doesn't call fouls?
 
I dunno what's in johnny's brain... could be "oh good, I have an excuse to mess with his rhythm, and get back to the table." ... or it could be "I know this might disrupt things a little but I feel obliged to ask so he doesn't get away with a foul." I'd like to think it's the latter.

He definitely knows it's disruptive, but you have a right to disrupt things if you think your opponent is about to commit a foul.

I know the theory is that he should just trust the ref to do his job, but close hits are a funny thing. Refs hesitate to call them or simply miss them, I'd certainly want the ref a bit closer to the table in this situation.

Many players don't know the distinction between close vs. frozen push shots, some consider frozen pushes legal and others don't, and of course various leagues have their own way of handling it like requiring you to jack up or shoot away from the ball. Because pool is so fractured, I don't know if there is a single, generally accepted rule about how the player must handle nearly-frozen balls. Maybe what's in johnny's head is "is there some rule for this event that says he's supposed to be jacking up here? If so, I should say something."
 
CreeDo said:
I dunno what's in johnny's brain... could be "oh good, I have an excuse to mess with his rhythm, and get back to the table." ... or it could be "I know this might disrupt things a little but I feel obliged to ask so he doesn't get away with a foul." I'd like to think it's the latter...."
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I say it is a lotta both.

I also say: just because the responsibility to do Ref duties in bestowed on one does not make him pool smart.
 
Ronnie has been in town for the past couple of weeks. Maybe I will ask him about this to see if he has changed his mind about this being a shark.

I've watched Ronnie play many times and he is as shark proof as you can get. I'm not saying he is an angel or not. I'm just saying he is "seasoned" and can block distractions as well as anyone but sharking gets to EVERYONE, mostly at the worst of times and this was no different.

Sharking, whether intentional or not is EFFECTIVE even against the BEST.
 
JoeyA said:
What tournaments do you play in that the referee sits and watches the match but doesn't call fouls?
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Moose states, Eagles states, and Tap League. Also, once a year there is a 4 man team tournament at the Hanover Eagles in PA where only players can call a foul, not the ref. Runkle's rules tournament. All is invited.


I think it is in September or October if anyone is interested. :thumbup:
 
i think its a push shot by the sound of it
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There is a difference between a push and a double hit.

Johnny said in the interview that it looked to him like RW was stroking straight thru.

JA wanted to know what the ruling was, of course he knew. That wasn't his first rodeo.

With a ref present watching the shot, he can't jump in and tell RW that he is
going to foul. He can only call a foul if the shot was contested by JA, and then say, yes, it was a foul.

If JA thought Ron was going to foul, why didn't he sit in his seat and call a foul after Ron shot. The ref was watching, therefore, he would have
supported JA call if it had been a foul.

Therefore yes, it was a Shark on behalf of JA.

EDIT: Watched the play several times over. Ron was jacked up and shooting away from the 5. From where JA was standing, the shot was quite obvious that Ron was shooting a legal shot. The excuse that it looked like he was going to shoot straight thru is just that, a cheap excuse.

JA said that he tried to jump in before Ron was down on the shot. BS. Ron was ready to shoot a second before JA stopped the action.
 
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I wouldn't call it sharking. He asked a legitimate question and apologized to his opponent for interrupting him. The biggest problem is that pool players are hot heads and get all flustered over the tiniest little thing. It also gives them excuses when they lose. I think we ALL know that the referee's don't always know all the rules, as much as we expect them to. Johnny saw something suspicious and called it to make sure.
MULLY
we've all seen arguments erupting when a ref made the wrong call and there was nothing you could do about it
 
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