Billiards Digest Hits the Nail on the Head

[duckie]

There is nothing wrong with playing for money and making side bets. It's when there is dumping and hustling like in the TCOM does it become a issue. Imagine having savers in golf, football or poker.

In other words, it's not the gambling but how the gambling is done, on the up and up or not.

What's really hurting is the history of late or no pay outs for tourneys. I truely believe the IPT format would be a good start. It will take sometime to build up the confidence needed to bring in some outside sponsors to pool. They need to be made aware of a untapped market for their goods.

Examples of outside sponsors could be along the lines of footwear, clothing, and so on.

But this is really for those now playing. What this article shows the lack of understanding of where future players will come from to help keep supporting something like the IPT. Meaning kids and seniors. See I'm in the latter group,but only at 58, I still got time and the health to try pro level pool, but not in it's current state.

The growth of pool is a multifaceted problem and as such, not one solution will work.

 

[Bob Jewett]

Until the American pool culture comes to recognize that being intimately associated with gambling is one of the forces preventing pool from blossoming, nothing will change.

On the other hand, at the last World Nine Ball Championships I attended you could place bets on each match right at the event. It had 60 hours of live TV coverage. I think betting parlors are the largest sponsors of snooker now.

 

[Bob Callahan]

Gosh, I forgot to mention the ever-popular America's Funniest Home Videos in my earlier list.

As for gambling, America has a love/hate relationship with it. It's kind of like porn--some of the biggest public opponents are secretly at home (and, strangely, sometimes at work) gobbling it down as fast as their broadband can serve it.

Besides, Your Honor, playing for money isn't necessarily the same as gambling....

 

[softshot]

pool needs a movie LOL what a joke.. movies don't make things popular.. movies are made about popular things...

the pool/movie thing is like finding a hundred dollar bill on the street and spending the rest of your life starving on that street waiting for another hundred to show up..

pool is top shelf everywhere on earth except USA because American players are lazy gamblers.. the game has no integrity.. the money is chopped up before anyone hits a ball... they don't challenge themselves they won't play any game that they are not sure to win.. it's a joke...

the problem with American Pro pool is American Pro players.. it really is that simple

 

[book collector]

Mike Panozzo's From the Publisher column has once again hit the nail on the head ---> HERE.

Everybody *does* say what pool needs is another movie. Yet, when something pops up in mainstream media about pool, nobody takes the bull by the horns and runs with it. Now it's too late for the Prince Harry frenzy, but the opportunity was there, just waiting for the taking.

I always said that ice skating got put on the map when Tanya Harding whacked Nancy Kerrigan in the knee. Thereafter, all eyes were glued on ice skating. It rose in popularity tenfold. :grin-square:

Most pool enthusiasts agree that pool needs a boost in the United States, but nobody can agree on how to accomplish this task. Sure, a movie would be great or even a well-written book. A biography of the Stu Ungar of pool might be the ticket. The pool action junkies would love it, but the pool purists would thumb their nose at such an endeavor and claim a book like this would push pool further down in its proverbial gutter. :sorry:

There's a lot of megalomania in pool today. Big egos tend to discount the efforts of others, unless they're involved, of course. Oftentimes pool events are criticized before they gain traction by the American pool culture. I am reminded of the "Galveston, Oh, Galveston."

I'll leave my thoughts about the BCA aside for purposes of this thread, but I believe there is a glaring problem the BCA needs to address, and that's its own negligence of professional pool. :wink:

Until the American pool culture can come to an agreement that gambling, pool's dirty little secret, just might be the accelerant to launch pool to the next frontier, nothing will change. Pool will continue along its merry little way to oblivion, ending up in a status similar to what back yard croquet is today. :embarrassed2:

This is yet another one of those threads about what's wrong with pool, I agree. Maybe someday, somebody, somewhere, somehow will effect a change in pool without getting shot down before they get off the ground.

I have a long list of people I want to whack on the knee, maybe it's time to quit procrastinating.

 

[Elwood]

I've said it before...do a reality tv show (I mean come on! If America will watch Honey Boo Boo Child, they'll watch anything) and...a bio pic of a compelling character from a compelling age. Either Greenleaf or St. Louis Louis. I like either one...Greenleaf can span the thirties and forties, costume dramas, gangsters, addiction, history, it's all compelling and all there. Louis Roberts is the same with the added appeal of the recent timing--many would love it because it will remind them of their youth. The soundtrack alone will make millions! Both characters were good looking, deeply flawed characters that actors would kill their agents to play.:grin-square:

I couldn't agree more regarding Ralph Greenleaf! I've been saying for years that a movie about him, done right, obviously, would do well. What an interesting, tragic life he lived. I could picture Russel Crowe portraying Greenleaf. When I hit the lottery, I'm going to finance a film about Ralph...

 

[abs]

...We just dont have any players that can get the public's attention. These guys are not worth watching and the pool media hasnt created any buzz around them either...

I certainly think Earl is certainly worth watching from an entertainment perspective. I don't mean watching the train-wreck moments, I don't find other peoples mis-fortune nor mis-behavior entertaining. But rahter those times he's doing well but still expressing himself. It's interesting to see him master the game, to hear his unfiltered thoughts, and frankly he is pretty funny when he's in a good mood.

A pool movie with a fictional character inspired by Earl, if not about Earl himself, would be pretty interesting IMO.

 

[CreeDo]

But I'm extremely worried about the casting....if the moron who put
Tom Cruise up to portray Jack Reacher has a say in it, I'll barf.

Man you aren't kidding. I mean, sometimes we get surprised (heath ledger as the joker) but reacher is supposed to be a hulking 6'5", 250 giant who looks like (in the author's own words) "a condom stuffed with walnuts". And dirty blonde, and a bit homely.

So they pick the shortest black haired pretty boy they can find?!

In my mind, reacher looks lik Randy Couture. Maybe with less f'ed up ears and a touch more hair.

 

[jackpot]

Gamblers lazy ???

Pool was dead in the water until The Hustler came out. Does anyone
think there was a big pool boom and then the movie. Try to pay the
rent, food, etc. gambling and be lazy. When Pool was in it's hayday
there were a lot of scufflers around. They didn't have 9 to 5 jobs but
they sure as hell weren't lazy. They worked hard at what they did 16
18 hrs a day, sometimes 2 or 3 day straight 7 days a week just to make
the nut. The movie showed the gritty, shady side of the game and people
loved it. Does anyone think that if the movie would have been about
Paul Newman being a gentlleman that only played leagues and tournaments
that it would have been a hit. People love the bad guy image. With pool
there was all the characters, the gambling , and what not they could be
a part of it. You couldn't be a cowboy, or Clyde Barrow but by GOD you
could be a pool hustler,and that was cool.
jack

 

[duckie]

Pool was dead in the water until The Hustler came out. Does anyone
think there was a big pool boom and then the movie. Try to pay the
rent, food, etc. gambling and be lazy. When Pool was in it's hayday
there were a lot of scufflers around. They didn't have 9 to 5 jobs but
they sure as hell weren't lazy. They worked hard at what they did 16
18 hrs a day, sometimes 2 or 3 day straight 7 days a week just to make
the nut. The movie showed the gritty, shady side of the game and people
loved it. Does anyone think that if the movie would have been about
Paul Newman being a gentlleman that only played leagues and tournaments
that it would have been a hit. People love the bad guy image. With pool
there was all the characters, the gambling , and what not they could be
a part of it. You couldn't be a cowboy, or Clyde Barrow but by GOD you
could be a pool hustler,and that was cool.
jack

Actually, it shows the gritty,shady side of people which has nothing to with the game itself.

There has not been a picture about pool, about the love of the game and not of the money.

How bout a reformed hustler, that opens a room in a not so nice place in order to give the kids somewhere to go instead of street gangs, drugs crime and so on.

Show how working hard at learning and playing pool translates into everyday life. That not everyday is a walk in a park just like some table layouts in a match are not a easy run out, if at all. Just like in a game where you have problem balls to deal life, everyday life is the same way. That what matters in both cases is not what the problem is but how to best deal with it.

Have a moment, where during a game, one of the kids fouls a ball but he is the only one that knows. Show how they decide to do the right thing unlike Strickland during a Skins match on tv where the only person that did not see him foul a ball was the ref and as such did not call the foul on himself. Prime example of winning is more important than how you win.

Through in a love angle, drama between the bad elements and good elements. But whatever, show how pool can be used to enrich a person life. Anyway......

Just a thought.

 

[The Kiss]

Here is an idea film the goings on in a pool room for the year, film all the BSn, woofing, Gambling, Guys telling stories, fights, ring games, odd ball characters, road agents, the fixer, the hot head, the born loser, the lock smith and about a 100 more. Some of the shit I have seen I could make a comedy, drama, love story..

If Caddyshack was an epic comedy there is no reason a poolroom movie couldn't be just as funny. Forget just basing it on the hustlers base it on all the other shit that goes on people can relate too.

Call it A Well Spent Youth...

 

[Maniac]

Okay, I've got THE idea for a pool movie.

Base the movie around the ABP. Make the scenes show how pitiful and demanding the members are. Show how egotistical the leader of the group is. Towards the end of the movie there can be a tournament where only ABP members are attending and playing. Make an argument break out between two players during a match which escalates into violence. Have them swinging cue sticks at each other, beating one another senseless with broken butts and stabbing each other with split shafts. Make the fight spread to all the players in the tournament, kind of like the final scene in "Blazing Saddles". Use real players (not doubles or stuntman) and real cuesticks !!!

J/K of course. I'm not really an advocate of violence. But....the ABP needs a slap in the face, imo.

Maniac

 

[Fatboy]

pool needs a movie LOL what a joke.. movies don't make things popular.. movies are made about popular things...

the pool/movie thing is like finding a hundred dollar bill on the street and spending the rest of your life starving on that street waiting for another hundred to show up..

pool is top shelf everywhere on earth except USA because American players are lazy gamblers.. the game has no integrity.. the money is chopped up before anyone hits a ball... they don't challenge themselves they won't play any game that they are not sure to win.. it's a joke...

the problem with American Pro pool is American Pro players.. it really is that simple

Yes and no

Yes a movie about pool is a joke, hell look at how popular poker is and how many poker movies are there? Hollywood is not making the best movies any longer and I doubt we ever get a pool movie again for many reasons.


The American Pro's, the problem there is too many guys chasing $300,000 in total $$$ every year, so yeah deals happen. Its hard to be a pro at pool and make $$$, there are 4 or 5 guys doing it. And the guys who are at the top do have integrity. Blaming the best players for the problems of the whole thing is not accurate, sure they mite could do better but they they don't have the $$ to fix pool, it might not be fixable like what JAM compared it to, backyard croquette.

 

[markgw]

I certainly think Earl is certainly worth watching from an entertainment perspective. I don't mean watching the train-wreck moments, I don't find other peoples mis-fortune nor mis-behavior entertaining. But rahter those times he's doing well but still expressing himself. It's interesting to see him master the game, to hear his unfiltered thoughts, and frankly he is pretty funny when he's in a good mood.

A pool movie with a fictional character inspired by Earl, if not about Earl himself, would be pretty interesting IMO.

I like this idea...I would bet Earl has quite a story that could possibly inspire a great script. What other sport or game can be mastered by someone and they are never really compensated financially or even respected for their accomplishments. I think it would drive me just a little bit crazy too. Earl is probably the greatest 9 ball player that ever lived and most people these days watch him play hoping he will go into raving lunatic mode. It's a bit sad really, I happen to be one that always routes for him to win. If anyone ever made a movie about a kid that started out playing pool in a barn in NC, that becomes a World Champion that goes on tilt, I know I would go see it.....There has to be an interesting story in there somewhere"-)

 

[classiccues]

Not enough good will ambassadors. What you need is pool to get a global contribution. If every room had one or two nights a month free to the public, with a GOOD teacher and GOOD trick shot artist putting on a clinic you would start to raise interest. It takes a lot of work to build this in a community, let alone on a large scale. Flyers, social media, there has to be a blitz of campaigning. But even this has flaws.

It has to be on a concerted effort, a movie is hit or miss. Heck, Baltimore Bullet really didn't do much. Its very hard to make a good movie, what if they make one and it flops.. and does the opposite of what you are looking for? When someone says "we need a new movie", what I read is pool is to lazy or not good enough to stand on its own. Don't wait for a movie, it might be to late when you get one.

From the rail I don't see much in terms of trying to rope in new players, or expanding general interest in pool. With new media outlets, I think there is a huge untapped reservoir of possibility.

Rooms need twitter and face book. Instant updates, when a crowd is forming, friends tell friends and now its instantanious. Room owners with bars need to a staff member who is social media knowledable. Again, this is untapped potential.

The world is changing, and pool is like the 80 year old driver in the fast lane.

JV

 

[Maniac]

I like this idea...I would bet Earl has quite a story that could possibly inspire a great script.

You guys are kidding, right???

With the exception of being able to shoot pool with great success over the years, I imagine Earl's life is pretty much mainstream. He hasn't done anything out the ordinary in comparison to millions of Americans in their everyday living. Boring to say the least.

Of course, I guess the writer/producers/directors could "Hollywood" the story up with so much ballyhoo and mistruths that possibly something entertaining COULD come from it.

I doubt it.

Maniac

 

[Rick S.]

You guys are kidding, right???

With the exception of being able to shoot pool with great success over the years, I imagine Earl's life is pretty much mainstream. He hasn't done anything out the ordinary in comparison to millions of Americans in their everyday living. Boring to say the least.

Of course, I guess the writer/producers/directors could "Hollywood" the story up with so much ballyhoo and mistruths that possibly something entertaining COULD come from it.

I doubt it.

Maniac

You got to be kidding...

the 'ordinary' American has never been a 6 time world champ...hasn't been to 50 something countries, hasn't been a club champion. (golf)

Hasn't been very many 'dull' moments in Earl's life...he's far from ordinary.

 

[Maniac]

You got to be kidding...

the 'ordinary' American has never been a 6 time world champ...hasn't been to 50 something countries, hasn't been a club champion. (golf)

Hasn't been very many 'dull' moments in Earl's life...he's far from ordinary.

So what is it about the feats you mention that would draw in the American public to a theater?

I'm not saying that some of the things Earl has done are not great. They just aren't the type of things movies are made of. Heck, I've got professional sport franchise owners in my neck of the woods that have probably done more things that Earl has (Mark Cuban, Jerry Jones), but you don't see Hollywood running to make movies about them do you?

Just because we, as avid pool fans, think we need to see another pool movie come about, doesn't mean the average American, paying moviegoer is going to jump through hoops to see one. Hell, you can't even get them to watch pool on TV "on the cheap"!!!

Earl Strickland = one of the greatest poolplayers ever!!!

But.......it's JUST pool :sorry:.

Maniac

 

[chevybob20]

Mitch...While I agree with you in principle, look at mainstream gambling in this country already. Nearly every state has indian casinos. Many states have state lotteries, and of course the national lotteries cause people to buy tickets in a frenzy, when the prize pots go up over a couple hundred million dollars. Nobody criticizes these gambling outlets, and almost everybody participates on some level. Gambling is rampant in our society, and certainly causes any number of social ills and addictions. I don't know what the answer is, but I'm not sure either you or JAM are right.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

It's not the gambling, it's the hustling and the image of what goes along with it.

 

[punter]

So what is it about the feats you mention that would draw in the American public to a theater?

I'm not saying that some of the things Earl has done are not great. They just aren't the type of things movies are made of. Heck, I've got professional sport franchise owners in my neck of the woods that have probably done more things that Earl has (Mark Cuban, Jerry Jones), but you don't see Hollywood running to make movies about them do you?

Just because we, as avid pool fans, think we need to see another pool movie come about, doesn't mean the average American, paying moviegoer is going to jump through hoops to see one. Hell, you can't even get them to watch pool on TV "on the cheap"!!!

Earl Strickland = one of the greatest poolplayers ever!!!

But.......it's JUST pool :sorry:.

Maniac

A movie based on Earl Strickland would of course be fictionalized to an extent. There has to be a story, with some kind of interesting ending. Earl's still writing his own story. Earl is an interesting character, besides his amazing pool accomplishments. There's lots of material there, IMO. I still like Ed Norton to play Earl.