Everyone has been paid at the US OPEN

[jay helfert]

All of the checks will cash. They carry the signature of Art Wiggins and Art is the real deal when it comes to finances. If pro pool ever does get a true organization to guide the game I would hope that Art and SJM are involved from the financial side. Both are proven winners with 360 degree vision.

This is good news if Art is involved. I'd damn sure rather see his name on a check than BB. I suspect Johnny had the most trouble getting Barry to turn over control of all the entry fee money. Barry has always had a problem letting go of the prize money. He'd rather pay in increments like it's his own personal credit card account.

 

[Johnnyt]

With out Mr. Wiggins was the money there? Johnnyt

 

[JAM]

Jam, FYI the money is NOT secondary to the majority (or the minority) of the pro players! Not by a long shot. In fact, if not for the money most of them wouldn't be there. Titles don't pay the bills!

I understand your thoughts, but for some of the players, I believe that they pay all those expenses and travel around the world to attend the U.S Open in Virginia for the title. It is something that most professional players would really like to have on their portfolio.

That said, I am not saying they would like to play for free just to win the title and not get paid. I did not mean to infer that, but on AzBilliards, no matter how one writes something, the words they choose to express their thoughts/opinions, these words sometimes are misinterpreted to mean something other than what is the message the person is trying to relay.

I personally do believe that the title is worth more to some players than the monies they win. After all, there can only be one winner. After expenses in an 8-day-long tournament, after savers, after taxes, after any chop-chops with backers, you really do have to win, place, or show in the Open to break even. So a player traveling from, say, Philippines, as you so eloquently state is not cost effective for the Filipinos, the 30-hour travel from Philippines to Virginia, the payouts are not very attractive at the Open, but that championship title is quite inviting to a pro player and may be more meaningful than the money they would win. :smile:

 

[PoolSharkAllen]

I actually believe that the majority of full-time pros who compete in the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship, the most important thing is that title. The money is secondary.

So you're saying that the top pros prefer getting the title over the 30K first prize? The misinformation you're putting out is unbelievable. It's no wonder so many people here have you on Ignore.

 

[JAM]

So you're saying that the top pros prefer getting the title over the 30K first prize? The misinformation you're putting out is unbelievable. It's no wonder so many people here have you on Ignore.

If I am on your ignore, that is a good thing, because I don't value much of what you post on this forum. In fact, you surf this forum on a daily basis to insult and ridicule any thread or post you can find. It's what you do. It's not just me; it's any thread or post you can find to add an insult. You very rarely contribute pool-related content. In fact, it is members like you that put AzBilliards on ignore for many readers.

 

[wayne]

So you're saying that the top pros prefer getting the title over the 30K first prize? The misinformation you're putting out is unbelievable. It's no wonder so many people here have you on Ignore.

It is probably a close call. A survey of the pros would probably tell which is more important. One does not exclude the other. Most important "The Title" 2nd most important "The Cash". Or Most Important "The Cash" 2nd most important "The Title".

I am very certain that if they only got one or the other they would all take the CASH but that wasn't what Jam was saying.

I just wish Keith had won the Title the year he came 3rd. For him the Title could have been 100 times more valuable that the cash.

Wayne

 

[JAM]

...I just wish Keith had won the Title the year he came 3rd. For him the Title could have been 100 times more valuable that the cash.

Thank you for the kind words about Keith. You do understand exactly what I was trying to say.

That money is long gone, and after the travel expenses, the entry fee, the lodging, the dog kennel fee, the 10 percent saver, and taxes, Keith's third-place prize monies ($10,000), there was not much of a profit. And we were still stuck in tournament expenses from attending two, three, and four tournaments a month on the tournament trail.

Winning the Open would have been a permanent accomplishment to be proud for Keith the rest of his life.

At that tournament in 2003, if they had played the finals Saturday, Keith would have won, the way he was hitting 'em. But they played until 4 a.m. in the morning, and the semifinals began at 12 noon the next day. The rest of what happened is in Keith's book.

 

[jay helfert]

Thank you for the kind words about Keith. You do understand exactly what I was trying to say.

That money is long gone, and after the travel expenses, the entry fee, the lodging, the dog kennel fee, the 10 percent saver, and taxes, Keith's third-place prize monies ($10,000), there was not much of a profit. And we were still stuck in tournament expenses from attending two, three, and four tournaments a month on the tournament trail.

Winning the Open would have been a permanent accomplishment to be proud for Keith the rest of his life.

At that tournament in 2003, if they had played the finals Saturday, Keith would have won, the way he was hitting 'em. But they played until 4 a.m. in the morning, and the semifinals began at 12 noon the next day. The rest of what happened is in Keith's book.

Jam, I will agree with you on one thing. When Keith caught his gear, he left everyone else (even Earl) in the dust! I saw it happen more than once. He blew away the best players in the world when he won the B.C. Open in '86. Rempe, Miz, Sigel....they all went down for the count! :thumbup:

 

[JAM]

Jam, I will agree with you on one thing. When Keith caught his gear, he left everyone else (even Earl) in the dust! I saw it happen more than once. He blew away the best players in the world when he won the B.C. Open in '86. Rempe, Miz, Sigel....they all went down for the count! :thumbup:

Billy Incardona was commentating on Keith's match against Jose Parica on the TV table on Saturday night at the 2003 U.S. Open, and he said the way Keith was hitting 'em, there was nobody in the tournament that was going to beat him. He was hitting 'em that strong, making two-rail long banks, three-rail short banks, and cutting those balls in like they had eyes. I mean, it was beautiful for me sitting on the rail. Jose wasn't liking it too much.

Keith's legacy will be how you knew him, Jay. As you know, he's never been much of a tournament soldier, but that's what he had to do when he met me, was go to tournaments. The action days of pool's golden years in the '80s were long gone. I envy you in that you saw Keith in his prime.

With all the bashing on this forum between various pool entities, the one thing Keith has always said is "Don't ever forget who you are." You both were very fortunate to enjoy pool at a time when it was the best high in the world.

 

[Neil]

It is probably a close call. A survey of the pros would probably tell which is more important. One does not exclude the other. Most important "The Title" 2nd most important "The Cash". Or Most Important "The Cash" 2nd most important "The Title".

I am very certain that if they only got one or the other they would all take the CASH but that wasn't what Jam was saying.

I just wish Keith had won the Title the year he came 3rd. For him the Title could have been 100 times more valuable that the cash.

Wayne

Correct, they "need" the cash, so they would chose that over the title. But, they "want'" the title more than the cash.

 

[JAM]

Correct, they "need" the cash, so they would chose that over the title. But, they "want'" the title more than the cash.

Neil, you would be a great speech writer. That is exactly what I was trying to say, yet you did it much more succinctly than I. If I ever run for office, I'm gonna hire you. :wink:

 

[Neil]

Neil, you would be a great speech writer. That is exactly what I was trying to say, yet you did it much more succinctly than I. If I ever run for office, I'm gonna hire you. :wink:

Even though I did say chose instead of choose.

 

[The Saw]

You have good points, but I don't believe anyone can run a 256 player 9-ball tournament that lasts 7 day in this economy and with prices now a days for travel, hotel, food, entry, and the little things that come up. Johnnyt

Uhhhmmmmm, Diamond has this little 9 day tourney every year just outside of Louisville you may have heard of, its called the Derby City Classic....

 

[richiebalto]

I would love to see the Us open go back to q masters.

I dont thank it will or can happen, how about all the vendors, where will they set up shop?

Iam asking this because i dont no the exact answer, about the vendors, iam sure they have to pay a decent amount to set up at the open and iam sure this money all goes in the us open pot, well i think iam sure?

Every big tournament i ever been to, always has vendors and i always thought that is where a lot of the prize fund money comes from?

 

[richiebalto]

Some say it dont look good where the money came from, this and that.

I ll say 1 thing, if everyone is paid all is good.

Also, this Us open was very very entertaining, you couldnt ask for better matches the last 2 days!!!!

 

[Johnnyt]

Some say it dont look good where the money came from, this and that.

I ll say 1 thing, if everyone is paid all is good.

Also, this Us open was very very entertaining, you couldnt ask for better matches the last 2 days!!!!

If someone bailed him out at the last minute you can't expect that to happen every year. I agree the tournament part was great. Johnnyt

 

[Johnnyt]

Uhhhmmmmm, Diamond has this little 9 day tourney every year just outside of Louisville you may have heard of, its called the Derby City Classic....

Yes I know the DCC. But that's a different format, lower entry fees, it's like 3 or 4 tournament in one, Greg owns Diamond tables, and it's a big difference in formats. I have not run any large tournaments and you have so you surely know more than me if 256 9 ball can be done at this time spanning 7 days. Johnnyt

 

[Jaden]

I don't know if you guys are arguing for longer or shorter...

Yes I know the DCC. But that's a different format, lower entry fees, it's like 3 or 4 tournament in one, Greg owns Diamond tables, and it's a big difference in formats. I have not run any large tournaments and you have so you surely know more than me if 256 9 ball can be done at this time spanning 7 days. Johnnyt

I know someone who runs a 192 player nineball every year in 2!!!!! Days...Now that is crazy...

Jaden

 

[TX Poolnut]

Yes I know the DCC. But that's a different format, lower entry fees, it's like 3 or 4 tournament in one, Greg owns Diamond tables, and it's a big difference in formats. I have not run any large tournaments and you have so you surely know more than me if 256 9 ball can be done at this time spanning 7 days. Johnnyt

256 entry double elimination tournament would consist of 511 matches. 511 matches divided by 7 days equals 73 matches per day. At the rate of 3 hours allotted per match, that is 219 hours of pool per day. From 9AM to 9PM is 12 hours. 219 hours divided by 12 hours of tournament time per day means you would need:

19 tables running 4 matches per day (12 hours) for 7 days.

AMIRITE???

 

[The Saw]

Yes I know the DCC. But that's a different format, lower entry fees, it's like 3 or 4 tournament in one, Greg owns Diamond tables, and it's a big difference in formats. I have not run any large tournaments and you have so you surely know more than me if 256 9 ball can be done at this time spanning 7 days. Johnnyt

What I was getting at is that all three events at the DCC draw way more players than the Open, so they run more players thru three tourneys in 9 days than the Open does with one tourney in 7 days. Granted, the races are, or can be, shorter and its a buy back system not double elimination but Diamond does it all without a hitch, and there is no doubt whatsoever that everyone is getting paid.... Plus, its not held in a conference style hotel.