Kevin Trudeau

Ghosst said:
I try my best to not reply to those type of remarks. A person who is well spoken should not have to correct or elaborate on their points as it should be obvious to all levels of readers what the speaker is saying. Hidden meanings, imagery and forcing an audience to extrapolate is best suited to literary endeavors, not a pool player's forum.

I've seen a few other members make snipes at the flag-waving too. It's not just us low-brow league types who interpret it as bigotry. As a person, I've always found it interesting how focused some people can be on their way of seeing the world and their place in it.

In doing some research and found an interesting article on the differences between European and Asian psychology versus American psychology. In the article, it is noted how Americans focus on themselves and the Asians in particular (but also the Europeans) focus more on the surroundings and circumstances. I can see that in religion as well, where western Christians focus more on obeying, and punishment and how you are viewed, but in Eastern practices it is more focused on the Earth itself, the plants and animals. Of course this is no place for that discussion and I've found too many people get very angry about religion to ever have an intelligent discussion on it.

I think all of it flows from the same source. It's a way of life and no matter how well worded someone might find your writing you should always try to look at it from both sides. In that vein, understand Jennie, this is no attack. I would have hoped by now from our conversations you know that behavior, beliefs, and pool are my main interests. I'm pointing out the differences in culture.

As far as Kevin, I don't know why people are so fascinated with him. He didn't start the IPT to help pool, it was a business venture. It went sideways. If you choose to say, "He was found guilty but it doesn't count", then be prepared to forgive all convicts, not just your favorite one.

PS: In reference to the unfairness, Eric has been beaten up several times on this forum for his past.
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Yeah, Ghosst, I'm uncultured. That's the ticket.

If you could meet my family, I'd shove your foot in your mouth for you.:angry:

There's a few people on this forum who have made their money from preying on those who are poor. Read that as meaning SEVERAL. They're good old boys, friendly with the regulars, who like to high-five it with all. Nobody says a damn word to them. In fact, what they did was worse than what Kevin Trudeau is accused of doing.

And don't bother replying. You can I have danced previously on the forum and via PM. I don't care to hear your B.S. anymore.
 
JAM said:
Yeah, Ghosst, I'm uncultured. That's the ticket.

If you could meet my family, I'd shove your foot in your mouth for you.:angry:

There's a few people on this forum who have made their money from preying on those who are poor. Read that as meaning SEVERAL. They're good old boys, friendly with the regulars, who like to high-five it with all. Nobody says a damn word to them. In fact, what they did was worse than what Kevin Trudeau is accused of doing.

And don't bother replying. You can I have danced previously on the forum and via PM. I don't care to hear your B.S. anymore.
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Yeah this KT as the anti-christ deal on AZ is pretty amusing. As you point out, plenty of folks are as bad or worse. KT's big sin was to get pool players and fans hopes up, and to lie a bit as his venture was failing. Everybody lies when they are trying to hold their falling apart deal together and what KT tried to do would have put pool in public on a grand scale. Folks here at AZ act as if KT was out to scam the players, which he for sure was not, not enough of them and they don't have enough money to be a decent target audience for the likes of KT. He had bigger fish to fry and the pool community would have been greatly benefited (and as you point out, did benefit while he was trying to make a product) had it worked out and it didn't work out. Boo-hoo. If pool had wider appeal, KT would have tried to repackage and resell once his original target buyer fell away, but the nature of pool is such that he had one shot and he took it in a first-class manner.

All the crying feels like little kids who didn't get their pony for their b-day telling their parents they hate them.

And of course, he's a great target for AZ's favorite game, the judgement finger-point.
 
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JAM said:
Yeah, Ghosst, I'm uncultured. That's the ticket.

If you could meet my family, I'd shove your foot in your mouth for you.:angry:

There's a few people on this forum who have made their money from preying on those who are poor. Read that as meaning SEVERAL.

And don't bother replying. You can I have danced previously on the forum and via PM. I don't care to hear your B.S. anymore.
Click to expand...

That was not what I said at all, but thanks for the response all the same. I make sole reference to Eric as he is the only person I am aware of. I have never said anything about it to him either because I don't feel I know enough about his past to make comment. As for my BS, I could quote sources if you wanted to have an intelligent discussion however I get the feeling you are just not in the mood right now.

It is also quite possible I am too unsophisticated to have a conversation with you in a civil manner. I don't claim to be intelligent enough to tie my own shoes.
 
Anyone defending KT is either ignorant of the facts or a sad excuse for a human being. His actions directly resulted in the death of many people. That is a fact. In most countries that don't protect criminals with their sadly misinterpreted laws, he would have been tried and convicted of murder years ago. Preying on the poor for financial gain is one thing, but preying on the sick and elderly knowingly causing harm is indefensible.
Whatever punishment he gets in the US justice system will be far less than he deserves.
What he did with pool was at best a welfare handout but most likely, based on everything else in his past, another scam that just didn't work out well for him.
 
Ghosst said:
I try my best to not reply to those type of remarks. A person who is well spoken should not have to correct or elaborate on their points as it should be obvious to all levels of readers what the speaker is saying. Hidden meanings, imagery and forcing an audience to extrapolate is best suited to literary endeavors, not a pool player's forum.

I've seen a few other members make snipes at the flag-waving too. It's not just us low-brow league types who interpret it as bigotry. As a person, I've always found it interesting how focused some people can be on their way of seeing the world and their place in it.

In doing some research and found an interesting article on the differences between European and Asian psychology versus American psychology. In the article, it is noted how Americans focus on themselves and the Asians in particular (but also the Europeans) focus more on the surroundings and circumstances. I can see that in religion as well, where western Christians focus more on obeying, and punishment and how you are viewed, but in Eastern practices it is more focused on the Earth itself, the plants and animals. Of course this is no place for that discussion and I've found too many people get very angry about religion to ever have an intelligent discussion on it.

I think all of it flows from the same source. It's a way of life and no matter how well worded someone might find your writing you should always try to look at it from both sides. In that vein, understand Jennie, this is no attack. I would have hoped by now from our conversations you know that behavior, beliefs, and pool are my main interests. I'm pointing out the differences in culture.

As far as Kevin, I don't know why people are so fascinated with him. He didn't start the IPT to help pool, it was a business venture. It went sideways. If you choose to say, "He was found guilty but it doesn't count", then be prepared to forgive all convicts, not just your favorite one.

PS: In reference to the unfairness, Eric has been beaten up several times on this forum for his past.
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A well worded post imo from an intelligent poster. THNX
 
JAM said:
Yeah, Ghosst, I'm uncultured. That's the ticket.

If you could meet my family, I'd shove your foot in your mouth for you.:angry:

There's a few people on this forum who have made their money from preying on those who are poor. Read that as meaning SEVERAL. They're good old boys, friendly with the regulars, who like to high-five it with all. Nobody says a damn word to them. In fact, what they did was worse than what Kevin Trudeau is accused of doing.

And don't bother replying. You can I have danced previously on the forum and via PM. I don't care to hear your B.S. anymore.
Click to expand...

Kind of an unpleasant response imo also from a normally intelligent poster. Maybe there is a culture clash here. But what do I know, I can barely read, write or spell. :rolleyes:
 
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One last thing, Trudough didn't put 10M into pool, it was more like 3M after the smoke cleared. He stiffed a lot of people in the end, pool players included and he sold them all a false bill of goods. He dashed the dreams of a lot of people on the rocks and walked away smiling. I'm not so forgiving as some are on here. I hope he gets what's coming to him, a lot of bad karma!
 
jay helfert said:
One last thing, Trudough didn't put 10M into pool, it was more like 3M after the smoke cleared. He stiffed a lot of people in the end, pool players included and he sold them all a false bill of goods. He dashed the dreams of a lot of people on the rocks and walked away smiling. I'm not so forgiving as some are on here. I hope he gets what's coming to him, a lot of bad karma!
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3M is a ton of dough I don't care who you are.
 
jay helfert said:
Yes, and 10M is a lot more. That was my point sir. I prefer declarations based on fact, not fantasy, if you want to make a point.
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So do I man. My problem is I never even read the dollar amount of any claim of money, spent, earned, won, lost, bet, stolen, given, found or any other variation of mention here at AZ. I just fill in "blah blah" and go on reading.

Did you work IPT at all?

Kevin
 
CreeDo said:
I think this is what drives people nuts and spurs them to argue with you on this subject!
It's like you think the convicted criminal part, is some subjective opinion or interpretation.
Which is why you put it in scare quotes.

It's not. It's simple fact, black and white, a matter of public record. He admits it himself.



That's just the first of several convictions. He was (and still is) a criminal.
Would it be the end of the world to admit that he's at least a "mixed bag"?
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The way I see it, its no longer considered an "opinion" if they are good or bad once a person is convicted of the crime they are accused of. :scratchhead:
 
jay helfert said:
Kind of an unpleasant response imo also from a normally intelligent poster. Maybe there is a culture clash here. But what do I know, I can barely read, write or spell. :rolleyes:
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Sheesh, Jay. I kind of expected more from you than this. "Culture clash"? Trying to wake up a sleeping bear, are you?

Let's not forget the first time I ever saw you in person was at the Venetian in Las Vegas at an IPT event. Do you remember who was holding onto each side of you as we passed down the aisleway? From then on, "IPT" was a demon in your eyes, but you had a previous history with Deno Andrews.

FWIW, I have a previous history with Ghosst on this forum and elsewhere. We have exchanged PMs and shared our thoughts about several subject matters. We did it off the forum to avoid an unpleasant back-and-forth in the open forum, so I thought.

Not sure where you're coming from with this "barely read, write, or spell." I won't elaborate on that because I'm not sure what your point is.

Lately, this forum seems to be filled with unpleasant posts, some written with the intention of causing hurt and/or anger.

BTW, next time you chat with Mark Griffin, ask him about this post he made on AzBilliards Discussion Forum ---> HERE.
 
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Keep him in the pen

jay helfert said:
One last thing, Trudough didn't put 10M into pool, it was more like 3M after the smoke cleared. He stiffed a lot of people in the end, pool players included and he sold them all a false bill of goods. He dashed the dreams of a lot of people on the rocks and walked away smiling. I'm not so forgiving as some are on here. I hope he gets what's coming to him, a lot of bad karma!
Click to expand...

Let him do some time, perhaps he will cough up the CASH $$$$$ ???
 
JAM said:
Kind of like how some praise our international brethren of pool players quite often over our Americna Super Stars, like Shane Van Boening. :wink:

Everybody has opinions, SJM. :)

My opinion is that Kevin Trudeau poured close to 10 million into pool that some people appreciate, especially all the BCA Hall of Famers that got $30,000 for just showing up in Orlando at the King of the Hill in December 2005. and I have another opinion that there are members of this forum who people praise and put on a pedestal who raised their capital by taking advantage of the poor, the aged, and the defenseless. A little bit of a double standard, I think.
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You are spot on correct.All this crap
about Kevin being such a horrible guy have no clue.Has he made mistakes,of
course he has.
People thought he was a crook and a piece of sh-t,but when he showed up
with the cash,everyone had there handout like a bum in a soup kitchen.

I'm surprised that all the DudleyDo-Rights never told Kevin to beat it when
he wanted to take part in our honest forth-coming sport:rolleyes:Money talks
and Kevin had it.People didn't care about who's pockets it came out of,as
long as they could put some of it in there own.
 
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djkx1 said:
Anyone defending KT is either ignorant of the facts or a sad excuse for a human being. His actions directly resulted in the death of many people. That is a fact. In most countries that don't protect criminals with their sadly misinterpreted laws, he would have been tried and convicted of murder years ago. Preying on the poor for financial gain is one thing, but preying on the sick and elderly knowingly causing harm is indefensible.
Whatever punishment he gets in the US justice system will be far less than he deserves.
What he did with pool was at best a welfare handout but most likely, based on everything else in his past, another scam that just didn't work out well for him.
Click to expand...

When are people accountable for there own actions and decisions?Kevin did make outlandish claims but his ''Natural Cure'' books also helped thousands of people
across the globe.Those books he never wrote, just sponsored.
Doctors,mostly Naturopaths wrote the info in his books and he was the spokesman.

Look,I'm not saying he hasn't done dickheaded things,but if were holding
people's deaths due to claims KT endorsed is just nuts.
Government has been killing people for years.Look at certain religions that don't
believe in blood-transfusions and would rather see there child die than have one.

Kevin Treudeau is a teeny tiny spec in sloth filled world,but at the end of the day
the pool-world was still very accepting of his money.To me that says more about
the world of pool,then Kevin Treudeau.
 
JAM said:
Sheesh, Jay. I kind of expected more from you than this. "Culture clash"? Trying to wake up a sleeping bear, are you?

Let's not forget the first time I ever saw you in person was at the Venetian in Las Vegas at an IPT event. Do you remember who was holding onto each side of you as we passed down the aisleway? From then on, "IPT" was a demon in your eyes, but you had a previous history with Deno Andrews.

FWIW, I have a previous history with Ghosst on this forum and elsewhere. We have exchanged PMs and shared our thoughts about several subject matters. We did it off the forum to avoid an unpleasant back-and-forth in the open forum, so I thought.

Not sure where you're coming from with this "barely read, write, or spell." I won't elaborate on that because I'm not sure what your point is.

Lately, this forum seems to be filled with unpleasant posts, some written with the intention of causing hurt and/or anger.

BTW, next time you chat with Mark Griffin, ask him about this post he made on AzBilliards Discussion Forum ---> HERE.
Click to expand...

I call it like I see it and don't play any favorites. KT did a lot of damage to pool in general and players in particular. It's not always all about the money, but in his case he dangled it like a carrot and delighted in watching everyone jump like trained monkeys for him (to borrow one of your favorite expressions). In the end he stiffed a lot of people and broke a lot of hearts.

I jumped through hoops to get the $5500 he owed me. I think he was a cheap bastard then and still do now. Good for you if you got some hard won money from him. Sorry but that's not my bottom line. Honor and integrity are higher on my list and he had NONE!

Regarding the "unpleasant" posts - On AZ we have many difficult issues that are brought out in the open for examination and discussion. It's kind of our Congress. It will get raw on here as well it should. I've taken my share of heat on here and I'm prepared to defend my position until someone can change my mind. I reserve the right to change my mind! :)
 
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