Do you have a good stroke?

My stroke is not great, but it's consistent. And I get action on the ball easily.

It consistently swings inward a little.
A lesson with Ralph E. helped me figure that out.

Despite this, it's straight enough for short and medium distance shots.
For longer shots I must bear down and over the years I have learned to
subconsciously adjust for the my slight inward swing.

I have a hard time fixing it because it's ingrained for over 15 years and the fixes
don't feel comfortable. I know that's just an excuse though. It's fixable.

Having the lesson was very helpful because on shots where accuracy is critical,
(the break, long straight-ins, long thin cuts) I am now aware of what I'm doing,
and I know of a quick'n'dirty fix I can use to make sure my delivery is straight.
I just curl my grip hand inward a bit. But to get a better stroke I should either
do that on every shot, or better yet re-align my whole body so I don't need to curl that hand.
 
SmoothStroke said:
Firm believer in stroke technique drills 10000000%. As far as I am concerned you can throw most shot drills out the window and let them fly with the pigs.

Stroke technique drills cover all the same angles as shot drills except you perform them in increments of 3 and 4 using ball click…..guaranteed to improve stroke ability, consistency in ball pocketing, position play, rhythms and so on.

It can be taught and learned to as near perfection as perfection can be.
It's always nice if your warms up strokes are in tune with a beautiful delivery stroke.

Of course a full PSR is important.
Crawl,walk,run….combine PSR with great stroke technique and you can FLY.

Sincerely: SmoothStroke
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Absolutely a great post!

randyg
 
Straightpool_99 said:
Do you have a good stroke?
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A "good stroke" is one that is accurate and consistent, creating the desired CB direction, speed, spin.

The "best practices" for a good stroke are listed and demonstrated on the stroke "best practices" resource page.

Do you need to follow the "best practices" to have a "good" stroke? No.

Will some people improve by following the "best practices?" Most definitely.

Regards,
Dave
 
Straightpool_99 said:
Almost every pool player I know claims that they have a good stroke, and spend very little time on refining it specifically. They may do drills, but they rarely focus on the stroke and its development, it is always secondary. Lots of them have serious stroke flaws, they rush the stroke, they steer, their stroke is jerky etc. Of course I am not exempt from this problem:D If you point out that they are steering they always get very defensive (again I'm not exempt from this) and they seem to refuse to admit to themselves that there is a problem. Is it possible that we are all in denial of our stroke flaws to a degree? Do you guys feel that you have a good stroke? Are your problems stroke related or do they have other causes?

The reason for this thread is a youtube clip with John Cleese where he discusses stupidity and incompetence (which are very relevant to me, lol).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7G_zSos8w_I

Anyway he explains that in order to know how stupid/incompetent you really are you need exactly the same skills as you would to actually be competent. Of course I know that my stroke is not as good as Mika Immonens, but I don't know exactly how bad and exactly how it differs. I know it only vaguely. I've been working hard on my stroke for about a year know and I can honestly say that I am at a much higher level now than when I started, but the changes made were not in the areas I thought they would be. Could it be that I didn't have and still do not have any idea how bad my stroke really is?:D
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That was great...............thanks. :smile:

You really have to understand how intelligent you are to understand your stupidity.

John
 
jtaylor996 said:
No, I don't right now. But, it's getting a lot better every day.


NOPE, that don't work. I only have a good stroke now on shots I go through a freakin' mental checklist on before the final swing. If I forget to do that, it goes out the window. But it's getting towards being automatic again... just need more time (ugh, working 80 hour weeks right now doesn't leave but like 20 minutes for pool a day).
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I'd be interested in knowing what you include in your checklist if you don't mind sharing.
 
Jeff Rosen said:
I'd be interested in knowing what you include in your checklist if you don't mind sharing.
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Well, I don't have anything magical. Every time I notice I'm doing something wrong, I'll add it to the list.

But off the top of my head:
1. Step back and approach the line of the shot consistently so I get a natural foot placement.
2. Bend down in the shot consistently. Lately, I've been using my chin like the gals to get a good reference.
3. Make a solid bridge, and move it a little to make sure it's planted. I'm one to put English I don't want on a ball if it means I can get a solid bridge.
4. Check my back hand placement. I aim for my forearm perpendicular to the floor at ball contact point. I need to be better about not twisting or choking my grip. Switching to a lighter wrapless cue has helped a bunch here (I have no clue why).
5. Practice strokes. I need improvement in consistently and speed here.
6. Shot picture, and visualize the hit. I'm least consistent here.
7. Push through the final stroke, and stay down on the shot. Not too great here, either.

I feel like if I get through everything on that list, then I'll at least know for sure that I missed because of bad strategy, planning, or aiming. That's all I ask of my stroke, to be honest.
 
Good stroke compared to what and who?
I`m still working on my stroke, so obviously I don`t think i have a good enough stroke, but i have made huge improvements over the last few months.
I use my gopro camera to record my playing and analyzing what`s wrong.
It`s not as effective as taking lessons from a pro, but It`s a revelation seeing one self play and It gives me the possibility to correct a whole host of prolems.
I have made a list of prioreties and i constantly work on reducing the items on that list.
1. Stay still
2. Good stance
3. Loose grip
4. Have a good, stable bridge
5. Line up head and arm with the cue
6. Be consistent in the pre shot routine
7. Correct bridge length.

The staying still bit is much better now. My stance is much more solid, making it easier to stay still on shots. The grip is alot better, but i still tense up a little bit on hard follow or draw shots.
I now play with a 11.75mm shaft and it took some revorking of my bridge hand to tighten the loop enough.
The lining up and 90 degree albow thing is my main focus right now, it looks pretty ok, but i sometimes get the chicken wing thing going and i sometimes sqeeze my elbow towards my body, but I`m working on it and seeing improvement every time i play.
My pre shot routine is now pretty consistent, but i still take a bit too long sometimes, especially on rail shots.
My bridge lengt was something i thought was ok, untill i saw my self playing and realized my bridge generally was about an inch and a half too long.
It`s hard to change that, but with more practice i will get there.
Being quite close in body type and height as Mika Immonen (I`m 1.81 and 76kg) I`m kinda modelling my stroke on his
 
For me, a good stroke is just mechanics.

I know players who focus on the stroke as a whole - while I preferred to think of it with a more Gestalt perspective --- the individuals parts add up to be greater than the whole.

When I started to play seriously I had minor imperfections that affected my shots: namely, gripping the cue tight and with four fingers, not bending my knees enough to look fully down the cue.

Other than those two issues (which I conditioned into my natural play) I had an excellent stroke naturally.

I started to have consistency errors when learning to use draw because I was afraid I would jump the ball - it was a mental block that was starting to affect my regular consistency and I recently fixed it as well.
 
I work on my stroke 4 hours a day (no homo) I am also experimenting with different grips and what not.
 
Last summer, a friend of mine had the most unbelievable stroke I ever saw.
He does admit however, that his second heart attack had more of a "wow" factor.
 
The mental block aspect?

More or less I saw a few comments on the Internet and had some reassurance from other players.

Things like - The cue stick has no affect on the CB after initial contact so don't be afraid to follow through, and comments of that nature.

The problem was that I was angling my cue a bit, and almost unconsciously pulling my cue back as soon as I hit the CB so I actually ended up jumping the cue ball a few times. I had to consciously follow through (which I did by reminding myself to hold the cue position after finishing the stroke) and it worked.

Then to be sure I set up a few "tougher" shots on the table at increasing distances to make sure my shot was consistent and still on the line - and it was.

Basically it was the reassurance to follow through backed by practicing drills.

-Richard
 
No, I don't. I probably wouldn't know it was as bad as it is if I didn't have a pretty good stroke a year ago so the current ugliness of my stroke is kind of in my face now.

I am going to need to go back to the basics and rework it from the ground up. The biggest difference between my crappy stroke and my decent stroke is in the timing. When I get the timing right I can get pretty good action and accuracy even if some other things are still wrong.

Still, definitely needs work and it will take some time.
 
I had several people tell me after my most recent local tourney that I have very strong fundamentals, that I align very well when I address the shot, and that I have a "powerful stroke." If anything, I need to tame it and not hit the ball quite as hard. I think I try to make the cueball do too much.

After a shot I sliced in yesterday, the guy playing next to me jokingly said "I think you shoot too straight. That shot was ridiculous." LOL.

I take those comments as a very kind compliment, as I work hard on my game. Even so, I'm just a B level player (only playing a little less than 2 years total). I'm hoping to fix that within the next year and start playing up to A speed.
 
Scott Lee helped me work on my stroke at my house right at a month ago and what I found out was that I didn't have a PSR and on my draw shots I too was one of the pokers I didn't finish my shot I was pulling the cue back I also was choked up on the cue a little to far so my elbow wasn't 90 degrees when my cue struck the cue ball and I didn't have a pause from my backstroke to my shooting stroke it was all one motion. I stayed down on my shot really well and my bridge was solid and consentient and I kept my cue pretty level. Before Scott came by and we had are lesson all I knew about pool and stroke was what I tough myself and picked up from the few decent players we have around hear. I always knew I had bad habits but didn't know how to fix them. Only a month into what I have been tough and I can tell there has been some improvements. This may sound strange but I have had 8 ball breaks and runs but never any in 9 ball and just the other day I broke and ran my fist but I hope first of many racks in 9ball. So my stroke I would say is in the middle of the road but if I keep with what I learnt it will be getting much better.
 
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is your stroke good?

simple test to determine if you have a good draw stroke. Set OB on headstring. Set CB .5 diamond behind OB in kitchen. Your goal is to draw the CB back to the rail (2 diamonds away) without having the OB contact that same rail (18 diamonds travel)
 
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