I agree with you if there is no pause in the action, or just a fraction of a second pause, then there is no muscle jerking or sleeping and TOI is not needed, if you take a long pause muscles kinda sleeps, and will tuck toward the body as you back swing, and on forward motion it will hit CB at a slight angle which puts english on CB. This is where TOI , very short stroke, and other methods comes in handy. Especially for those that has the long pause ingrained in their brain, hard to change the habit and TOI will fixes it, but there is learning curve and some tricks to it, prompted CJ to create a DVD for it.
Straight In Shots
- Thread starter Tennesseejoe
- Start date
I agree with you if there is no pause in the action, or just a fraction of a second pause, then there is no muscle jerking or sleeping and TOI is not needed, if you take a long pause muscles kinda sleeps, and will tuck toward the body as you back swing, and on forward motion it will hit CB at a slight angle which puts english on CB. This is where TOI , very short stroke, and other methods comes in handy. Especially for those that has the long pause ingrained in their brain, hard to change the habit and TOI will fixes it, but there is learning curve and some tricks to it, prompted CJ to create a DVD for it.
...............
-------------------------------------------------------
Not only huge, but quite ingenious, KMR. I never heard this before, nor saw this clever idea in print prior to your post.
I tried it and works exactly as you describe. It easily and inarguably *does* establish your center of vision . . . ultra-direct and with the immediate visual feedback of you looking at your face and where your dominant eye wants to be.
Many, many thanks for providing this in-"sight" (as CJ's way with a tech phrase double entendre might put it).
Arnaldo
Last edited:
Thanks to all for your replies. A humbling experience for me was to place the object ball in the center of the table and the cue ball in front of the diagonal pocket making a long straight in shot, oh, on a snooker table.
Since I don't have a snooker available for practice, I've decided to place the object ball 6 inches off center spot and place the cue ball on the end rail for a straight in shot using a 9 foot table at home.
Shooting the shot with the cue ball on the end rail is revealing practice for me. And has helped.
Since I don't have a snooker available for practice, I've decided to place the object ball 6 inches off center spot and place the cue ball on the end rail for a straight in shot using a 9 foot table at home.
Shooting the shot with the cue ball on the end rail is revealing practice for me. And has helped.
Dr. Dave, while you are a wealth of information and I always look forward to learning something anytime you post .... I question your experiment.
If I shoot 20 straight in shots as described, I will get in a groove and improve my percentage towards the end. However, if I shoot 20 shots, but at random angles, I think my percentage will not improve as much towards the end.
I plan to try your experiment shooting straight in shots and then shooting shots at the same distance but at a prescribed angle, and then at random angles as you describe.
I'll let you know. And thank you for the detailed response.
Straight shots ARE easier than cut shots of the same CB-to-OB distance and the same OB-to-pocket distance. Proof can be found in TP 3.4 - Margin of error based on distance and cut angle.
No.
Although, if you and others did a simple experiment, I bet your thinking might change. Here it is:
Place an object ball in the center of the table, and place the CB three feet away for a straight-in shot to a corner. Attempt this shot a large number of times and keep track of your make percentage. Then attempt the same number of shots, with the OB is the same place, but with the CB at random angles (maybe up to 30 or 45 degrees) for cuts both to the right and left, still positioning the CB three feet from the OB (along a circular arc) for each shot. Again keep track of the make percentage.
I am confident you will find that the straight shot is easier; in other words, it will have a higher make percentage (unless you have a really serious issue with any of the things below, in which case your results might be somewhat random).
If I shoot 20 straight in shots as described, I will get in a groove and improve my percentage towards the end. However, if I shoot 20 shots, but at random angles, I think my percentage will not improve as much towards the end.
I plan to try your experiment shooting straight in shots and then shooting shots at the same distance but at a prescribed angle, and then at random angles as you describe.
I'll let you know. And thank you for the detailed response.
Straight shots ARE easier than cut shots of the same CB-to-OB distance and the same OB-to-pocket distance. Proof can be found in TP 3.4 - Margin of error based on distance and cut angle.
No.
Although, if you and others did a simple experiment, I bet your thinking might change. Here it is:
Place an object ball in the center of the table, and place the CB three feet away for a straight-in shot to a corner. Attempt this shot a large number of times and keep track of your make percentage. Then attempt the same number of shots, with the OB is the same place, but with the CB at random angles (maybe up to 30 or 45 degrees) for cuts both to the right and left, still positioning the CB three feet from the OB (along a circular arc) for each shot. Again keep track of the make percentage.
I am confident you will find that the straight shot is easier; in other words, it will have a higher make percentage (unless you have a really serious issue with any of the things below, in which case your results might be somewhat random).
I think this may be where the rubber hits the road for me... I went out for an hour since it was all the time I could manage and actually paid attention to how I aim instead of just pocketing balls or shooting drills... I pretty much aim full, half ball or edge to edge(ie 90degrees) and shoot from an offset... When I am straight in I am already dialed in so I pull the trigger unless I need to manufacture an angle.... Then I will actually aim the ball instead of just using aiming center and then use TOI on it...
I wonder how many people shoot from offsets instead of aiming every shot... I do have several aiming techniques when I cannot seem to feel right about certain shots but they are more or less double, and triple checks for when the image in my head just won't come into focus......
I wonder how many people shoot from offsets instead of aiming every shot... I do have several aiming techniques when I cannot seem to feel right about certain shots but they are more or less double, and triple checks for when the image in my head just won't come into focus......
Anybody like releasing the cue?
I can't shoot any straighter than letting the cue slide.
I can't shoot any straighter than letting the cue slide.
Old Nine Baller
Banned
Yes, on almost every shot ever.
"Letting go" is one of the most difficult things for people to do in sports but it's very rewarding.
ONB
Old Nine Baller
Banned
If you use anything other than centerball on a straight in shot or suggest it to others, then you can't play and are hurting other's games. I would never take advice from someone trying to sell me dvd's, books, tapes or anything else.
ONB
straight in shots are pretty hard. specially when you twist your elbow or wrist
straight in shots your cb is contacting less of the ob.. as a cut shot your Actually hitting more of the ball depending how much of a cut shot you have
what i do is i find the contact point on ob an shot line
then i set the middle of my body on the shot line.
then lean into my shot not turn to the side or twist my body out of line.. you don.t want to turn away from the shotline what your doing here is your approaching your shot right. so you can get a better aim..
an make sure your thumb is pointing down to floor.. an your grip is loose from start to finish. the V grip works well. just picture a baby chick in your hand an you craddling it
if this don.t help you might be eye dominant.. check with Gene Albrecht he can fix it for you
hope this helps take care an god bless:grin-square::
Common, do you think, 99% of people did not do what you are saying, it is common since, but they cannot get there, maybe they do not have a table at home, or have million hours to straighten their stroke; what CJ is saying made a lot of since and i tried it, and it does work perfectly, and i only been playing for 35 years!
Fortunate for you, you have 100% straight stroke (yet to be witnessed during pressure match) or got a million hours on your hand to practice! therefore, you cannot look past yourself. It is ok, majority of us think the others, that we do not agree with, are dead wrong, because we do not know all facts. Pool is dynamic game, and involves moving body parts, and unfortunately not all body parts are the same, tall people should have different approach than short, it depends on your hand muscle structure, and stance. At the end of the day; a player who strive to reach the top should try everything.
Ok i will side with you, only during practice none pressure situation, we get better stroke; or have the ability to be aware to keep stroke straight, but during pressure moments, brain cannot remember everything, and defaults to the bad habits, of which is elbow tuck during back swing, and cutting OB to left is different than cutting to right.
By the way i do not know or talk to CJ, or sell anything, i only say what i see and tried, in fact if you see previous posts (older ones) of mine, i had same opinion as yours! but I gained more knowledge, and got a little more time, to believe other wise.
You are entitled to your opinion; i am not asking you to change it. But i will be 1st one to change mine if and when i am wrong.
Oh by the way, nothing wrong with shooting the wrong way if you are good at it!
Last edited:
That's part of the point of the experiment. Every straight shot looks the same ... it is straight ... no real "aiming" is required (although, you must have your vision and cue aligned accurately). Cut shots at different angles must be aimed (and still require accurate vision and cue alignment). Also, there is less margin for error with a cut shot compared to a straight-in shot (especially with larger cut angles). Even if the same cut angle is used for every non-straight shot in the experiment, the success rate should still be greater for the straight shot (although, after a few attempts, you should no longer need to "aim" the cut-angle shot, because you will have locked in the aim by then).
Good. I hope others try it also, especially those who have always thought straight shots were more difficult than angled shots.
Please report back with results.
Catch you later,
Dave
Poor training leads to poor results. What you are advocating is poor training. Good luck with that. By the way, you proved my point in your own post- pressure situations, habits come out in full force. For you, those would be bad habits that you trained into yourself.
Old Nine Baller
Banned
If you've been playing for 35 years and have not yet developed a straight, repeatable stroke then you've wasted much time but it's your time. I've been playing longer than 35 years and my stroke is good, right and left-handed.
I do have a 100% straight stroke and it's been tested plenty of times under what most people (but not me) would regard as "pressure situations". I do not revert to bad habits under pressure because I have no bad habits. Believe what you want.
Cutting a ball in either direction is the same thing, it's only in your head.
There is so much misinformation on this site and in this thread it's a wonder anyone here can ever make a ball.
You say I cannot look past myself? I'm trying to help a person not waste the next 35 years(as you did) of their poolplaying by doing all the ridiculous things suggested in this thread to pocket the simplest shot in pool, you are contributing to the confusion.
ONB
If the shot is straight in, which side of the ball is INSIDE and which side is the OUTSIDE ?
It's a powerful stroke.
Efren and Lassiter couldn't be wrong.
You need a good cue of course. Throw away them whippy cues.
I used to miss long straight in shots but the past 6 months I have been lining up a hair on the inside of the cueball which somehow translates to a dead center ball for me. I can't explain why so I won't try. Somehow on my follow through the object ball reacts like a center ball hit so it doesn't throw off like it used to, now it stuns in the pocket or appears too.
When I used to use center ball on long straight shots I think when I followed through I hit the cueball off to the right a hair which tranferred spin to the object ball and I would miss. My make percentage has gone way up on long straight in shots.
Thanks for the post!!
How has a thread on straight in shots managed to create 7 pages of mostly crap and arguing? The problem I see when people miss straight in shots is that they steer the cue one way or the other. Could be due to a number of reasons. Worse case is there is a fault with the mechanics in ones cueing action, in which case cuts of all angles would be missed. Alignment issues would be next, not having the eyes in the correct place both whilst up and down on a shot. Again, something this major would result in missed cuts of all angles too. There are a number of other reasons to why people struggle on straight shots but those two I would say are the biggest causes.
I also see people looking at the 'wrong' part of the object ball also when shooting all different kinds of shots. Wrong part may be the wrong way to word it, but what I mean by this is they focus on a particular part of the object ball, for example the contact point when down on a shot. Contact points are minute and should be focused on when stroking. If you have alignment issues and your alignment is off, but you are looking at the correct contact point you will steer the cue toward the contact point causing a hit on the CB that wasn't intended. Also people steer the cue towards a contact point that isn't even close to the actual contact point with the same results. The way my eye pattern works is concentrate on the CB all the way up until I pause at the CB. Then I look to see if everything is aligned during the pause, then I look at my tip on the back swing to make sure I'm pulling back straight then at the pause at the end of the back swing my eyes move to the OB. This quick eye movement doesn't give my eyes chance to adjust and pick out a part of the OB so I see the object ball as a bit of a blur. I do it for every shot and it gives my cueing action the benefit of doubt to cue through straight. I guess this only works for those who have a straight stroke in them, but it may help some people out on some straight ins.
I also see people looking at the 'wrong' part of the object ball also when shooting all different kinds of shots. Wrong part may be the wrong way to word it, but what I mean by this is they focus on a particular part of the object ball, for example the contact point when down on a shot. Contact points are minute and should be focused on when stroking. If you have alignment issues and your alignment is off, but you are looking at the correct contact point you will steer the cue toward the contact point causing a hit on the CB that wasn't intended. Also people steer the cue towards a contact point that isn't even close to the actual contact point with the same results. The way my eye pattern works is concentrate on the CB all the way up until I pause at the CB. Then I look to see if everything is aligned during the pause, then I look at my tip on the back swing to make sure I'm pulling back straight then at the pause at the end of the back swing my eyes move to the OB. This quick eye movement doesn't give my eyes chance to adjust and pick out a part of the OB so I see the object ball as a bit of a blur. I do it for every shot and it gives my cueing action the benefit of doubt to cue through straight. I guess this only works for those who have a straight stroke in them, but it may help some people out on some straight ins.