Saw this posted on facebook.
Last edited:
Swanee payouts
- Thread starter Keith Jawahir
- Start date
Saw this posted on facebook.
If it's wrong, please let me know. I'd rather be wrong about something like this.
Last edited:
I really hope this is not true, but the over all handling of the Swanee was very poor.
Incomplete streaming coverage, freezing streams, no brackets, no updates, no chat on the stream even after they got the freezing issues fixed.
If you were not directly involved, or knew someone at the event and could get texts, you would not have even known there was a major pool event going on in SoCal. It is sad, and really hope it is not a sign of the times
Incomplete streaming coverage, freezing streams, no brackets, no updates, no chat on the stream even after they got the freezing issues fixed.
If you were not directly involved, or knew someone at the event and could get texts, you would not have even known there was a major pool event going on in SoCal. It is sad, and really hope it is not a sign of the times
well that fixes that problem lol.
I have too laugh. Renfro said he needed helped wrestling with the Indians- I had no intention of complying.
BUT
Every year somebody thinks we are stealing all the money.
Please use the search - it is your friend.
Full disclosure is given in advance and this event has not changed much in close to a 20 year history.
By your own figures, the payouts were $13,750. The actual entry fees was around $10,530. Then we had to pay gas, food, hotel for staff. And Eddie, the room owner needs to cover his nut. And we added somewhere between $3,500.
I don't get it. The guys from 3,000 miles away through a fit and most the players enjoy it.
Different strokes for different folks. Anybody want to acquire the event should give me a call - then you can fix it. Or well just do a BB and pay 3 years late.
You all have a pleasant night. I know I get jacked pretty fast - but please ask. The waft these events work best us if the room runs it. That eliminates one layer.
Mark Griffin
Ps. I got out of hospital 3 hours ago- but won't be arguing with anyone on this stuff. I got bigger fish to fry!!!
BUT
Every year somebody thinks we are stealing all the money.
Please use the search - it is your friend.
Full disclosure is given in advance and this event has not changed much in close to a 20 year history.
By your own figures, the payouts were $13,750. The actual entry fees was around $10,530. Then we had to pay gas, food, hotel for staff. And Eddie, the room owner needs to cover his nut. And we added somewhere between $3,500.
I don't get it. The guys from 3,000 miles away through a fit and most the players enjoy it.
Different strokes for different folks. Anybody want to acquire the event should give me a call - then you can fix it. Or well just do a BB and pay 3 years late.
You all have a pleasant night. I know I get jacked pretty fast - but please ask. The waft these events work best us if the room runs it. That eliminates one layer.
Mark Griffin
Ps. I got out of hospital 3 hours ago- but won't be arguing with anyone on this stuff. I got bigger fish to fry!!!
Hope you feel better soon. Thanks for all you do. I enjoyed the stream and look forward to the next one.
Green Fee And Reg was actually over 33% of entry.
The money was slightly off but here are my estimates:
SWANEE MONEY BREAKDOWN
- 164 Entrants
- $90 Entry
- Approx 31 late entrants @ $15 additional
- $4,000 Added Guaranteed
- Green Fee/Registration Fee – INDICATED BUT AMOUNT NOT DISCLOSED
Player money and 'advertised' added money
Entries: 164 x $90 = $14,760
Late Fees: 31 x $15 = $ 465
Added Money $4,000 = $ 4,000
GRAND TOTAL = $19,225
I'd like to say that I wish no ill harm to Mark, who is recovering from surgery and I acknowledge as he states, that he has bigger fish to fry. It actually comes as quite a surprise to me that Mark is even handling this issue and not Ozzy Reynolds, who was steering the event and should be capable of reporting any numbers without Mark's help.
I am also aware that some tournaments are less generous than others, but on paper it should always be clear what is and what isn't being paid out. In the case of this event, I would argue that the players have been mislead. The poster does not state exactly what the green fees and registrations are. Furthermore Mark's statements on the AZ Billiards Forum are also puzzling, as they add even more confusion because his prize fund and added monies do not add up to what they actually came to.
Mark States on in this thread:
“We added somewhere between $3,500...”
- If this is the case, then why does the poster and advertised money state: “$4,000 added 'Guaranteed”.
“...The actual entry fees was around $10,530...”
- Mathematically, if you do not include any late fees, this would mean 117 players paid $90 to play to arrive at Mark's figure of $10,530. If you are deducting the so-called, undisclosed registration fee to this $90 entry fee, then this is not as you state, “actual entry fee”. As an experiment, I chose an arbitrary number of $25 as a registration fee and multiplied it by 164 which is $4,100. If you deduct this from the actual entrants of 164 players paying $90 each, then you arrive at $10,660, which is still not your stated number and once again, is not “actual entry fees” as you state above.
Here's what happened in real life
- 164 PLAYER'S MONEY + $4,000 ADDED MONEY = $19,225
- Actual PAYOUTS = $13,840
- BALANCE = $ 5,385 not paid out
$5,385 divided by: 164 players = $32.84
There you go folks!
Each player paid at least $32.84 for registration and green fee which, was never properly disclosed in the first place. I have looked for somewhere to state how much is the green and reg fee and I can't find it. The only place I haven't looked is on an entry form and that's because I didn't play. I didn't play because I already knew from the get go that the money would be a lob-sided. Maybe this is why, for the first time in years, this event did not fill up. $33 represents over one third of the tournament entry fee. Whether it be in Eddie's pocket or CSI's, this is the most I've ever calculated the Swanee to rake from entries.
Below is an actual photo of the payouts from this year at the Swanee:
The money was slightly off but here are my estimates:
SWANEE MONEY BREAKDOWN
- 164 Entrants
- $90 Entry
- Approx 31 late entrants @ $15 additional
- $4,000 Added Guaranteed
- Green Fee/Registration Fee – INDICATED BUT AMOUNT NOT DISCLOSED
Player money and 'advertised' added money
Entries: 164 x $90 = $14,760
Late Fees: 31 x $15 = $ 465
Added Money $4,000 = $ 4,000
GRAND TOTAL = $19,225
I'd like to say that I wish no ill harm to Mark, who is recovering from surgery and I acknowledge as he states, that he has bigger fish to fry. It actually comes as quite a surprise to me that Mark is even handling this issue and not Ozzy Reynolds, who was steering the event and should be capable of reporting any numbers without Mark's help.
I am also aware that some tournaments are less generous than others, but on paper it should always be clear what is and what isn't being paid out. In the case of this event, I would argue that the players have been mislead. The poster does not state exactly what the green fees and registrations are. Furthermore Mark's statements on the AZ Billiards Forum are also puzzling, as they add even more confusion because his prize fund and added monies do not add up to what they actually came to.
Mark States on in this thread:
“We added somewhere between $3,500...”
- If this is the case, then why does the poster and advertised money state: “$4,000 added 'Guaranteed”.
“...The actual entry fees was around $10,530...”
- Mathematically, if you do not include any late fees, this would mean 117 players paid $90 to play to arrive at Mark's figure of $10,530. If you are deducting the so-called, undisclosed registration fee to this $90 entry fee, then this is not as you state, “actual entry fee”. As an experiment, I chose an arbitrary number of $25 as a registration fee and multiplied it by 164 which is $4,100. If you deduct this from the actual entrants of 164 players paying $90 each, then you arrive at $10,660, which is still not your stated number and once again, is not “actual entry fees” as you state above.
Here's what happened in real life
- 164 PLAYER'S MONEY + $4,000 ADDED MONEY = $19,225
- Actual PAYOUTS = $13,840
- BALANCE = $ 5,385 not paid out
$5,385 divided by: 164 players = $32.84
There you go folks!
Each player paid at least $32.84 for registration and green fee which, was never properly disclosed in the first place. I have looked for somewhere to state how much is the green and reg fee and I can't find it. The only place I haven't looked is on an entry form and that's because I didn't play. I didn't play because I already knew from the get go that the money would be a lob-sided. Maybe this is why, for the first time in years, this event did not fill up. $33 represents over one third of the tournament entry fee. Whether it be in Eddie's pocket or CSI's, this is the most I've ever calculated the Swanee to rake from entries.
Below is an actual photo of the payouts from this year at the Swanee:
Attachments
164 Players x $90 = $14,760
31 Late entries x $15 = $465
Total Player Entry Money = $15,225
Advertised to be $4,000 Guaranteed added
Total Money that should have been in the prize fund prior to registration and green fees = $19,225
Actual Pay-outs (written on bracket at pool hall) = $13,840
Registration/Green Fees total = $ 5,385
Mark Griffin states, “The actual entry fees was around $10,530.” If you're giving an actual number then there shouldn't be an “around.” But, if I use this as actual entry fee, then that would mean there were only 117 entries, with no late fees. We know that the field consisted of 164 players.
Also, Mark, you, state, “And we added somewhere between $3,500.” You falsely advertised $4000 added guaranteed, then. Also, you can't be in between just one number.
Using Mark's numbers and the actual numbers...There is a $5,375 balance not accounted for.
If you just got out the hospital, then maybe you shouldn't be in the forums incorrectly stating sales figures. Fry your bigger fish and let your right hand man deal with the actuals.
Please feel free to contact me, if you need an accountant.
Geraldine 310.889.4799
Poolplayergreg
Registered
Hard times actually makes enough money that weekend in concession sales and table time after tournament hours that they could in fact not collect any of that $5385 and still have a very profitable weekend.
The Swanee tournament is awesome, I just wish we had a room in So Cal that had enough tables that could host the tournament and not try and make 10-15k that weekend.
It is what it is, Pool has nothing better to offer at the moment. So the pool players will still come, and everyone knows this so nothing changes.
Mark, with all due respect for your health and everything else, I had to go back and read this a couple times thinking you might have been joking.
I have never seen a poster that stated "Added money after we pay gas, food, hotel and the room owner covers his nut".
And thats exactly what im talking about!! So cavalier in his attitude and explanations..We have to do better people..
Late fees never go in with the entries... So you can subtract those... The entry was $65 not the $90 you had listed.... You can also understand the logistics came out of the added money... As an accountant I am sure you can understand that falling into overhead.....
We went thru the same thing last year.... CSI Adds 4000 to the event... The room gets a greensfee... Without Mark you can scratch off another $3500 so jump on your Obamba phone and dial up 1600 Pennsylvania Ave because that is your only option I can think of for getting more free money than was provided.....
This is getting pretty old... What BArry does deserves a good throw down here on the forums but when they come out and give you the numbers and the breakdown... c'mon now... So Hardtimes made money over the weekend... They should just put that into the prize fund???...
How MUCH do you think they make on a normal weekend???? Off food, beverage and table time? That's what? an opportunity cost? Good answer... When you are making money and you stop that activity the lost revenue is a cost... I would hazard a guess that the mouth breathers on here *****ing about this would be the leading cause of that opportunity cost if they were in attendance... "Can I have a refill on my water?????"
,"What do you mean I can't bring my McDoubles in here and eat them?"
I know that some of you spend money at events and that's not aimed at you it's the others out there that pretty much guarantee you need a greens fee these day to get a room to host a weekend long event.....
Chris
That is a valid point but how many people did CSI send up there to run the event? Usually the added money i done by the room/local promotor... How far away is Hardtimes from CSI's office?
edit:
IT IS SOMETHING TO ADRESS IN THE FUTURE....... For the following reason... I could say I will add 5000 to an event and show up check into the most expensive hotel in town and proceed to have a blast every waking minute that I could write off against what I said I was adding... I do not like this going forward not because I think they did that but because it's a variable that CSI leaves to the employees...
Last edited:
Correction: The entry fee was $90 - (Green Fee and Reg included).
My math calculates the Reg and Green fee after all payouts and players entries are calculated. It's pretty easy math. You don't have to complicate it.
Attachments
I wasn't there, but doesn't HT's usually have a cover charge during this event also? Just wondering how much that adds to the house's take.
Yes, I think regular seats for one day were $10, $15 for VIP. I'd say at least 100 or more seats, at least 70% were paid for maybe? And about 30 VIP seats, which I think all were taken. PLUS streaming was like $10 per day I think. But we won't know how many viewers.
