Parallel English - amount of squirt

[precisepotting]

Parallel English is a technique of moving the cue stick parallel to the aim line (aimed at the new offset point), to introduce sidespin. This I know.

Different cues will have different squirt.

My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt?

I am not familiar with parallel English. Many swear by it whilst others rubbished it.

 

[Black-Balled]

Oh s hit. Not again.

 

[mikepage]

Parallel English is a technique of moving the cue stick parallel to the aim line (aimed at the new offset point), to introduce sidespin. This I know.

Different cues will have different squirt.

My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt?

I am not familiar with parallel English. Many swear by it whilst others rubbished it.

Two tips--more squirt

parallel english is never the right answer.

However, if your stick has a pivot point that is, say, twice your normal bridge length, then you can get two tips of english by going parallel for the first tip and then pivoting for the second tip. ---ignoring swerve that is.

I'm not advocating this; just saying it gets to the right answer...

 

[philly]

Parallel English is a technique of moving the cue stick parallel to the aim line (aimed at the new offset point), to introduce sidespin. This I know.

Different cues will have different squirt.

My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt?

I am not familiar with parallel English. Many swear by it whilst others rubbished it.

To the mods. Please take this to the aiming forum. I am out of pop corn.

 

[336Robin]

Is there a such thing as parallel English? Truly parallel English would be when the tip and the butt move the same amount from the center axis line. I think you're going to find there isn't such a thing. It's just a term people use for Regular English vs. FHE, BHE and your cultivated good stroke.

Parallel English is a technique of moving the cue stick parallel to the aim line (aimed at the new offset point), to introduce sidespin. This I know.

Different cues will have different squirt.

My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt?

I am not familiar with parallel English. Many swear by it whilst others rubbished it.

 

[Poolplaya9]

Is there a such thing as parallel English? Truly parallel English would be when the tip and the butt move the same amount from the center axis line. I think you're going to find there isn't such a thing. It's just a term people use for Regular English vs. FHE, BHE and your cultivated good stroke.

"Parallel english" and "when the tip and the butt move the same amount from the center axis line" and "regular english" are all three the same thing.

 

[easy-e]

Parallel English is a technique of moving the cue stick parallel to the aim line (aimed at the new offset point), to introduce sidespin. This I know.

Different cues will have different squirt.

My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt?

I am not familiar with parallel English. Many swear by it whilst others rubbished it.

Here's a crazy idea... TRY IT FOR YOURSELF AND FIND OUT!:thumbup:

 

[precisepotting]

Hi Mikepage,

Many of the players that I communicate with in this forum uses parallel English (or whatever you call it) if they use a LD shaft. They claim that they aimed at their target then parallel shift a little. No need to offset.

I am try to reconcile it with BHE. When you pivot using BHE, you can actually parallel shift the new line of aim (the direction cue stick is pointing) back to the centre of the cue ball. It is as if you are aiming at this point to start with and then parallel shift it. Just trying to see if there is any connection between the two methods, hence I need to know if more squirt is introduced if you parallel shift to the extreme.

Thanks Mikepage for your straightforward answer.

Hmm I don't believe it has anything with aiming or aiming system here. Just the mechanics of how a ball will squirt is what I am interested in.

 

[fastone371]

No matter how you offset your hit on the cue ball with 2 tips of english is 2 tips of english. BHE or FHE is supposed to take squirt and swerve into consideration so you can start out aiming normally at center ball then move your front or rear hand (or even both slightly in opposite directions if you desire) to your desired amount of english. Theoretically if you bridge at your cues pivot length your cue ball will arrive at the same point as when you were lined up at with center ball even though the cue is pointed somewhere else. With parallel english your aim line must be thicker or thinner than where the cue ball will actually arrive to compensate for squirt and swerve. That is the way I understand it anyway. Let the bashing begin. :wink:

From the Doctor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qXJoFOLZZE

 

[dr_dave]

Parallel English is a technique of moving the cue stick parallel to the aim line (aimed at the new offset point), to introduce sidespin. This I know.

For those interested, parallel english is covered in detail on the parallel english resource page.

My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt?

The greater the tip offset, the greater the squirt. However, swerve (which depends on cue elevation and conditions) also increases with tip offset, and swerve tends to counteract some of the squirt (more so with a less-level cue and slow/sticky conditions).

Regards,
Dave

 

[dr_dave]

parallel english is never the right answer.

... unless the cue elevation and shot speed are just right for a specific shot distance and speed (on a given set of conditions) so swerve exactly cancels the squirt (also assuming the aim has been adjust for throw, if necessary). For those interested, all important squirt, swerve, and throw effects are demonstrated and summarized on the squirt, swerve, throw effects resource page.

Regards,
Dave

 

[precisepotting]

It isn't easy to do experimentation especially when someone like myself, have problems with achieving center ball hits consistently. So, I hope friends here can give me a clearer picture.

Thanks fastone371. I know the effects of FHE and how to use it, but I am not familiar with it. No intention of using it unless I can be sure of its effect precisely.

 

[jsp]

Is there a such thing as parallel English? Truly parallel English would be when the tip and the butt move the same amount from the center axis line. I think you're going to find there isn't such a thing.

Of course there is such a thing. You just described it.

If you meant that parallel english never works, then I would disagree with you. There are very conceivable cases/shots/shafts where it does work.

And it also depends on where you are parallel shifting from.

 

[336Robin]

Of course there is such a thing. You just described it.

If you meant that parallel english never works, then I would disagree with you. There are very conceivable cases/shots/shafts where it does work.

And it also depends on where you are parallel shifting from.

True but as much as I've played with and studied the subject I've little value for myself in truly parallel English when other things are much easier to achieve in my opinion of course.

I would suggest that the OP go to the table and truly work with each area and find out what works best for him and under what conditions since he seems to know quiet a bit of what he's talking about. I use all types of side spin manipulations depending on the situation I'm in. I would only use truly parallel english in a situation where I couldnt address the ball from center axis because of an interfering ball and I was sure of the off center effects. He knows the differences, You can achieve only so much without practical use.

 

[Texas Carom Club]

Oh s hit. Not again.

Yep, way to get all the geologists going op

 

[Bob Jewett]

... My question is, is the squirt the same if you hit half a tip off-centre and two tip off-centre. I presume they will be different. If so, which has more squirt? ...

The amount of squirt in degrees is proportional to tip offset (or very nearly so). That relationship is what makes backhand english work for a wide range of amounts of spin if the pivot point (bridge length) has been chosen correctly. The links already provided cover this stuff in detail.

 

[One Pocket John]

I going to jump is here to talk about parallel spin on the QB.

I have over the last few decades have been using parallel spin and have commented on the use in a few threads.

I'll try to explain the use as clearly as I can. If my explanation is confusing I apologize.

When I line up a shot from the standing position I am lining up the vertical line of the QB to the contact point on the OB. While still in the standing I decide what spin I want to use, depending on the shot I may choose right spin or left spin. When I bend over into the shooting position my cue shaft edge/side will either be on the right side or the left side of the vertical center of the QB. I was pretty successful playing my way. Later I realized that SVB uses this same technique.

Until joining AZ Billiards back in 2010 I had never heard of squirt, swerve or BHE. So ignorance is bliss.

A few months ago I had the fortune of watching Buddy Hall demonstrate Tuck And Roll and that has been what I have been working on.

I started watching the pro's play paying close attention to their wrist and if the cue was parallel to the shot line. Low and behold most pro's use Tuck and Roll you will see some pro's using parallel spin.

I guess it's just what ever floats you boat and gets the job done.

I still use parallel spin and only use Tuck and Roll when needed.

Have fun out there.

John

 

[LAMas]

"...parallel shift a little. No need to offset..."

Isn't a parallel shift.... offset...from the center of the CB?

Is the shaft closest to the viewer "parallel" english? Are those below it "offest"?

 

[pokeandhope]

I learned somewhere that if you apply english (fhe, bhe, parallel) to a ball that is hit dead center in the pocket at medium speed (I'm calling medium speed about 1 1/2 table roll on a 9 footer) the object ball will always make the pocket. I read or saw this somewhere. If anyone knows where this was stated I would love to credit them. It is the greatest piece of information I've ever learned. Using this piece of information made me practice differently. I started to focus on no english ball pocketing with pocket reducers. Then i practiced for hours placing two object balls in a pocket with only about a 1/4 inch of space to make the ball. After retraining myself as to where the center of the pocket is, I started to add in the "spinach". Confidence that the ball won't throw enough to hurt me was good knowlege. I will say that when you hit the ball slower engish obviously takes better and it becomes a combination of knowlege and experience. Just my 2 cents.

 

[336Robin]

Conditions of the shot

"...parallel shift a little. No need to offset..."

Isn't a parallel shift.... offset...from the center of the CB?

Is the shaft closest to the viewer "parallel" english? Are those below it "offest"?

View attachment 471493

I can imagine that under certain conditions one might be able to get away with virtually no squirt on a shot in pool at that parallel offset. The conditions I would think that might work under this parallel shift would only be on a soft shot. I can't imagine playing that way under normal game conditions. I've never seen anyone play this way but I've seen many play side spin from a center axis cue butt position.