Is Schmidt's and charlie 626 Legit

[Dan White]

Sorry Dan - yet another retraction, I couldn't help but see where you referred j.s/bca/c.w / CLAIM - as Record' - without any unedited footage I would not attempt to call it a record. Going to have to keep me aeee' on you Dan lol. I am not sure of bout schmidt's criminal background history - he may have a record there? A 626 record HE DOES NOT HAVE - till proven otherwise. I would say it's a CLAIM at best - that is not good enough for his backers to associate j.s. name with Mosconi's Official World Record. A 'practice run' of 626 - would suffice - if accompanied with unedited video footage -the bca and teem' don't have that evidence. Good Day

I don't think we are too far off. I was just assuming for the sake of argument that the JS record is confirmed. I was speaking more to what kind of record it is - exhibition or practice or should it matter even? It clearly isn't an exhibition record but on the other hand didn't the BCA kind of make up that category in order to record the Mosconi run as an official record? I see no problem in having three categories of high runs. Obviously tournament records are limited by the length of the match. Exhibitions aren't even held any more so Mosconi's record would remain untouched. That leaves practice runs which is where we are today. I say three categories because each is significantly different from the others. Just thinking out loud.

 

[JB Cases]

As i have stated in past the chance of them showing any verifiable proof is as good as u playing me or Lou in One Pocket for large monetary sum - even. Just in case yer wondering - it won't happen - they cannot provide what they don't have. U should go to their theatrical promo commercial reel soon - don't forget to cut a hole in bottom of yer popcorn bucket.

You can't get played. However IF anything ever materializes on the other front you won't be barred from betting.

What I am confident of is that you won't lock up a $10,000 BET with John against him having the goods. Accusations are free.

 

[JB Cases]

I 'real eyes' now the Charlie Dragon Promotion 14.1 event was not a Real World Championship (WPA was correct), more just a way of engineering a 'paper champion' for the Open Public to accept or Adopt, Willie Mosconi's World Record of 526 in Straight Pocket Billiards - STANDS. Willie's sponsor's never claimed to have captured the Famous 526 mark _ ON CAMERA - j.s. backers ARE - making or engineering' that Claim, this is very pertinent to the discussion - and seems to have been a bit overlooked during the onslaught on Willie's World Record. While there were sum' Champions - in attendance at c.w. event - I now regret ever competing in c.w./j.s dragon promtion 14.1. Now that they tried to steal Mosconi's record - there little dragon has lost all the fire in it's belly - in relation to dragon promo 14.1 re-rack major tourneys'. So again Willie's family and Smithsonian Institute DO have proper documentation to prove - he did what the 30 witnesses + signed affidavit states - CONFIRMED, j.s./c.w./predcues/BCA - DO NOT have the unedited tape to prove their Claim - NOT CONFIRMED. Very sad state of affairs to try and cancel out American Pocket Billiard History - then tell the people they cannot see unedited proof.

Yeah Charlie looks like he is just hating life......
.

 

[lfigueroa]

Yes, we know for a fact JS made hundreds of attempts over many months.

And yes, JS has nowhere near the experience playing 14.1 against masters like Greenleaf.

And yes, JS is capable of running 600+: after hundreds of tries, over many months, with artificially perfect conditions. Willie walked into strange room and did it.

There was no fluke to Mosconi's run. Over the years, numerous people here have reported watching him in person and saying he was far above anyone else when it came to playing 14.1. All saw 100 ball runs, almost on demand. He ran balls like water. Most people, that know anything about 14.1, acknowledge that given the slightest incentive he could have run 800 or more.

JS has s zero chance or walking into a strange room, taking two racks of practice, and running 500+.

Lou Figueroa

 

[AtLarge]

I 'real eyes' now the Charlie Dragon Promotion 14.1 event was not a Real World Championship ...

4 of the first 5 of these events (2006, 2007, 2008, and 2010) were WPA-sanctioned world championships. None since then.

 

[markjames]

this is all very interesting and i have to check back in every few months,

 

[gerryf]

I believe there are some folks besides myself, to include prominent pros, who have their doubts about JS' run.

Lou Figueroa

You believe? Are there any prominent pros that you can name, who have said anything that you can actually quote? Or is it just that you believe there must be somebody out there? And if there is a pro out there who has doubts, have they seen the evidence, or is it just an opinion based on not liking John Schmidt or one of his friends?

As for non-pros who have doubts, there are always going to be people like Danny Harriman who believe that there must be a conspiracy.

And yes, JS is capable of running 600+: ...

Lou Figueroa

..and that's what almost everyone has been saying for some time... You should tell Danny Harriman.

 

[JB Cases]

Yes, we know for a fact JS made hundreds of attempts over many months.

How? Did you see them all?

And yes, JS has nowhere near the experience playing 14.1 against masters like Greenleaf.

And yes, JS is capable of running 600+: after hundreds of tries, over many months, with artificially perfect conditions. Willie walked into strange room and did it.

How do you know it was a strange room? Willie only played on Brunswick tables so he would have been very familiar with the equipment.

John did run 626 after months of long run attempts. He did this without a better 14.1 player to learn from through daily competition. He essentially compressed 20 years of play into a year.

There was no fluke to Mosconi's run. Over the years, numerous people here have reported watching him in person and saying he was far above anyone else when it came to playing 14.1. All saw 100 ball runs, almost on demand. He ran balls like water. Most people, that know anything about 14.1, acknowledge that given the slightest incentive he could have run 800 or more.

We fully understand the reverence. At this point John probably runs a hundred really easily as well.

As for mosconi running 800 the thing is that you will never know because he didn't run that many. You can speculate but what matters is what was recorded.

JS has s zero chance or walking into a strange room, taking two racks of practice, and running 500+.

No, he has a non-zero chance of doing it.

 

[lfigueroa]

You believe? Are there any prominent pros that you can name, who have said anything that you can actually quote? Or is it just that you believe there must be somebody out there? And if there is a pro out there who has doubts, have they seen the evidence, or is it just an opinion based on not liking John Schmidt or one of his friends?

As for non-pros who have doubts, there are always going to be people like Danny Harriman who believe that there must be a conspiracy.


..and that's what almost everyone has been saying for some time... You should tell Danny Harriman.

I am not at liberty to repeat names told to me in confidence -- you can choose to believe me, or not.

And yes, JS may be able to run over 600 but unedited evidence of this super power is hard to come by.

Lou Figueroa

 

[garczar]

I believe the answer to your question is no, he could not.

It took him hundreds of tries under artificially perfect conditions. There is zero chance he is going to walk into a strange room for an exhibition and run 500+ in front of spectators, on any size table, on a single attempt.

Lou Figueroa

ZERO chance?? Put JS on a 4x8 with buckets like Saint Willie did and he's got a pretty good shot at running a BIG #.

 

[JB Cases]

Baloney -- the opinion of the fans and aficionados always counts.

Your opinion counts, as does mine.

No, your opinion does not count. It does not matter. The world of pool doesn't feel the slightest bit of influence or concern with what you think of John Schmidt's record.

Thinking that your opinion matters is just vanity. No one breathing thought to consult you on the nuances of John's record run in order to get your opinion on the validity of it.

The only place where your opinion matters at this point is in regards to how long you will keep promoting the fact that John Schmidt ran 626 balls. If I were selling viewings of this historic feat I would want the critics keeping the interest alive for free forever.

 

[logical]

I am not at liberty to repeat names told to me in confidence -- you can choose to believe me, or not.

And yes, JS may be able to run over 600 but unedited evidence of this super power is hard to come by.

Lou Figueroa

To be fair, there are probably just as many prominent pros who believe that the earth is flat.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[lfigueroa]

To be fair, there are probably just as many prominent pros who believe that the earth is flat.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

I think there’s only one of them, so no, I don’t think that would be fair.

In any case, no “evidence” for a flat Earth or a big run : -)

Lou Figueroa

 

[Cuedup]

Other than the video viewed by many.

 

[JB Cases]

Thank You Lou for kind words, I have enough trouble carrying my own case sometimes - this thread is Tom - but omnipotent to Proper like - American 14.1 Pocket Billiard Adjudication, my case here is 'It's George'.

Well played on that one. ;-)

 

[JB Cases]

I don't think we are too far off. I was just assuming for the sake of argument that the JS record is confirmed. I was speaking more to what kind of record it is - exhibition or practice or should it matter even? It clearly isn't an exhibition record but on the other hand didn't the BCA kind of make up that category in order to record the Mosconi run as an official record? I see no problem in having three categories of high runs. Obviously tournament records are limited by the length of the match. Exhibitions aren't even held any more so Mosconi's record would remain untouched. That leaves practice runs which is where we are today. I say three categories because each is significantly different from the others. Just thinking out loud.

I think that it's fair to categorize them but I also wonder about the skewing of perceptions. For example if the match is to 150 and a player starts at 20 and runs 130 then they have won the match of course but if they are allowed to continue and they run 500 more is that 500 the practice or exhibition run? Would it have to be broken down into 130 competition/500 exhibition total 630?

I think that we need to consider that 14.1 long runs are a solitary exercise after the competitive aspect is over. So basically if we are looking to assign a "pressure value" by classifying non-competitive runs then it seems to me that this a bit too much hair splitting.

Take Mosconi's exhibition run for example. Was this more or less pressure than any other run? Well I would say it was less pressure. He was simply running balls at the encouragement of his friend, the pool room owner. So the audience would have been impressed with any run after that and there was nothing at stake. And up until that time I don't know what the high runs were but I want to say in the 300s. So really there was no pressure or expectation and a wonderful run did happen and the rest is history.

John's runs on the other hand had the pressure of deliberately chasing Mosconi's record. They had the pressure of everyone thinking that it would take such an effort with sufficient motivation to have any chance of surpassing 526. They had the pressure of having a team spend their time and money supporting it and not wanting to fail. And there was the internal pressure of thinking that failure meant something deficient in the human mind and body that made it unable to equal or exceed something a predecessor had done and which didn't require any super human ability on the surface.

So, to me John's run is the one with more pressure on it. It is the rightful record and to me the better record.

 

[JB Cases]

I think there’s only one of them, so no, I don’t think that would be fair.

In any case, no “evidence” for a flat Earth or a big run : -)

Lou Figueroa

So Freddie Agnir is a liar or has been deceived?

 

[rexus31]

So, to me John's run is the one with more pressure on it. It is the rightful record and to me the better record.

I agree and will add more perseverance as well. Remember the 434 run (his personal best at the time) a few months before the 626? That freak scratch to end that run was most certainly a punch to the gut. To persevere through all that and put up a 626 is a testament to John's mental fortitude. Imagine the break shot at rack 38. On the cusp of breaking the record. The pressure must have been immense. The mental toughness to do it is off the charts.

 

[Black-Balled]

I agree and will add more perseverance as well. Remember the 434 run (his personal best at the time) a few months before the 626? That freak scratch to end that run was most certainly a punch to the gut. To persevere through all that and put up a 626 is a testament to John's mental fortitude. Imagine the break shot at rack 38. On the cusp of breaking the record. The pressure must have been immense. The mental toughness to do it is off the charts.

I dunno.

I heard it was John's gleeful anticipation of the anguish he would impart on Danny that kept him happily efforting toward 527+

 

[easy-e]

I dunno.

I heard it was John's gleeful anticipation of the anguish he would impart on Danny that kept him happily efforting toward 527+

I really wish he had considered not ending with a miss, like he discussed in his interview with Joey. Just rake the balls instead of shooting the combo. Say "that's enough" and walk away.