The Quite Eye

[BC21]

But with poolology, newbies trying to use it would be groping and gasping at trying to figure out which fraction to see and pick to make those shots. "Is it this one or that one...no, it must be the other one. I can't find CCB. This looks screwy and like too much work. Now what was that part about all the math based on the diamond locations and shot line. I need a calculator, compass, and T-square. I think I have it. CRAP, I MISSED!"

The setup was for me to have a way to control and see the exact same thing as Dan was seeing just to learn the visuals and PIVOTS. The ball going in was secondary. It apparently served its purpose because he MISSED all of them as a result of not pivoting the right way.

Could I have had him throw balls out randomly with all kinds of cut angles from mild to severe and not knowing what he was doing or supposed to be doing? Sure, and it would have been a disaster with nothing to learn.

You can be a real wise ass and should learn to keep your nose out of where it doesn't belong, especially when you don't know what's really going on and why.

Uh.... I was just stating the reason why all 3 balls can hit the pocket with the same aim - large margin for error, large window of pocket accessibility.

You mentioned something like no other aiming method could do that, pocket all 3 shots with the same aim. That's just not true, which was my point: With a margin of error greater than 10°, the same aim using any method can pocket many different shots, some will go center hole and some will go left of right of center hole. Move the object balls out another 15 inches and that's when more refined aiming or tweaking would be needed.

Really, no sense in getting bent out of shape simply because you and Dan and PJ are having another little hissy fit over CTE. My post had nothing to do with CTE or Shiskabob or any aiming in general. I simply stated the reason why the aim reference can work for multiple shots when the object balls are close to the pocket.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

My first couple of posts were on topic and had to do with what "looks on" means to you, a CTE user. After that, my posts were mostly defending myself from incorrect statements made by spider. I haven't posted here since 4 am Saturday and this will be my last post unless someone takes another shot at me.

Let's just say there were misinterpreted statements/responses by BOTH of us and mine had to deal with the PIVOTS. With what we were doing, NOTHING "looks on" because it's completely different from all else.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Uh.... I was just stating the reason why all 3 balls can hit the pocket with the same aim - large margin for error, large window of pocket accessibility.

You mentioned something like no other aiming method could do that, pocket all 3 shots with the same aim. That's just not true, which was my point: With a margin of error greater than 10°, the same aim using any method can pocket many different shots, some will go center hole and some will go left of right of center hole. Move the object balls out another 15 inches and that's when more refined aiming or tweaking would be needed.

Really, no sense in getting bent out of shape simply because you and Dan and PJ are having another little hissy fit over CTE. My post had nothing to do with CTE or Shiskabob or any aiming in general. I simply stated the reason why the aim reference CAN WORK for multiple shots when the object balls are close to the pocket.

Brian, what part of it DIDN'T work with the object balls close to the pocket?

Please stay out of this. I don't care to hear your thoughts because they're immaterial and not applicable and it's none of your business.

 

[BC21]

.....
No one decides the final aim line while standing. They can have an extremely close approximation of that final aim, but adjustments are made when down on the ball even if they don't want to admit it. Ignorance is bliss in this regard, and is in essence invisible proof of the subconscious mind at work.

I have yet to see anyone close their eyes at the standing position. Get down on the shot and pull the trigger successfully on anything beyond the extremely basic shots. If what you saying about final aim lines is true then you can pull this off repeatedly on nearly anything.

In bold... that's not quite true. Any competent player can look at a shot and know the exact final aim line from a standing position. The next step is to align the body and the stroke to that known line.

While down on the shot, the conscious and subconscious collaborate to ensure that eveything looks and feels right. Every shot is therefore a collaborative effort between conscious and subconscious thoughts, checks and double-checks.

When we try too hard we have a tendency to rely strictly on conscious thought, not allowing the subconscious to do what it does best - control fine motor skills.

 

[cookie man]

How could you possibly have any idea about any of this? As a long time CTE user you don't have an aim line to adjust from. All you know about is A,B, and C perceptions. What do you mean by "everything better look good." You mean the shot should look "on" based on HAMB? Is that what you as a CTE user is advocating? I thought the pocket was irrelevant with CTE.

Here you are Innocent Dan. Your first post in this thread. Mentioned CTE 3 times instead of staying on the topic of the thread. You go out of your way trying to trap CTE users with there posts. But in reality you just embarrass yourself for your lack of knowledge on cte.
Will this be considered a shot at you or just a defense of what you misleadingly posted

 

[Dan White]

Here you are Innocent Dan. Your first post in this thread. Mentioned CTE 3 times instead of staying on the topic of the thread. You go out of your way trying to trap CTE users with there posts. But in reality you just embarrass yourself for your lack of knowledge on cte.
Will this be considered a shot at you or just a defense of what you misleadingly posted

The question is how does the shot look "on" when you and the other CTEers have said for years that the pocket is irrelevant? It isn't off topic, really, and it is odd that you are so "offended" for such a simple question. You never did answer the question but that's OK. We all know the real answer.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

If you can not shoot straight, among is is not problem.

People forget how small the point of contact is at impact between CB n OB.

Tiny.

 

[cookie man]

The question is how does the shot look "on" when you and the other CTEers have said for years that the pocket is irrelevant? It isn't off topic, really, and it is odd that you are so "offended" for such a simple question. You never did answer the question but that's OK. We all know the real answer.

So what’s the real answer that you THINK you know?

 

[SpiderWebComm]

The question is how does the shot look "on" when you and the other CTEers have said for years that the pocket is irrelevant? It isn't off topic, really, and it is odd that you are so "offended" for such a simple question. You never did answer the question but that's OK. We all know the real answer.

How many does "we all" mean? The current tribe of 8, maximum, who keep pursuing this from back in RSB days? Nobody else really gives a crap. In reality, "we all" here is very small. WE ALL on FB has a completely different meaning and is very high.

 

[cookie man]

The question is how does the shot look "on" when you and the other CTEers have said for years that the pocket is irrelevant? It isn't off topic, really, and it is odd that you are so "offended" for such a simple question. You never did answer the question but that's OK. We all know the real answer.

We were talking about quiet eye so yes you were off topic bringing CTE into the discussion.
But let me answer for you since I know you won't answer my question. When learning CTE the pocket is irrelevant. Why? Because you want to learn the proper perceptions and how to visualize them. If you keep looking at the pocket then your old ways could force adjustments that will cause you to miss, remember CTE is a whole new way to aim. You have to let the past go. Now since I am a very experienced cte player, yes i know when the shot looks on. I know when my perception looks on. When actually playing pool, DO YOU EVEN PLAY, I need to know where the pocket is so after getting my perception to center pocket i can make my minute adjustments for things such as English, table conditions, and position play. Once again your question falls into the category of , How very little Dan knows about CTE.
CENTER POCKET MUSIC is such a sweet sound.

 

[The_JV]

In bold... that's not quite true. Any competent player can look at a shot and know the exact final aim line from a standing position. The next step is to align the body and the stroke to that known line.

While down on the shot, the conscious and subconscious collaborate to ensure that eveything looks and feels right. Every shot is therefore a collaborative effort between conscious and subconscious thoughts, checks and double-checks.

When we try too hard we have a tendency to rely strictly on conscious thought, not allowing the subconscious to do what it does best - control fine motor skills.

Ok... how about, someone can think they have made the final decision on the aim line before they get down. The odds of landing perfect on that line and already be corrected for variables is unlikely.

 

[Dan White]

We were talking about quiet eye so yes you were off topic bringing CTE into the discussion.
But let me answer for you since I know you won't answer my question. When learning CTE the pocket is irrelevant. Why? Because you want to learn the proper perceptions and how to visualize them. If you keep looking at the pocket then your old ways could force adjustments that will cause you to miss, remember CTE is a whole new way to aim. You have to let the past go. Now since I am a very experienced cte player, yes i know when the shot looks on. I know when my perception looks on. When actually playing pool, DO YOU EVEN PLAY, I need to know where the pocket is so after getting my perception to center pocket i can make my minute adjustments for things such as English, table conditions, and position play. Once again your question falls into the category of , How very little Dan knows about CTE.
CENTER POCKET MUSIC is such a sweet sound.

None of this makes any sense. If every shot is going center pocket due to CTE you don't need to see the pocket in order to cheat it one way or the other. How does seeing the pocket help you to cheat if that pocket wasn't even a consideration in your initial aim? When you start cheating do you then start looking at the pocket and now you are aiming like the rest of us? What you most likely are doing is using CTE as a pre shot routine (maybe, if even that) and then seeing the correct shot picture like the rest of us do. If the pocket location had nothing to do with your aiming process then you'd have no reason to "just see" the shots like the rest of us. The fact is that the pocket is critical in aiming whether your ego wants to believe it or not.

 

[Dan White]

How many does "we all" mean? The current tribe of 8, maximum, who keep pursuing this from back in RSB days? Nobody else really gives a crap. In reality, "we all" here is very small. WE ALL on FB has a completely different meaning and is very high.

"We all" is everybody who thinks rationally. You are in that group I'd say about every third day.

 

[BC21]

Ok... how about, someone can think they have made the final decision on the aim line before they get down. The odds of landing perfect on that line and already be corrected for variables is unlikely.

Example..... I can be 100% certain from a standing position that a particular shot requires a halfball hit to pocket the ob. With no side spin and no stun, the aim line through ccb to the edge of the ob is 100% known, 100% the final decision for aiming. It's really not difficult to step into that line, bringing the cue into it at the same time, lining up straight through ccb to the ob edge, no adjustments necessary. Any fine tuning is merely the process of ensuring that your stroke is indeed on that predetermined aim line.

With experience, many aim lines for using side spin can also be accurately determined from a standing position. For myself and many others, the aiming is done prior to getting down on the cb for most shots. If I find myself moving my cue or my head around trying to find an aim line while I'm at ball address, I get back up and start over.

 

[cookie man]

None of this makes any sense. If every shot is going center pocket due to CTE you don't need to see the pocket in order to cheat it one way or the other. How does seeing the pocket help you to cheat if that pocket wasn't even a consideration in your initial aim? When you start cheating do you then start looking at the pocket and now you are aiming like the rest of us? What you most likely are doing is using CTE as a pre shot routine (maybe, if even that) and then seeing the correct shot picture like the rest of us do. If the pocket location had nothing to do with your aiming process then you'd have no reason to "just see" the shots like the rest of us. The fact is that the pocket is critical in aiming whether your ego wants to believe it or not.

Nothing you post makes any sense in relation to CTE. DO YOU EVEN PLAY POOL? I answered your question answer mine.

 

[The_JV]

Example..... I can be 100% certain from a standing position that a particular shot requires a halfball hit to pocket the ob. With no side spin and no stun, the aim line through ccb to the edge of the ob is 100% known, 100% the final decision for aiming. It's really not difficult to step into that line, bringing the cue into it at the same time, lining up straight through ccb to the ob edge, no adjustments necessary. Any fine tuning is merely the process of ensuring that your stroke is indeed on that predetermined aim line.

If you read back I write something very similar about rudimentary shots without english.

With experience, many aim lines for using side spin can also be accurately determined from a standing position. For myself and many others, the aiming is done prior to getting down on the cb for most shots. If I find myself moving my cue or my head around trying to find an aim line while I'm at ball address, I get back up and start over.

Again, my examples are my own regarding how I determine/apply side english to shots. I cannot determine aim lines before I have a grasp on the amount of english will be applied. I do not know this fact with any certainty until I'm down on the shot. Everyone else's practices can be different, but that doesn't alter mine. I made it a point to call out my comments were souly based on my experience.

 

[BC21]

If you read back I write something very similar about rudimentary shots without english.

Again, my examples are my own regarding how I determine/apply side english to shots. I cannot determine aim lines before I have a grasp on the amount of english will be applied. I do not know this fact with any certainty until I'm down on the shot. Everyone else's practices can be different, but that doesn't alter mine. I made it a point to call out my comments were souly based on my experience.

I understand completely. There are certain shots where the exact amount of spin is determined while down on the shot. Just wanted to point out that many shots can be accurately aimed from the standing position and landed on with 100% certainty.

 

[boogieman]

Advertisement = BS. We’ve tried over and over to be helpful to the critics. They don’t want to learn CTE. They just chime in to tear it down.

PJ and Dan fired the first CTE shots. We were talking about the subject at hand but they kept talking CTE. It’s what they do.

Well said. The thing I find funny is it's pretty much the same argument for 20 years with neither side really understanding or caring what the other side is getting at. Brick wall meet unmovable force.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

I need to know where the pocket is so after getting my perception to center pocket i can make my minute adjustments for things such as English, table conditions, and position play.

If the “perception” gives the center pocket aim line, why not just adjust from that?

pj <- asking for a friend
chgo

 

[cookie man]

If the “perception” gives the center pocket aim line, why not just adjust from that?

pj <- asking for a friend
chgo

A matter of preference. I prefer to try and take all factors into consideration.