I know one thing, you try this nitty shit at Buffalo's(or just about any deep south joint) and they'll feed your nit ass to the nearest gator. Matches this big should have ALL the $$ posted and held by room-owner or some un-involved person. The old saying "Money on the wood makes the gamblin' good" is still true today.
Archer and Oscar talk it out live today at 3:00 CST
- Thread starter DeadStick
- Start date
Well put.
When he said he would try to shark him to break his momentum, what else does it imply?
I agree with much this but any sympathy i may have for the guy has been greatly reduced due to his constant blaming of others for his situation. Its always 'poor lil Johnny looked what happened to me'. Suck it up and own your mistakes.
I have a couple guys that owe me money. Maybe Doggin' It should get into debt resolution podcasts. LOL
Call it the 'Daily Deadbeat'. Might be on to something. Call people out enough and maybe they'll whip the $$. I like it.
I made the comment about getting a job and I didn't mean it as an insult, I meant it as sincere, good-willed advice. Hatch and Dechaine are two examples that come to mind. I bet if you asked them, they'd say they made the right decision to leave pool for a steady paycheck with health insurance. There's something to be said about hard work and being able to hold your head up high and look people in the eye. The stress for a past-his-prime pool player trying to make ends meet must be awful. Give it up. It was good while it lasted.
I listened to the podcast, and it answered some questions I had about how the actual game, backers, and bet went down.
I'm rooting for Archer to make a comeback. Even if Oscar never gets another dime I'm still rooting for him. One event should not define a man. Unfortunately, that's how Social Media has made it these days. The sharking comment is BS, even if made by Archer himself. There are hundreds of matches with JA in them going back 30 years. I challenge anyone to find where he sharked his man.
The money breakdown I recall from the podcast was:
12,100 bet (per man).
4000 paid a couple days later.
100 paid installment
500 paid installment
500 paid installment
500 paid installment
5600 total paid
6500 balance remaining
I've been around stiffers at the pool room my whole life. Honestly, getting about half the bet paid is pretty good IMO. That's just reality sometime.
One thing that stood out at me on the podcast is JA said he had not gambled much since about 1989, and that he followed Earl's lead and did the tournament trail.
I'm rooting for Archer to make a comeback. Even if Oscar never gets another dime I'm still rooting for him. One event should not define a man. Unfortunately, that's how Social Media has made it these days. The sharking comment is BS, even if made by Archer himself. There are hundreds of matches with JA in them going back 30 years. I challenge anyone to find where he sharked his man.
The money breakdown I recall from the podcast was:
12,100 bet (per man).
4000 paid a couple days later.
100 paid installment
500 paid installment
500 paid installment
500 paid installment
5600 total paid
6500 balance remaining
I've been around stiffers at the pool room my whole life. Honestly, getting about half the bet paid is pretty good IMO. That's just reality sometime.
One thing that stood out at me on the podcast is JA said he had not gambled much since about 1989, and that he followed Earl's lead and did the tournament trail.
That makes Mika the biggest sharker of all time!!! LOL
FTR, I am so out of the loop with anything this thread has discussed.
1.) I never knew JA and OD ever played a $$$ match where OD got stiffed.
2.) I never even knew that JA and his wife had split up.
3.) i never knew that JA was not only flat broke, but despised by many people in the pool world (at least on AZB).
I guess I oughta get out more???
L.S. Dennis
Well-known member
I remember him saying that he followed Earl's lead in the no gambling but no gambling since 1989 is somewhat spurious. I remember during the 90's him playing Bustamonte a race to 13, 2 out of 3 set where Busti won the first one and Johnny ran 13 racks and out on the second one. At that time Busti wanted to raise the bet on the third, and won it in that last one. Johnny's fallen on some hard times most of which he created but nevertheless I don't believe in kicking someone when they down and out. I think at least some compassion is warranted here.
What is hard for me to believe is apparently, with absolutely no $ to stake up himself, that JA originally had $70K lined up in backers that were going to back him in this match, playing even, in a match that he is not supposed to win for anyone who has remotely followed the men’s professional pool scene.
Apparently most of these original backers came to their senses and backed out, which is why the bet ended up being for $12K and not $70K.
I actually thought Archer was the favorite. I lost a few hundred in our AZB action room betting on him. Oh well, you need 2 sides to get down!
Edit: I recall they said on the podcast the original bet was 30k per man.
If Archer were really interested in making it right he could simply do some honest work by giving lessons. He could charge $100 an hour, which means 60 hours of work to accumulate $6k. (Well, not so honest if he's not reporting the income as taxable, but you get the drift.)
Meanwhile, in the real world hundreds of millions of people around the world do 60+ work hours a week, every week.
Meanwhile, in the real world hundreds of millions of people around the world do 60+ work hours a week, every week.
I had this playing in the background while I was working.
Oscar lost money just being a part of that waste of time.
He had much better things to do than listen to that BS.
Oscar lost money just being a part of that waste of time.
He had much better things to do than listen to that BS.
smiling_Hans
Well-known member
Live by the cue. Die by the cue.
With that said I'm glad I fell out of love with this game. I just play once a week now because I like the people.
It did waste a lot of time of my life. I have kids tell me they want to practice blah blah blah....I tell them to go to school.
Carry a backpack. Don't carry a cue case.
With that said I'm glad I fell out of love with this game. I just play once a week now because I like the people.
It did waste a lot of time of my life. I have kids tell me they want to practice blah blah blah....I tell them to go to school.
Carry a backpack. Don't carry a cue case.
I think if anyone wanted to try making a regular income giving pool lessons, they would need to travel from city to city, by a pre-defined schedule, hoping to pick up 20 hours of lessons a week. Subtract traveling / living expenses and I don't think it would be viable. With all the free on-line tutorials, I just don't think there's that many pool players willing to shell out $100 per hours for any length of time. I took one lesson from Jim Rempe years ago. I believe it was $50 an hour. I spend $50 bucks and worked on what he told me. I never had any intention of paying for regular lessons (didn't have that kind of expendable income).
smiling_Hans
Well-known member
$50 an hour with Archer can be so valuable. I wouldn't even work on basics as a higher level and experienced player that I am. I would just be picking his brain about shots that nobody knows. Basically shots you don't see when you're practicing.
For example when I was a teen I had the privileged to meet an old time local who use to travel and gamble in the 70's. At that time he taught me the "rail first" shot. Something at the time I would never learned on my own since I didn't learn pool from reading a book like my peers. I just played. Well that shot helped me win a lot of games when it involved the 9 being stuck on the rail.
There are certain "voodoo magic" that a professional or great player have or have seen that we don't know.
This could have been a five minute podcast. Archer acknowledged he owes Oscar. I managed to get about 33 minutes in listening while I did other things. A lot of deflection on Johnny's part. I was impressed with what he said the first few minutes, downhill from there.
These corporations behind players for backers are always going to have people taking a free roll. I'll back somebody for a hundred grand I don't have. The other side can't collect and probably won't have me hit and risk a lifetime in prison. On the other hand, if my horse wins I stand to get some money, maybe the full hundred thousand.
What Oscar described for the way business is done today is a fine way to get the bidness done to you! The way of doing business may have changed since the eighties, human nature hasn't.
All to say you are right. Money on the light keeps things right. When talking huge stakes, in a safe on site. These matches with combines backing players with verbal agreements are ripe for rip offs. Neither side can be really sure their backers will come through if they lose.
Hu
Sometimes I wish we could boil life down to simple math and other times I'm grateful that we can't.
Forgive my sentimentality here... I'm a lifelong Michigan football fan and I experienced some really strange celebrations at my home while watching the last few games on the road to the National Title. My home was full of adults jumping around like children over a stupid football game. Me included.
All sports, including pool, are ridiculously trivial on the one hand, and absolutely necessary on the other. The older I get the more clear this becomes. Just last night, I fell asleep to the voice of Grady Matthews while Archer and Sigel locked horns yet again, like they will on a continuous loop from here until eternity. Watching pool has been one of the greatest stress relievers in my life for years and all the great American players have played their role in this for me. So I guess in appreciation for that, I extend them all a little more grace than I probably would otherwise.