Force Follow vs Stun Follow

F

Flip_dat_Quarta

Banned
What do you call this shot:

The shot alignment is straight in. You shoot the shot so that the cue ball's stun is just starting to wear off when it makes contact with the object ball. The cue ball rolls forward a few inches after contact and stops.

Is that called a force follow shot or a stun follow shot?

Does anyone else struggle with these shots? It's very difficult for me to control the amount of roll after contact.
 
measureman

measureman

AzB Silver Member
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that would be a stun follow. hitting the cue ball just a hair above center. You control the forward roll thru how high above center you hit it and how hard.
a force follow is hit high on the cue ball with a short sharp stroke. The cue ball will seem to stop for a split second and then pick up a lot of speed.
And no I don't have any problems with these shots,they are easy after 55 years of shooting them.
 
Cuebuddy

Cuebuddy

Mini cues
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measureman said:
that would be a stun follow. hitting the cue ball just a hair above center. You control the forward roll thru how high above center you hit it and how hard.
a force follow is hit high on the cue ball with a short sharp stroke. The cue ball will seem to stop for a split second and then pick up a lot of speed.
And no I don't have any problems with these shots,they are easy after 55 years of shooting them.
Click to expand...

You may not have any problems with these shots but when you shoot them they give me fits. :p
 
TATE

TATE

AzB Gold Mensch
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It's kind of surprising there doesn't seem to be a name for this shot in American pool.
 
Bob Jewett

Bob Jewett

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TATE said:
It's kind of surprising there doesn't seem to be a name for this shot in American pool.
Click to expand...
The UKers have a long tradition of written instruction at billiards. That requires the naming of concepts and techniques.

The first book of pool instruction in the US was Mosconi's little red book in 1948 if you don't count the previous books which were mostly about billiards. For carom billiards I think the term would be "dead" follow.
 
Jude Rosenstock

Jude Rosenstock

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Stun Follow - Cue ball will travel along the perpendicular line momentarily before curving into forward direction. You achieve this by hitting slightly above center and with force.

Ideal for getting the cueball to slide across the table yet still bend forward.

Force Follow - A shit-ton of follow. The reaction is most noticeable when the cue-ball reaches a cluster. The immediate contact will be followed by a huge surge from the cue-ball. It can also be seen with a single object ball. The forward momentum of the cue-ball is slower than its forward spin creating a huge surge once the cueball grabs hold of the cloth. You achieve this by hitting with as much follow as possible and with speed.

Ideal for getting a lot of action on the cueball to either go through clusters, create long distance position routes or even perform small jumps.
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
In the UK they call it "stun runthrough", and it's used a lot more in snooker than american pool. Definitely not easy and a more "professional" way of shooting follow shots that takes perfect timing and tip placement.
Ronnie O'Sullivan explains it here (around 12:08):
http://youtu.be/LHeeJy_SJFw
 
BmoreMoney

BmoreMoney

AzB Silver Member
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I've always called this a stun shot or stunning the cue ball. I use this for when I need to hit the shot with some speed but need pin point position requiring only an inch or two of follow and can not be achieved with follow due to the speed of the shot because of the distance of the object ball to the pocket.
 
fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
There is the shot Bert Kinister calls "ball replacement', where the cue ball doesnt quite stop but it rolls up to occupy the spot that the object ball had occupied. This is a tough shot, if your shot is close to this Im sure it is just a variation of the "ball replacement" shot.
 
K

KMRUNOUT

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Flip_dat_Quarta said:
What do you call this shot:

The shot alignment is straight in. You shoot the shot so that the cue ball's stun is just starting to wear off when it makes contact with the object ball. The cue ball rolls forward a few inches after contact and stops.

Is that called a force follow shot or a stun follow shot?

Does anyone else struggle with these shots? It's very difficult for me to control the amount of roll after contact.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't call it force follow. To me, force follow is when I make the cue ball *drive* forward after contact. I would consider force follow to be the opposite of "power draw". I would call it stun run through. I'd really call it "Bert Kinister shot # 1" lol. Check out his 60 minute workout. He talks all about this shot and its importance.

It is indeed difficult to master the feel of how much follow you will get. I pretty much shoot a stop shot but finely tune my tip position to get just the amount I want. I guess after shooting the shot a million times, I sort of do it by feel. It is a really great shot to practice though!

KMRUNOUT
 
Tennesseejoe

Tennesseejoe

AzB Silver Member
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measureman said:
that would be a stun follow. hitting the cue ball just a hair above center. You control the forward roll thru how high above center you hit it and how hard.
.
Click to expand...

Stun follow is hit slightly below center (not above). The cue ball has reverse on it until just before object ball contact. A good way to practice this shot is by using a stripe ball for the cue ball. Watch for when the reverse English turns to forward roll.
 
Pidge

Pidge

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It's a stun run through as I would call it. I would hazard a guess that 60%, maybe a little higher of all the shots I play in snooker are a form of stun run through. Especially on the black. You can either play a stun with side... Or a stun run through with no side... Anyone in their right mind is going to elect to play without side so it's why a lot of snooker players practise and perfect this shot.

A little tip for anyone struggling if I may....

You want the cue ball to travel 6"forward on a straight in shot using the stun run through. Imagine the object ball is 6" closer to you and try play a stop shot for this imaginary new object ball. Imagine the speed and the required tip placement you want to hit to get this stop shot. And what do you know, you just hit a perfect stun run through of 6".

Anyone wanting to pick up some tips from the pros need only to watch John Higgins play a few frames. He is the best player at this type of shot I've ever had the pleasure of watching. He uses it regularly and is frighteningly accurate with it.
 
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