What's your estimated fargo rating if you beat 9 ball ghost more often than not?

babyboy70363 · Feb 8, 2019

And I'm asking out of honest ignorance.....

How do you determine your playing speed by how many times you beat the ghost in 9 ball with all the breaks and BIH after the break?

You never get hooked on the break, never get a lockup safety played on you, and God forbid the ghost pushes out.....I wouldn't find this an "accurate" measurement of player speed. JMHO

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nine_ball6970 · Feb 8, 2019

babyboy70363 said:
And I'm asking out of honest ignorance.....

How do you determine your playing speed by how many times you beat the ghost in 9 ball with all the breaks and BIH after the break?

You never get hooked on the break, never get a lockup safety played on you, and God forbid the ghost pushes out.....I wouldn't find this an "accurate" measurement of player speed. JMHO

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Ability to consistently run out racks from first opportunity is the mark of a strong player. If someone is able to do this, it is hard to believe that other areas of their game are seriously lacking.

Speed is determined by the average scores win or lose. Watch the top pros and it is just funny. Beat the ghost 9-0 without much effort on an average table. Only games they lose are when balls are tied up which they can't break out. They rarely if ever dog a ball.

JC · Feb 8, 2019

The ghost beats me 75% of the time on my 9 foot table.

I am a 600 with 1400 games in the system.

This makes the ghost a 650 player if you use the fair match calculator. 650 has a 75% chance of winning a race to 7 against me. So at 650 you will win half the time over the ghost if you accept this logic.

Therefore to beat the ghost on a 9 footer most of the time you would need to be higher than 650.

Of course the ghost can't be rated fairly because they never miss. So this is all just food for thought.

My gut feeling tells me to beat the ghost "most of the time" on a nine footer you will probably need to be above 650 fargo.

JC

FeelDaShot · Feb 8, 2019

babyboy70363 said:
And I'm asking out of honest ignorance.....

How do you determine your playing speed by how many times you beat the ghost in 9 ball with all the breaks and BIH after the break?

You never get hooked on the break, never get a lockup safety played on you, and God forbid the ghost pushes out.....I wouldn't find this an "accurate" measurement of player speed. JMHO

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

I disagree. Results against the ghost say a lot. They don't incorporate all aspects of the game but they incorporate enough to make an accurate judgement of a player's ability/speed.

For comparison, I've included some scores below from Roy's Basement practice sessions against the ghost:

Kristina Tkach (702), 10-ball ghost: Win 11-5
James Aranas (806), 11-ball ghost: Win 11-4
James Aranas (806), 12-ball ghost: Win 7-4
Johann Chua (794), 13-ball ghost: Win 7-4

These were all done a on 9 foot diamond. I'm pretty sure the pockets are standard.

gxman · Feb 8, 2019

Does an A(no + or ++) player from Houston/NY beats the ghost in 9b on a Diamond?

What about a B+ player?

Jennifer Barretta is a 656 Fago. Judging from what I've seen her play in tournament streams, I confidently say she beats the ghost.

Pete · Feb 8, 2019

babyboy70363 said:
And I'm asking out of honest ignorance.....

How do you determine your playing speed by how many times you beat the ghost in 9 ball with all the breaks and BIH after the break?

You never get hooked on the break, never get a lockup safety played on you, and God forbid the ghost pushes out.....I wouldn't find this an "accurate" measurement of player speed. JMHO

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Look up Tor Lory on YouTube Skill Test.

That might help...

9BallKY · Feb 8, 2019

babyboy70363 said:
And I'm asking out of honest ignorance.....

How do you determine your playing speed by how many times you beat the ghost in 9 ball with all the breaks and BIH after the break?

You never get hooked on the break, never get a lockup safety played on you, and God forbid the ghost pushes out.....I wouldn't find this an "accurate" measurement of player speed. JMHO

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

You make some good points. These are some of the disadvantages of playing the ghost
You have to run every rack or it's a loss
You can never play a safe
You never have the chance of your opponent making a mistake
You only get one shot in every game you play.

tucson9ball · Feb 8, 2019

longhorns2 said:
8 foot table taking ball in hand after the break?

On a 8ft table, which are mostly just in houses any more, I would say you need to be about 620+ to beat the ghost most of the time.
My Fargo is 666 and I beat the ghost regularly. Keep this in mind though....playing the ghost you get ball in hand after the break so hitting the balls firm is the key. If the balls are all spread out across the table without any clusters, you should beat the ghost handily. What stops most runs is the occasional cluster of balls more than a missed shot.
In a game situation you would run to the cluster and plan a clever safety, trying to get ball in hand and keep control of the match.
Anyhoo, playing the ghost is a good training exercise to see how your shooting skills and position play are coming along but safety play is also a good thing to practice.

tucson9ball · Feb 8, 2019

babyboy70363 said:
And I'm asking out of honest ignorance.....

How do you determine your playing speed by how many times you beat the ghost in 9 ball with all the breaks and BIH after the break?

You never get hooked on the break, never get a lockup safety played on you, and God forbid the ghost pushes out.....I wouldn't find this an "accurate" measurement of player speed. JMHO

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Very good points. I would consider playing the ghost more of an offensive drill. IMHO, if you were rated 620+ you can beat the ghost. How you play in tournaments, playing safeties and breaking well, just to name a couple things...that 620 could be tweaked lower or higher depending on the player.

easy-e · Feb 8, 2019

tucson9ball said:
Very good points. I would consider playing the ghost more of an offensive drill. IMHO, if you were rated 620+ you can beat the ghost. How you play in tournaments, playing safeties and breaking well, just to name a couple things...that 620 could be tweaked lower or higher depending on the player.

I think that the average 620 speed would have a difficult time beating the ghost on a 9’ Diamond. I’d be interested to see some players in AZ try it.

Charlie Hustle · Feb 8, 2019

gxman said:
Does an A(no + or ++) player from Houston/NY beats the ghost in 9b on a Diamond?

What about a B+ player?

Jennifer Barretta is a 656 Fago. Judging from what I've seen her play in tournament streams, I confidently say she beats the ghost.

Id say a strong A player in Houston has about a 55-60% chance against the ghost on a 9 ft Diamond.

ribdoner · Feb 8, 2019

Not relevant

FARGO rating is predicated on how a player does vs competition

the "ghost" doesn't shoot back

Many "practice" at a high level, however, the don't play like they practice when the heat is on

In addition playing the "ghost" is one dimensional, which is far from the case during match play

PoolBum · Feb 8, 2019

longhorns2 said:
8 foot table taking ball in hand after the break?

'Bout tree-fiddy.

railbird99 · Feb 8, 2019

It would be interesting to have matches with the ghost reported like any other match in fargo, so that the ghost would actually have a fargo rating.

JolietJames · Feb 8, 2019

I'm just under 600 Fargo and break even with a 9' gold crown ghost with easy pockets. I'll bet on me to win more than I lose on an 8 footer. However, the 9' diamond ghost is Amityville scary and I'm staying the heck away.

Poolmanis · Feb 8, 2019

I can try Ghost race to 100 hundred when I have time.. or maybe 100 racks

One of our poolhalls got all Diamonds just re-clothed.. There is nice to shoot now.
My fargo is about 700 hundred now but lately I have played so bad tournaments that if they get into a fargo system it would drop. Anyways 700 is probably close to my real speed. I believe that nine ball normal ghost I am normally a big favorite. 10-ball it evens out a lot. It sure depends a lot for your days condition. Ghost plays always perfect- :grin:

ChrisinNC · Feb 8, 2019

easy-e said:
I think that the average 620 speed would have a difficult time beating the ghost on a 9’ Diamond. I’d be interested to see some players in AZ try it.

There are numerous factors as to what rules you play vs the ghost which greatly affect how hard it is. Of course what size table and pockets you're playing on? Do you use a template rack or not? Do you rack high with the 9-ball on the spot or not? Do you lose if you scratch on the break? Can you win by playing the 9-ball early or do you still have to run out all remaining balls on the table?

When I play the ghost, I play by the strictest rules possible and on an extremely tight table, so my chance of beating the ghost in a race to 11 has generally been very small - so when I occasionally happen to pull it off, it makes it far more rewarding! I've found the biggest obstacle /frustration for me when playing the ghost is either scratching on the break, or when even on a good hard break, the balls just by chance get tied up, making it very hard to run them. Once in a while I've literally had no shot at making even the very first ball, even with ball-in-hand!

9BallKY · Feb 9, 2019

easy-e said:
I think that the average 620 speed would have a difficult time beating the ghost on a 9’ Diamond. I’d be interested to see some players in AZ try it.

I tried the ghost earlier,it might be a day or so before I have time but if i can get the video to upload I'll post a link.

CreeDo · Feb 9, 2019

I think 600 can win half the racks on easy equipment, 8ft or bucket 9ft. On a diamond 9ft I think 625 is the right number.

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gxman · Feb 9, 2019

FeelDaShot said:
I disagree. Results against the ghost say a lot. They don't incorporate all aspects of the game but they incorporate enough to make an accurate judgement of a player's ability/speed.

For comparison, I've included some scores below from Roy's Basement practice sessions against the ghost:

Kristina Tkach (702), 10-ball ghost: Win 11-5

These were all done a on 9 foot diamond. I'm pretty sure the pockets are standard.

https://www.facebook.com/RoysBasement/videos/358405401420445/

Just watched Kristina play 10b giving this Justin Kent guy +3 race to 8 10b.

She has a killer 10b break. I think I saw her break dry only once out of 7. Ran a bunch of racks. Kent might've shot 3 times on the first set. Won 8-3.

Her Fargo 702 might be underrated.

What's your estimated fargo rating if you beat 9 ball ghost more often than not?

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