2 shot roll out.

I've got a little food for thought to enter into the discussion!

What about a player that misses a ball straight in, tickies off another ball, snookers you unintentionally, you can't hit it, no way to hit it? Then the guy gets ball in hand from some luck-out, wins the game. Then he makes a ball on the break the next game, has a 1-9 combo. Then the next game, he makes two balls on the break, and the 9-ball is hanging. Yippee, one-foul/ball-in-hand cost you four games from this player's mistake. Yippee, can't wait to play another one. LOL!

So, if you're playing this guy, you lose four games in a row from his mistake. If the two-shot/roll-out rules were in effect, the whole complexion of this match would be quite different. In fact, you could still be on the first game.

JAM
 
ironman said:
The player of the year on e Texas Express Tours final year was Javier Franco of Houston. Hardly a world beater by any means of the imagination.
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Yeah, and who ever heard of those guys that led the Camel tour with express rules? Hose somebody and some guy name of Francisco and Buddy Hall?

unknownpro
 
wincardona said:
Ok we bust hustlers, look on post 56 about your one foul comment in regard to TV. Secondly insulting me doesn't make you right ,but it does tell me a little about you as a person. And whats this about playing safe on a spot shot? where were you playing ?at the YMCA. But your right about me being old,but not too old not to beat you, we bust hustlers. When you see me walk up to me and we can match up,if you ain't too scared of an old man.
Click to expand...

LOL This is freakin hilarious! You know me and don't even know it yet!! LOL You got my cell # in your phone. This really is funny right now. I'll unmask myself at the end for you...but first let me answer you.


!st...the comment was about one foul SPEEDING UP the game for TV, nothing about diminished interest. YOU OWE DINNER

2nd...I never insulted you.....once you remember who I am you'll realize that and if you go back and re-read everything you see I was jabbin ya (I've always been like that) but I still never insulted you.

3rd...I didn't play at the YMCA, I played once in a while at some joint where people bet a little sometimes. (its a hint)

4th...Amatuer and Professional hustlers ARE always welcome at my pool room and there aint nobody can tell me who can't play there (oops another hint) and they can get busted if they dont watch it.

5th...I already put a challenge out there.




So time to jog your memory......you played Tony Chohan at my place in Detroit. I thought I took very good care of you, Teddy asked me to but I've always liked you anyway and I hope you still like me. Yes No Maybe?

So you owe me dinner for the TV thing and you can buy dinner as a gapper for the Chohan game. That's 2 dinners you owe so far, loser pays up at DCC, is that cool? Teddys' included on the meal also.

We can still express our thinking on here with out the other getting mad now can't we?


P.S. I feel there's nothing wrong with friends gambling with each other, how do you feel about that? I know you like bustin hustlers and so do I. LOL
 
unknownpro said:
Yeah, and who ever heard of those guys that led the Camel tour with express rules? Hose somebody and some guy name of Francisco and Buddy Hall?

unknownpro
Click to expand...


Except it was all champions on the Camel Tour.


You can't compare it the Texas Express Tour or the Viking Tour or the Joss Tour etc. etc.
 
What really sucks about pool coverage on TV is:


I could probably have a "3-ball on a bar table" ring game tournament and it would get the biggest ratings of pool ever.







Anyway back to:

1-foul............or 2
 
Just a couple of cents here . . .

I play lot of games in alot of places with alot of different rules. Personally I don't see how a single rules change can shift that balance so extremely in either direction. I think I prefer the 1 foul game (still seems harder to 'always' have to play good position then to always have the option to bail out and then push hoping to get lucky ;) on a pass and a tough shot) but I also think stronger players beat weaker players regardless of the rules.

Looks like this to me :

Old guys pissed 'their' version of the game got trumped by a different version and never got over it. No offence intended , but going into it with that negative mindset is a big nut to be giving away each match. Strange thing tho . . . some claim the change was to even the field for those who didn't have a chance and now thry are the ones with out a chance ? Odd.

Why is it always someone elses good luck and always your bad luck ? Sounds like more negative mindset again. :) Even if that was the case , wouldn't it increase the 'luck' factor of both players and then still wash out ?


Just my thoughts.
 
wash

JAM said:
I've got a little food for thought to enter into the discussion!

What about a player that misses a ball straight in, tickies off another ball, snookers you unintentionally, you can't hit it, no way to hit it? Then the guy gets ball in hand from some luck-out, wins the game. Then he makes a ball on the break the next game, has a 1-9 combo. Then the next game, he makes two balls on the break, and the 9-ball is hanging. Yippee, one-foul/ball-in-hand cost you four games from this player's mistake. Yippee, can't wait to play another one. LOL!

So, if you're playing this guy, you lose four games in a row from his mistake. If the two-shot/roll-out rules were in effect, the whole complexion of this match would be quite different. In fact, you could still be on the first game.

JAM
Click to expand...
Any time you bring up a possible scenario that can happen either way it's called a wash.Meaning it will happen for you as often as it will happen against you, which means it shouldn't even be factored in as a factor. Think about it
 
your view

stevelomako said:
LOL This is freakin hilarious! You know me and don't even know it yet!! LOL You got my cell # in your phone. This really is funny right now. I'll unmask myself at the end for you...but first let me answer you.


!st...the comment was about one foul SPEEDING UP the game for TV, nothing about diminished interest. YOU OWE DINNER

2nd...I never insulted you.....once you remember who I am you'll realize that and if you go back and re-read everything you see I was jabbin ya (I've always been like that) but I still never insulted you.

3rd...I didn't play at the YMCA, I played once in a while at some joint where people bet a little sometimes. (its a hint)

4th...Amatuer and Professional hustlers ARE always welcome at my pool room and there aint nobody can tell me who can't play there (oops another hint) and they can get busted if they dont watch it.

5th...I already put a challenge out there.




So time to jog your memory......you played Tony Chohan at my place in Detroit. I thought I took very good care of you, Teddy asked me to but I've always liked you anyway and I hope you still like me. Yes No Maybe?

So you owe me dinner for the TV thing and you can buy dinner as a gapper for the Chohan game. That's 2 dinners you owe so far, loser pays up at DCC, is that cool? Teddys' included on the meal also.

We can still express our thinking on here with out the other getting mad now can't we?


P.S. I feel there's nothing wrong with friends gambling with each other, how do you feel about that? I know you like bustin hustlers and so do I. LOL
Click to expand...
I don't owe you nuttin,but i'll have dinner with you providing you apologize,especially since your WRONG.
 
I played pushout most of my pool days (60's, 70's ).
There was more skill and less luck in the game.
You had to be able to make spot shots, break out clusters, and make banks (some things most young players dont do well today.
1 foul was invented in either 1969,70, or 71 ( to old to remember...lol) by Bill "wennie bennie" Staton and the brothers who ran johnson city.
The rules were all balls spotted, ball in hand on a foul except on the break or on the nine ball ( in which case it was ball in hand behind the head string ). The rules were called tournement rules and were only used in tourneys. All gambling was done playing 2 foul pushout.
The reason the rules were invented was to Speed-Up Play! Bennie wanted to run 3 tourney sessions a day but pushout race to 11 took too long...sooo he changed the rules for speed. No one in my day liked them and no one gambled using them. how they got to be the law of the pool land in beyond me.
If you want to see the difference in 9 ball, just watch the top players playing in a 4-5-6 handed ring game. That is the closest thing to pushot now.....and you will see some of the greatest shots made showing what theses players are capable of when they cant duck. Its something to see.
But.... I doubt that pushout will ever make a comeback, so ill stick to bank pool and 1 hole (duck all you want in 1 hole...lol ).
Good luck all
 
stevelomako said:
BINGO!

There we go, kinda looks good for my arguement doesn't it Lewis?
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IMO, rules have been changed and in any sport here wil be may differnt opinions. They will notbe accepte well by everyone. That is just human nature.

I dont really lke 1 foul, but I use it on our tour and I guess it's because everybody is doing it. Though time is an issue for us at times, which is going to happen, there are few surprises in the end. A an example Charlie Bryan has won our last two with Chen and Jeemy Jones getting 2nd.All three players were PICKS in the calcutta, so the argument leans in Bill's way

On the other hand, I noice more and more young and yes even weaker players getting in e money whic for the Tour and players is a god thing.

So, if I were the ref here, I would blow t whistle and say you both bng up valid points and say ,"have a ce dinner, invite Bumperman, and let him pick up the tab LOL!
 
wincardona said:
I don't owe you nuttin,but i'll have dinner with you providing you apologize,especially since your WRONG.
Click to expand...

Billy,

I'm posting this again just to make sure its clear.

If you think I was insulting you, I'm sorry. I wasn't.


We're going to have different opinions on some things and the same on others. I like 2 foul, you like 1 foul. We both agree Efren is the greatest player of all time though.

I guess it just kills me the way 9-ball has had so many different rules and changes over the past 20 years or so.

Its been 1 foul for quite awhile but then everyone is always trying to change something.......sometimes its 3 fouls loss of game sometimes its not, break from the box or break from anywhere, so many balls have to cross the center of the table even if you make a ball, rack the balls with the 9 on the spot then go back to the 1 on the spot, use the sardo rack then get rid of it, try a different rack, make the pockets tighter, the shelf deeper, it just never ends....and this is at MAJOR tournaments.

What are people really trying to accomplish? Are they trying to make it equal for all the players?

I think if thats the case it would be OK for your weekly and monthly pool room and bar tournaments but for not for the big tournaments.


Whats wrong with the BEST players being the BEST players? People try to change things in 9-ball because players like Sigel, Buddy, Earl, Nick V, Corey, Archer, Cardone (yes YOU are included), McCready, Crane (Wade) the list goes on, dominate the game for awhile and do things better than others. Its like the really good players get punished for being champions.

Instead of people trying to raise their game to that level they have to come up with stuff to bring the best players games DOWN to make it more fair for everyone else.

When I started the rules for 9 ball were the same for a long time before me and after (the only thing I remember that would be different is you'd have to ask if they played 2 fouls in a row or 2 by the same player) then when it started changing it just hasn't stopped and its the only game that keeps changing rules at the drop of a hat.



Again, if you think I was picking on you, I'm sorry.
Steve
 
My feeling about this is, if you've never played pushout 9 ball, you should try it for a while. I've taught people to play who didn't know anything about it, and at the least they agreed it was a different kind of game, if not better, than one foul. My personal opinion, right or wrong, is that pushout is more strategic, while one foul is more tactical.
 
JAM said:
LOL! The wonderful world according to Keith, especially when he starts talking about the longshoremen, salamanders, and lobsters! :D

Oh, yeah, here's my favorite. When Keith's benched and gettnig drilled by a player who catches a gear, he always comes up with this line: "Ain't this a nice deal. Feed the monkey and watch him...." Well, you know the rest! :o

JAM
Click to expand...

Here is a few I might add:

Get the troops out the hot sun
Dress up girls, were goin out
How bout a lil numba now, Frankie(Which I did throw:rolleyes: )
Frankie, give me a 4 and a porthole(Which I did throw;) )
Frankie, how bout a 4 and a pimple(Which I did throw:cool: )
And the all time best "Man over board" routine....

He is the best...........Love ya brother........................
 
Today, Just to keep from giving up ball-in-hand, a player has to shoot at the nose of a rail or leap frog over a ball. As this became popular, the long steady decline of action Nine-Ball began. Tournaments can do whatever they have to do. This is not a game worth betting your money on.
 
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