Yes, I've been trying to replicate those shots and capture them in SloMo, but I haven't been able to make them that way. Yet!
>90 degree rail spin shots (SloMo)
- Thread starter SloMoHolic
- Start date
Yes, I've been trying to replicate those shots and capture them in SloMo, but I haven't been able to make them that way. Yet!
P.S. The pretty young lady in the video, at about 2:00, might destroy you with her gaze. She completely devastated me with her eyes, that's for sure. Whew!
-Blake
Nice closeups. Here is the shot from a slightly tougher position: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te-iCc-2NxQ As a proposition shot, do not give out more than 10 tries for this one.
There are two other versions of the shot as a proposition. In one, the cue ball starts up on the name plate (or rail, if there is no name plate there).
The second is like in the video linked above but with the object ball a diamond tougher along the cushion. The story -- at least as reputable as most pool stories -- is that a road player would bet on it but only large amounts and would ask for half an hour to make it or some such. And he would bet on nothing else.
As for ball-first, we know it's possible to do 93-degree cuts with extreme outside. It's also possible to swerve the cue ball and come in, but if you hit ball-first with inside english, it is unlikely the ball will go into the pocket unless you also hit it a second time after going into the cushion.
I suppose I should look at the rest of the conversation in onepocket.org, but it looks like someone is very confused.
As for knowing about the shot, I think the cat was out of the bag a long time ago. This is from a book that was printed in 1978 and has sold more than 300,000 copies:
And here it is in a book that was printed in 1908 but did not have as wide a circulation:
There are two other versions of the shot as a proposition. In one, the cue ball starts up on the name plate (or rail, if there is no name plate there).
The second is like in the video linked above but with the object ball a diamond tougher along the cushion. The story -- at least as reputable as most pool stories -- is that a road player would bet on it but only large amounts and would ask for half an hour to make it or some such. And he would bet on nothing else.
As for ball-first, we know it's possible to do 93-degree cuts with extreme outside. It's also possible to swerve the cue ball and come in, but if you hit ball-first with inside english, it is unlikely the ball will go into the pocket unless you also hit it a second time after going into the cushion.
I suppose I should look at the rest of the conversation in onepocket.org, but it looks like someone is very confused.
As for knowing about the shot, I think the cat was out of the bag a long time ago. This is from a book that was printed in 1978 and has sold more than 300,000 copies:
And here it is in a book that was printed in 1908 but did not have as wide a circulation:
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Last night I lost a 9-ball match to a very good player in SF. In one game, I left him what I thought was a strong safe: 9-ball frozen to the center of the foot rail, and cue ball about 1/2 ball off the center of the head rail. He jacked up a bit and nailed it in the foot corner with a shot just like this, and sent the cue ball back and forth almost four long lengths of the table. Made me feel like an idiot for playing safe on my previous shot, passing up an easy cross-corner bank.
I don't believe it is possible, and here is why. First, you can't even see the correct contact point, so you can not possibly hit it. That means, the only way it could be possible is with extreme spin induced throw. That's where the problem comes into play. How do you propose that you can get spin induced throw to fully take effect
BEFORE you get ANY forward motion of the ob, and before and collision induced throw takes effect?? I say that, because if the ob moves forward at all, it will now compress the rail and cause the ob to rebound off the rail, causing the ob to miss.
I watched the other video, thanks to a link I was sent. In that video, he obviously is hitting rail first and doesn't even realize it. The cb doesn't lie. The cb proves he is hitting rail first.
The cue ball always speaks the truth....
Many years ago (like around 30 years), when I was on the road playing, the owner of the room offered us a proposition shot. Nothing if we miss it, but $20k if we could make it on the first try. He set up the ob frozen to the center of the foot rail. The cb one ball width off the right side rail on the head string. Cut the ob into the RIGHT corner pocket.
Then he told us the story of it...he was playing a road player about 10 years before we came in. He left that shot for his opponent. His opponent laughed, and said he would cut it in the right corner pocket, not the left, like would make sense, but the right! He did it. The owner quit him right there for showing off, and he was stuck $20k at that point. He said he was willing to lose $40k, and has offered that bet to every road player that came through with the $20k that his original opponent didn't get. No one had won it yet at that point.
I imagine the cue that the guy used had a ton of deflection so he could actually get at least a partial masse' just using a normal stroke.
Then he told us the story of it...he was playing a road player about 10 years before we came in. He left that shot for his opponent. His opponent laughed, and said he would cut it in the right corner pocket, not the left, like would make sense, but the right! He did it. The owner quit him right there for showing off, and he was stuck $20k at that point. He said he was willing to lose $40k, and has offered that bet to every road player that came through with the $20k that his original opponent didn't get. No one had won it yet at that point.
I imagine the cue that the guy used had a ton of deflection so he could actually get at least a partial masse' just using a normal stroke.
I am a very polite person.
The only way that I believe a ball-first cut like that can go is to thin-bank it off the rail (much like I did in some of the shots in this video). Strictly speaking, I don't believe there is any way you can back-cut a ball (>90) with inside.
I'm with you on this one, Neil.
And Bob J. Yes, there may be a guy or two over there that might be confused about some physics. Head on over there. Good luck.
All that said, I was intrigued by the elevated draw-inside idea. Sure, it will swerve a bit, which would help. But could that kind of spin, with a dirty ball, actually throw the OB back a bit?
Probably not enough, but I was just curious.
Thanks, guys.
-Blake
I'm just a beginner but for some reason I shoot this shot whenever I need to (and usually make it) vs. banking the ball. It just seems easier to me. The problem I experience with it, however, is judging when I'm going to scratch the CB in the opposite pocket.
Many thanks for the SloMo s. Keep up the good work; we all benefit from it!
Many thanks for the SloMo s. Keep up the good work; we all benefit from it!
Thanks!
The pockets are just a hair under 4.5".
This should give you a better view of how big/small they are. These are some slow motion 1P extractions, inspired by none other than our old friend, Barenada!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYlo5JNRHgE
Speed makes a HUGE change in cb return .:wink:
Oh sure, sure! You can make that 3 ball repeatedly in that left pocket using your shot - but can you do it with the 8 or 9? 
I think a more challenging shot is to set up that same shot then cut it to the right corner. On a 10 or 12 foot snooker table.
I think a more challenging shot is to set up that same shot then cut it to the right corner. On a 10 or 12 foot snooker table.
Thanks slomo. I have been making those shots for many years and never understood how they worked. If you had told me I was hitting the rail first, I would not have believed you. Back in the old days, we used to shoot it with the object ball on the center diamond. Seems like everybody had that shot down. Once I saw the Miz make it one handed with the cue ball sitting on top of a piece of chalk sitting on top of the head rail. It is actually easier to make from up there. I never made it one handed though.
it can't
It can't be made hitting ball first because that isn't a ninety degree cut. Its like 110...
A ninety degree CUT is when the edge of the cab is directly parallel to the cp on the ob.
Jaden
It can't be made hitting ball first because that isn't a ninety degree cut. Its like 110...
A ninety degree CUT is when the edge of the cab is directly parallel to the cp on the ob.
Jaden
Bob mentioned the 93 degree cut which requires like a 1 in a million perfect hit plus tons of cling between balls caked in dirt and chalk. One thing that helps cuts like these is they don't have to travel parallel to the rail. You can be a degree or three off and the ball will bobble in off the rail and pocket facings. So I think maybe you could go as high as... I dunno 96? 98 degrees?
But man the inside is a lot easier.
Thanks SloMoHolic, great videos and great shooting.
Thanks for taking the time to video these shots. Rail first cue ball cuts into the Object ball have been an interest to me for a long time. Your videos have proven to me and I am sure others that the cue ball is indeed contacting the rail first and cleanly hits the OB in the direction of the pocket.
Thanks again.
Thanks for taking the time to video these shots. Rail first cue ball cuts into the Object ball have been an interest to me for a long time. Your videos have proven to me and I am sure others that the cue ball is indeed contacting the rail first and cleanly hits the OB in the direction of the pocket.
Thanks again.