A Little Defense Playing The Ghost

Johnnyt

Johnnyt

Burn all jump cues
Silver Member
For a few years now I will get tired of playing the ghost with offense only. Instead of races under 10 I play the ghost races to 21 with a little defense. When I snooker myself or leave myself a tough shot. I play the best safe I can, then I shoot for the ghost and give an honest try to hit the ball. If the ghost hits it I can try from the ghosts leave for a chance to runout to get a half a game. If ghost misses it, I get BIH to try and runout for a half a game. If I can't RO the Ghost get's one and a half games. Johnnyt
 
Then you are not playing the ghost and are doing something other than the point of the exercise.

IMO, the point of playing the ghost is to assess your playing ability and practice pattern play. If you are giving yourself "half games" then you are cheating yourself.
 
Why do I bother trying to post anything on here...and I won't. Frig off both of you.
 
It may not be "playing the ghost", but I try to incorporate safeties to improve my defense, which is terrible. I count it as a loss if I leave a makeable shot. If it can be kicked, I play it as it lies after the kick.
 
no worries

Yes technically its not playing the ghost. However you are playing pool which matters the most.

Also if you are going to go far in a tourney or win a big gambling session then more often then not you are going to have to play safeties. And if you don't practice safeties than you probably aren't going to execute them.

Don't let the trolling haters get you down. You are playing pool and that's all that matters.
 
Johnnyt said:
For a few years now I will get tired of playing the ghost with offense only. Instead of races under 10 I play the ghost races to 21 with a little defense. When I snooker myself or leave myself a tough shot. I play the best safe I can, then I shoot for the ghost and give an honest try to hit the ball. If the ghost hits it I can try from the ghosts leave for a chance to runout to get a half a game. If ghost misses it, I get BIH to try and runout for a half a game. If I can't RO the Ghost get's one and a half games. Johnnyt
Click to expand...

I think this works well. Yeah, some folks will say this is NOT playing the ghost... great, then just name your version the Phantom, and giddy up. I like it your way better, because good safety play is valuable, and I don't lose if I play good safeties ;)
 
ChicagoRJ said:
Except Johnny did NOT miss. He played safe, quite a big difference.
Click to expand...

Not really... a position error requiring a safety is still an error... Thats the funny thing about even some good players... They only think about the misses where they missed a shot or maybe scratched on the break...

Errors add up and if you keep making position errors you are going to end up losing some games simply because there is no way you are going to be able to play lock up safes if you were having trouble just staying in line for a run out...

IF you want to practice safety play then by all means have at it as it is a required skill but by mixing it with what should be an exercise in trying to run out from ball in hand then no bueno...

I will say that I wouldn't find any problem at all if you called a preplanned safety right after you broke and executed it instead of the run out and took it as a push on the score... No win for you no win for the ghost... This way you still have to control whitey to be able to get a draw in a rack that may not be runnable..
 
The Renfro said:
IF you want to practice safety play then by all means have at it as it is a required skill but by mixing it with what should be an exercise in trying to run out from ball in hand then no bueno...
Click to expand...

You would think the Ghost was a real person who get's butt hurt if he doesn't get his due respect from some of the posts here.



JC
 
Johnnyt said:
For a few years now I will get tired of playing the ghost with offense only. Instead of races under 10 I play the ghost races to 21 with a little defense. When I snooker myself or leave myself a tough shot. I play the best safe I can, then I shoot for the ghost and give an honest try to hit the ball. If the ghost hits it I can try from the ghosts leave for a chance to runout to get a half a game. If ghost misses it, I get BIH to try and runout for a half a game. If I can't RO the Ghost get's one and a half games. Johnnyt
Click to expand...

Very interesting! I find myself when playing the ghost in a similar situation all the time, but what I hate the most is when I can play a shot into a pocket on a normal sized pocket table but not on mine!

I have to think about your way for a while! I like the fact that your incorperating the defense side of it:)

At least there is a couple posters on az with some worthwhile information:)
Thanks

Eli
 
Johnnyt said:
For a few years now I will get tired of playing the ghost with offense only. Instead of races under 10 I play the ghost races to 21 with a little defense. When I snooker myself or leave myself a tough shot. I play the best safe I can, then I shoot for the ghost and give an honest try to hit the ball. If the ghost hits it I can try from the ghosts leave for a chance to runout to get a half a game. If ghost misses it, I get BIH to try and runout for a half a game. If I can't RO the Ghost get's one and a half games. Johnnyt
Click to expand...

Well, you are not playing the ghost, but you are getting some good training in, which is what really matters.

I think much of the appeal of playing the ghost is that it is so unforgiving. You have to run out. Every once in a while you will get what I would call an "unrunnable rack". Whenever that happens to me I mark down all the positions of the balls and I try my best to run it, over and over. I allready know how to run the balls when they are in the open (even though I can't always do it of course), but what do you do in situations like these?

I tell you this is one of the best learning tools there is, and it is great once you actually do manage to run the balls, IF you manage to run them. If not there is always something to learn from it. When to play safe, off which ball and how etc. Just an unrelated, rambling answer to your op, hope you don't mind.
 
The Renfro said:
Not really... a position error requiring a safety is still an error... Thats the funny thing about even some good players... They only think about the misses where they missed a shot or maybe scratched on the break...

Errors add up and if you keep making position errors you are going to end up losing some games simply because there is no way you are going to be able to play lock up safes if you were having trouble just staying in line for a run out...

IF you want to practice safety play then by all means have at it as it is a required skill but by mixing it with what should be an exercise in trying to run out from ball in hand then no bueno...

I will say that I wouldn't find any problem at all if you called a preplanned safety right after you broke and executed it instead of the run out and took it as a push on the score... No win for you no win for the ghost... This way you still have to control whitey to be able to get a draw in a rack that may not be runnable..
Click to expand...

C'mon, you can see the difference. Do you want a position error or do you want to be sitting in your seat because you missed the hole ? And for most amatuers, there are gonna be a lot more position errors than run outs, so Johnny's idea is not all bad... of course, nobody has to play it, just an idea being presented.
 
I like playing the ghost but I usually only have time to bang a few so I just throw balls out on the table a lot. Very often I'll play a safe if I leave myself with no other option. My safeties have improved even if my run outs haven't, and that's picked me up another win or two in league, etc.

Anything can grow tiresome after a while so it may help to change up the routine from time to time. You can make a game out of any drill, and you'll see improvement by just trying to beat your best score.
 
Johnnyt said:
For a few years now I will get tired of playing the ghost with offense only. Instead of races under 10 I play the ghost races to 21 with a little defense. When I snooker myself or leave myself a tough shot. I play the best safe I can, then I shoot for the ghost and give an honest try to hit the ball. If the ghost hits it I can try from the ghosts leave for a chance to runout to get a half a game. If ghost misses it, I get BIH to try and runout for a half a game. If I can't RO the Ghost get's one and a half games. Johnnyt
Click to expand...

Tor Lowry has a safety ghost game in a video here:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLSdlfdk6zG-rru2CB4H0Qty8u078N-bLl&v=nM7ADKPBMT4

I like what Johnny t has done in combining the conventional ghost game and the safety ghost game. At my level I'm not beating any ghosts, but I have to discipline myself to recognize if I'm a bit out of position and the shot is makeable but the leave is questionable, I should play safe. Doing what Johnny t does is good preparation for tournament play where safety play is key, if you aren't at the level of automatic run out on open tables.

I keep a stat when playing the ghost, if I miss once I give myself another ball in hand and if I run out I mark out as a spare. So if i have 6 wins 11 losses 5 spares, I at least know I'm making some progress.
 
I do like the idea of a push playing the ghost when a table layout calls for a high % safe vs a low % breakout. Getting in the habit of always being only offensive means you are going to lose games a well rounded player won't.
 
ChicagoRJ said:
C'mon, you can see the difference. Do you want a position error or do you want to be sitting in your seat because you missed the hole ? And for most amatuers, there are gonna be a lot more position errors than run outs, so Johnny's idea is not all bad... of course, nobody has to play it, just an idea being presented.
Click to expand...

Actually I can see in the big picture both errors get you beat... After doing TPAs for Accu-Stats for the last few years I now understand that you either get out when you are supposed to or you go to the B side in most instances...

The TPA rates a hard miss the same as a position error... It rates a scratch on the break, a missed kick BIH, or a safety where you leave the guy an easy shot the same as a position error....

I know what beating the ghost on a 9ft Diamond 11-2 looks like.. I have no idea what beating the ghost in any race may look at when you are allowed to play yourself safe and then play the ghost's side of the kick... I guess for practice purposes it doesn't matter what anyone thinks and in reality it may be better practice for some players than the traditional way... I just don't think this way would be condusive to comparing results from different players even when playing on the same table....


Chris
 
Cardigan Kid said:
I keep a stat when playing the ghost, if I miss once I give myself another ball in hand and if I run out I mark out as a spare. So if i have 6 wins 11 losses 5 spares, I at least know I'm making some progress.
Click to expand...

I like this ALOT - I shall adopt this method of ghost score keeping. (for the 6 ball ghost - yep - I live in bangerville :embarrassed2:)

Cheers.
 
The Renfro said:
Actually I can see in the big picture both errors get you beat... After doing TPAs for Accu-Stats for the last few years I now understand that you either get out when you are supposed to or you go to the B side in most instances...

The TPA rates a hard miss the same as a position error... It rates a scratch on the break, a missed kick BIH, or a safety where you leave the guy an easy shot the same as a position error....

I know what beating the ghost on a 9ft Diamond 11-2 looks like.. I have no idea what beating the ghost in any race may look at when you are allowed to play yourself safe and then play the ghost's side of the kick... I guess for practice purposes it doesn't matter what anyone thinks and in reality it may be better practice for some players than the traditional way... I just don't think this way would be condusive to comparing results from different players even when playing on the same table....


Chris
Click to expand...

I don't believe Johnny mentioned anything about "comparing" results with anyone else. Just another practice thing for amateurs, which is 99.9% of pool. They get in trouble because they are NOT pros, and should be able to deal with the consequences of their failed run outs by being able to play a good safety if needed.

So, the ghost can be the pro version, and the Phantom is for the amateurs, and folks can pick their poison.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top