Another Poor Soul Will Be Screwed on Ebay

[Mike in MN]

I can't wait to get my response.. I "inquired" about his price too! Will let you all know what I get in response..

I also inquired a few hours ago. I mentioned to him that Bill Stroud may have already been gone by the time this particular cue was made, seeing as how he left in 1972. Also, I mentioned that I thought it was a little overpriced. I was very polite, and in turn, I got a very polite response. Here is what he said:

"It might be from just after he left. I was offered 2500 for it almost 20 years ago by a cue dealer. I have had many offers through the years far in excess of that, but never wanted to sell it. I know 1 similar sold for in the 12,000 range in Valley Forge this year. Don't know if it will sell, but you never know. Thanks, Art"

Who knows how many of us sent him a message. He's probably ready to pull his hair out by now

 

[TheMarsMan]

Thank you for making my point for me. As I said in my post now is the time to invest in houses. When you can steal them.

If your love and interest is in high end cues, good for you, but it is ridiculous to consider them for investment when so many better investment options exist outside the pool world.

These purchases are for pleasure, enjoyment and hobby.

Now, listen, I can go out and buy a few pieces of equipment and go in my garage and build a car that would take me a half dozen years to reinvent the wheel that already exists.

Can't see it will drive any better or worse, it will still get to to the market for cereal though. Oh, yeah, my time in the making of this car will cost you 5 million dollars.

Or, you can go out and buy one of those production junk box Lexus cars.

If you need my one of a kind car, then you aren't getting ripped off. That's my point. Money has little to do with it because it ain't worth more than 40K period.

Your logic doesn't make any sense, not every object is just a value of its parts. For example I have had some pieces of cardboard with ink on them that I have sold for a lot more that what I bought them for. They are called baseball cards and had names on them like Mantle, Mays and Ruth. You can buy new ones for pennies, does that mean that they aren't worth hundreds of thousands of dollars?

Collectibles values are based on supply and demand, if something is in great demand and has a limited supply the price goes up. I have been offered over double what I have paid for some cues, is 100% profit margin not a good return? If you make educated purchases with cues you can certainly have a great return.

A good motto in life is when you don't know something about a subject it is better to keep quiet, that way people won't know how uninformed you truly are.

BTW I would value this cue at 2K with the case.

 

[realkingcobra]

There's nothing wrong with any asking price of something being offered for sale, that's up to the seller to put a value on what "HE" thinks his item for sale is worth....then it's up to the buyer to decide on whether or not the item for sale is worth the asking price...and decide from there. That's the American way. Now, for all those who would complain about the asking price, are just mad that it's not in the price range that "YOU" would like to see it sold at....so that "YOU" could make an offer yourself. YET, when it comes to "YOU" offering something for sale..."YOU" to want top dollar, as you feel your item for sale is worth.

I'm not trying to bash anyone here, but the sale item is what it is, it's either over priced, underprice, or priced just right....but that'll be determined when...and if it's sold...right?

You ought to see the Brunswick GC3 I just delivered to a guy in Idaho, who by the way bought it for $1,000....I wouldn't have paid a dime over $200 for it....but once again...that's sales people

Glen

 

[realkingcobra]

There is one thing about the description that makes no sense to me. How can an untouched cue be used for 30+years? And also have bumps and bruises? I was always under the impression untouched is another way of saying new.

If you read the description again, you'll see that it's said to be "used":grin: and in that same description, "untouched" is meaning...it hasn't been restored...as in it's in its "original" manufactured condition...."untouched" by anyone to refinish, restore, or repair the cue

Glen

 

[TheCueHunter]

Here's the response I got when I "inquired" about his price... LOL

"I bet you live in a trailer and are on welfare! I don't come to you and call you names. If you don't like my cue, or my price, just go on the the next item and keep your comments to yourself. I have already refused several offers for my cue including a 9000.00 offer. Get over yourself LOSER!!!"

nice.....

I didn't know Roy Mallot was brokering this guys sale:grin-square:

 

[3andstop]

HERE'S YOUR NEWS FLASH!!! A cue is worth EXACTLY the amount someone is willing to pay. Whatever their reasons.

Best to re-read my original post. That's just what I said. Its not a rip off if someone wants one of whatever it is they want and others are not available for less.

It is a rip off if you are looking at it in terms of raw worth of material and construction.

If someone wants to reinvent the wheel and carve a cue stick out of a tree using a sharpened rock, the labor will be intensive, but the glue will be the same, and if you don't have some desire for the "one of a kind artistic value of the item" then it's a rip off at any price over 200 bucks.

edit**The ridiculous thing is to believe it has some magical hit just because some guy with a 7 syllable name scribes it in the butt, and is therefore worth thousands as opposed to hundreds. Its more likely the hit is a result of the quality wood, diameter, the taper, and the type of tip that is on the shaft.

So yes, the value is in it's unique artwork and that price can't be associated with the value of the material used to make it. So in that respect, since you can't buy a duplicate, it depends on how bad they want it.

 

[ghost ball]

Best to re-read my original post. That's just what I said. Its not a rip off if someone wants one of whatever it is they want and others are not available for less.

It is a rip off if you are looking at it in terms of raw worth of material and construction.

If someone wants to reinvent the wheel and carve a cue stick out of a tree using a razor knife the labor will be intensive, but the glue will be the same, and if you don't have some desire for the "one of a kind artistic value of the item" then it's a rip off at any price over 200 bucks.

You are exactly right! A Ferrari is worth far less than a 1978 Ford full size truck. A Ferrari only weighs what about 2500 lbs (?) whereas the truck would tip the scales at 4000 lbs.

 

[Mike in MN]

Best to re-read my original post. That's just what I said. Its not a rip off if someone wants one of whatever it is they want and others are not available for less.

It is a rip off if you are looking at it in terms of raw worth of material and construction.

If someone wants to reinvent the wheel and carve a cue stick out of a tree using a sharpened rock, the labor will be intensive, but the glue will be the same, and if you don't have some desire for the "one of a kind artistic value of the item" then it's a rip off at any price over 200 bucks.

edit**The ridiculous thing is to believe it has some magical hit just because some guy with a 7 syllable name scribes it in the butt, and is therefore worth thousands as opposed to hundreds. Its more likely the hit is a result of the quality wood, diameter, the taper, and the type of tip that is on the shaft.

So yes, the value is in it's unique artwork and that price can't be associated with the value of the material used to make it. So in that respect, since you can't buy a duplicate, it depends on how bad they want it.

And the end result of all those things you mentioned - quality of the wood, diameter, taper, tip - not to mention a million other things that go into making cues ... All of those affect the way it hits, and all of those are directly chosen by the cuemaker. So it stands to reason that the cuemaker is directly responsible for the way a cue plays, as he/she is the one making all of those decisions.

By your logic, I could give any woodworker the exact same materials Dennis Searing has, and he'd be able to make a cue as high in quality as Dennis. Sorry sir, but that is preposterous.

 

[3andstop]

You are exactly right! A Ferrari is worth far less than a 1978 Ford full size truck. A Ferrari only weighs what about 2500 lbs (?) whereas the truck would tip the scales at 4000 lbs.

Even though I made the analogy originally,it is a poor one, since vehicles have just a tad more moving parts than a damned cue stick and plenty more room for precision.

Never the less, unless you have some specific need for a Ferrari, they will both get you to the corner store, and for all that extra money you can't even put your new 50" TV set in the back of the Ferrari to bring it home. What the hell good is it? We're all driving on the same road, with the same restrictions.

 

[TheMarsMan]

And the end result of all those things you mentioned - quality of the wood, diameter, taper, tip - not to mention a million other things that go into making cues ... All of those affect the way it hits, and all of those are directly chosen by the cuemaker. So it stands to reason that the cuemaker is directly responsible for the way a cue plays, as he/she is the one making all of those decisions.

By your logic, I could give any woodworker the exact same materials Dennis Searing as, and he'd be able to make a cue as high in quality as Dennis. Sorry sir, but that is preposterous.

Good point! They have been researching Stradivarius musical instruments for years and no one has produced anything that can match its characteristics. I supposed people who pay millions of dollars for one of these have also made a bad investment!

 

[ghost ball]

Even though I made the analogy originally,it is a poor one, since vehicles have just a tad more moving parts than a damned cue stick and plenty more room for precision.

Never the less, unless you have some specific need for a Ferrari, they will both get you to the corner store, and for all that extra money you can't even put your new 50" TV set in the back of the Ferrari to bring it home. What the hell good is it? We're all driving on the same road, with the same restrictions.

I am not sure why I got myself involved in such a silly argument other than I'm a little bored on my lunch break....

What the hell good is it you ask? Try picking up a hot 21 year old blond in a 1978 truck or a 2010 Ferrari... enough said.

Oh and BTW, thanks for being a good sport.

 

[realkingcobra]

Even though I made the analogy originally,it is a poor one, since vehicles have just a tad more moving parts than a damned cue stick and plenty more room for precision.

Never the less, unless you have some specific need for a Ferrari, they will both get you to the corner store, and for all that extra money you can't even put your new 50" TV set in the back of the Ferrari to bring it home. What the hell good is it? We're all driving on the same road, with the same restrictions.

I believe communism was based on the same principals....no one will have more worth than their neighbor....so the government will take everything of value and keep it, what's left over....the people can share...equally

 

[greyghost]

how obtuse of you.....

Thank you for making my point for me. As I said in my post now is the time to invest in houses. When you can steal them.

If your love and interest is in high end cues, good for you, but it is ridiculous to consider them for investment when so many better investment options exist outside the pool world.

These purchases are for pleasure, enjoyment and hobby.

Now, listen, I can go out and buy a few pieces of equipment and go in my garage and build a car that would take me a half dozen years to reinvent the wheel that already exists.

Can't see it will drive any better or worse, it will still get to to the market for cereal though. Oh, yeah, my time in the making of this car will cost you 5 million dollars.

Or, you can go out and buy one of those production junk box Lexus cars.

If you need my one of a kind car, then you aren't getting ripped off. That's my point. Money has little to do with it because it ain't worth more than 40K period.

just because you have no interest in it does not support your logic....people like nice things, they like to collect them...people also like to build things...nice things for themselves and for others...its called having a TRADE.

For all of time people have made things that commanded higher dollar than the BS...paintings, cars, pool cues, sculptures

if you want to be a tight a** then go be one, but don't come trying to make everyone out to be theives and fools just b/c you dont see the point.

Good Investments are not always classified as to how much you can really invest in them. A dollar is a dollar, and if JOE BLOW sees a nice custom for $1500 from a solid maker he doesn't mind whipping the cash!

You know why? B/c in 15yrs he can sell that same cue for at least what he purchased it for, or maybe even make a profit.

Or you could go spend 250 on a meucci and it wont last that long and you wont be able to give it away to anyone in their right mind.

Its more cost effective in the long run to own something of value.

If its about the money homie then just go make more!

-Grey Ghost-

 

[Mike in MN]

*Stands up and begins a slow clap*

just because you have no interest in it does not support your logic....people like nice things, they like to collect them...people also like to build things...nice things for themselves and for others...its called having a TRADE.

For all of time people have made things that commanded higher dollar than the BS...paintings, cars, pool cues, sculptures

if you want to be a tight a** then go be one, but don't come trying to make everyone out to be theives and fools just b/c you dont see the point.

Good Investments are not always classified as to how much you can really invest in them. A dollar is a dollar, and if JOE BLOW sees a nice custom for $1500 from a solid maker he doesn't mind whipping the cash!

You know why? B/c in 15yrs he can sell that same cue for at least what he purchased it for, or maybe even make a profit.

Or you could go spend 250 on a meucci and it wont last that long and you wont be able to give it away to anyone in their right mind.

Its more cost effective in the long run to own something of value.

If its about the money homie then just go make more!

-Grey Ghost-

 

[Jaden]

This is kind of like saying....

Best to re-read my original post. That's just what I said. Its not a rip off if someone wants one of whatever it is they want and others are not available for less.

It is a rip off if you are looking at it in terms of raw worth of material and construction.

If someone wants to reinvent the wheel and carve a cue stick out of a tree using a sharpened rock, the labor will be intensive, but the glue will be the same, and if you don't have some desire for the "one of a kind artistic value of the item" then it's a rip off at any price over 200 bucks.

edit**The ridiculous thing is to believe it has some magical hit just because some guy with a 7 syllable name scribes it in the butt, and is therefore worth thousands as opposed to hundreds. Its more likely the hit is a result of the quality wood, diameter, the taper, and the type of tip that is on the shaft.

So yes, the value is in it's unique artwork and that price can't be associated with the value of the material used to make it. So in that respect, since you can't buy a duplicate, it depends on how bad they want it.

People have tried for years to duplicate the sound and feel of a strdivarius violin or a 1959 gibson gb-1 acoustic guitar. Some will come close, but they have yet reproduce the same quality and feel and stradivarius' are several hundred years old. The same goes for the feel and play of the greatest pool cues, the bushkas, and szamboti's are the stradivarius' of pool cues, that's why no one (with any sense) questions why someone is willing to pay so much for one.

Are strads worth the 4+ million that is paid for them? who knows, to the person that buys one, they are. Some day in a few hundred years, bushkas may go for a couple of million each, if the game is still played.

Jaden

 

[3andstop]

I'm not sure how I got going on this either. You guys are totally missing the point of what I'm saying.

The OP said "Another poor soul will be screwed on EBay."

I am saying NO, you can't think of a custom cue in terms of price or wood material when you talk DOLLARS!

They are collectibles, hobby items, valuable works of art, (to some folks that is) that hold the value of whatever someone is willing to pay for it. So, there really is no getting screwed.

I did go on to say, If you are going to view it simply as a piece of wood pool cue, to play pool with, and try to assign a value in that respect, then the argument I make is that you will have passed the point of getting screwed far below the 4K the OP mentioned that he thought it was worth. You are going to be getting screwed if you pay anything more than a couple of hundred dollars, since that's all a decent pool cue is worth, and that's all you have to pay to get one just about anywhere.

 

[subdude1974]

Hadnt check this in a few days, but yes if someone buys this cue as an investment at the price the seller is wanting he is getting screwed. When you pay someone more than what it is worth you are screwed. Sure the cue can be an investment. Bad thing is he will have to hand it down for 3 generations before it MIGHT be worth what he paid for it 200 years prior. But this isnt a thread about if a $200 cue can play good. This is a thread about a cue that would be an investment for someone. And the price is 10 times what it is worth. Hence, the screwing.

 

[elvicash]

My point here is this: When you come onto a billiards forum literally overflowing with people who collect cues and say, "News flash!!! Anybody that spends more that 500 bucks on a piece of wood is getting screwed IMO and that's a liberal amount." Well, in my opinion, that's just pissing in a lot of people's Cheerios.

I agree with this point don't hate on the people who will spend some money on cue. We all know plenty can play lights out with anything but some people like the good stuff whether they can play or not. Lets not try to kill the collector market the recession is already bad enough.

 

[macguy]

This is actually a nice cue but nowhere near the sellers asking price. There are actually 2 Szams on Ebay for the same price as this one cue. Pretty much. Some stupid person with a lot of money will buy it for 10,000 thinking he got a great deal when he is actually just straight up raping himself.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Rare-1970s-Joss...554?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf16424ba

I can't be a 1000% sure but I think I sold that cue on ebay maybe 5 years ago for $2200.00 It was made for me and I hated the green veneers but that was the way it came. I got it around 1971. I could be wrong but I don't think so.

 

[Georgia Boy]

I have no idea what I am doing in this thread, just I'm on lunch and it's something to do. I would agree with the statement that something is worth what someone will pay for it, thats obvious. Will that person be screwed for paying $22,500, they would say no, most everyone else would say yes. There is no way in the world you could get me to part with $22,500 for any cue, don't care what it is, who's it was, what it's made of or how much money I had at the time.

I have a few cues, some just for show on the wall it makes the room look better, but I think the most expensive of those is probably worth $500, the others not much at all, they are for esthetic reasons only. My current playing cue is a production Viking, although I am looking for a custom cue to be bulit for me shortly. Thats simply because I cannot find anything out there already that fits my specifications, I know it will costs me a bit but it's the last (or hopefully the last) cue I will buy.

Bottom line I wouldn't pay that even if I won the lottery, local pick up only on something like a cue also worries me :shrug: