Best game to practice???

[CreeDo]

First instinct: What everyone says, straight pool.
Second instinct: 9 ball
Finally: 8 ball??

I remember what Joe Tucker had to say on this topic, which is that players would actually be better off learning 9-ball and similar games... learning early to make long shots and be comfortable with tough cuts and using plenty of spin.

The short, easy shots and the little stun positions seen in straight pool are unique but honestly not that difficult. Players are exaggerating it when they claim you routinely play shape into tiny windows where an inch off will end your run. Listen to player reviews by John Schmidt and you'll hear how often you're just going for an area with multiple Plan B choices, in case your Plan A fails.

So, straight pool is overrated here. But is it 9 ball? Those little stun and nip shots, short combos, dead balls, and caroms don't come up much in that game. You'll also rarely have to break out a cluster which is its own skill. I'd want a game that forces me to move the cue ball all over the table, make tough shots, navigate traffic, plus occasionally go into the balls in controlled way.

I think that might be eight ball.

 

[weakfingers]

I find you need a hell of a stroke to play good 9 ball consistently. Straight pool is great for precise movements, getting on the right side of balls, etc... 9 ball, big stroke and big movement for positions.

Once again this is just in general, not saying that other situations won't come up in each game.

 

[Pushout]

First instinct: What everyone says, straight pool.
Second instinct: 9 ball
Finally: 8 ball??

I remember what Joe Tucker had to say on this topic, which is that players would actually be better off learning 9-ball and similar games... learning early to make long shots and be comfortable with tough cuts and using plenty of spin.

The short, easy shots and the little stun positions seen in straight pool are unique but honestly not that difficult. Players are exaggerating it when they claim you routinely play shape into tiny windows where an inch off will end your run. Listen to player reviews by John Schmidt and you'll hear how often you're just going for an area with multiple Plan B choices, in case your Plan A fails.

So, straight pool is overrated here. But is it 9 ball? Those little stun and nip shots, short combos, dead balls, and caroms don't come up much in that game. You'll also rarely have to break out a cluster which is its own skill. I'd want a game that forces me to move the cue ball all over the table, make tough shots, navigate traffic, plus occasionally go into the balls in controlled way.

I think that might be eight ball.

I'd respectfully disagree. When I was learning Straight Pool I practiced long shots, very tough cut shots, and using english until it came out my ears. I don't think Straight Pool is overrated at all, I think it's in how you look at it and what era you learned it in, to some degree. I've had to break out a hell of a lot of clusters playing 9 ball, maybe not as large as in 14.1 but clusters all the same. And, if you can play Straight Pool 8 ball is, to a large extent, a lot easier.

 

[Dunnn51]

Thank You

It's straight rotation...what the Filipinos play, but learned from us. It's like playing 10 ball with 15 balls, for points (face value), roll outs, spot shots and first one to 61 points wins. It's the one pocket of rotation games. Check it out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wb0Aorv8e30

I used to Love this game ! No-one around here plays it, they all play straight pool. I know with a good opponent this would accelerate my game.

Thanks :smile:

 

[Pre-Flag Master]

First instinct: What everyone says, straight pool.
Second instinct: 9 ball
Finally: 8 ball??

I remember what Joe Tucker had to say on this topic, which is that players would actually be better off learning 9-ball and similar games... learning early to make long shots and be comfortable with tough cuts and using plenty of spin.

The short, easy shots and the little stun positions seen in straight pool are unique but honestly not that difficult. Players are exaggerating it when they claim you routinely play shape into tiny windows where an inch off will end your run. Listen to player reviews by John Schmidt and you'll hear how often you're just going for an area with multiple Plan B choices, in case your Plan A fails.

So, straight pool is overrated here. But is it 9 ball? Those little stun and nip shots, short combos, dead balls, and caroms don't come up much in that game. You'll also rarely have to break out a cluster which is its own skill. I'd want a game that forces me to move the cue ball all over the table, make tough shots, navigate traffic, plus occasionally go into the balls in controlled way.

I think that might be eight ball.

I was thinking something similar myself. As 8-ball is the closest thing to a cross between 9-ball and 14.1, it might be the best "practice game"...

Either that or Kulay...

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=285986

:grinning-moose:

Fatz

 

[PGHteacher]

The big question is; how do you practice a game? 14.1 always has been and always will be the test of pool skill and the best way to learn the game. If the game is long enough the better pool player will win well over 99% of the time. How does one practice 14.1? That is the bigger question and harder to answer. Play 14.1 to make yourself better. You will know "all the shots"; as one 9ball champ said to me "any pool player of any merit plays straight pool, you wanna know why that is?"

 

[RFranklin]

Best Practice

I would have to agree that 14.1 is a great game to play but the argument that it is a better practice for those exact leaves is a little skewed. Early in racks you still have choices (like 8) so perfect position on a specific ball is not absolultley necessary. I think that is where 9 ball can be a better tool for cue ball position. One variation that I like use to practice the delicate position play that staight pool requires is 9 or 10 ball on half the table against the ghost. You can use all pockets but 9 or 10 balls only partially spread will force you to make those perfect leaves necessay in all billiard games. I am only an APA player but I have improved from a 5/5 in both 9 and 8 respectively to a 9/7 in two years praticing mainly 9. And if you cant find a player that ranks closely with you, practice against the ghost. Marrying a lower ranked player to the rack does you no good.
Oh, if you want to get better at banks find an older one pocket player and take notes.

 

[Big Perm]

1. Pool 300

2. 14.1

3. 1 pocket runout

4. 9 ball

5. banks

6. 8 ball

If you have the right partner, it's always great to finish with pool 69.....just don't get any on the felt.

 

[Espartaco_7]

What's pool 300?

 

[CreeDo]

I'd respectfully disagree. When I was learning Straight Pool I practiced long shots, very tough cut shots, and using english until it came out my ears.

When you say you practiced that stuff, you mean those shots came up naturally a lot? Or you just chose to work on those tough shots?

Seems like you mostly shoot those when you're struggling... ended up stuck on the head rail after the break, or overran shape on the break ball and have to make a thin cut, etc.

I guess it's fair to say those shots come up in straight pool. Nobody goes through ten racks perfectly without having to hit a tester. Just seems like 9b is full of testers while straight pool you might shoot 50 balls without a tough shot if you're on a roll.

 

[Cornerman]

Which would you think is the best game to practice and develop cue ball control, shot making, position play and feel?

Easy. You practice the game you want to get good at.

 

[7forlife]

Sorry if this runs on but please read

I strongly feel that I am a perfect candidate for this topic, at this precise time.

But first let me say that I believe there is a lot of two things takings place here, and this often causes a lot of confusion on topics such as this.
1) people who have not played, properly played or fully understand a specific game
2) deliberately or accidentally not paying attention to what they are saying and for the most part just stating what is felt without proper knowledge and be byass about something that the like or prefer.

Had this question came up 6 months ago I would of voted for 9 ball hands down and fight for it the same way that others are trying, or the same way that I am going to fight for 14-1. See I felt that "big strokes and running rails was what it's all about and it showed skill, but it wasn't until I made my first attemp to play 14-1 that I learnt what really matters. Some of you are being hypocrites and others ignorant "as I have in the past" by not properly playing 14-1 or being around someone who fully understands the proper way to play the game, thinking that its to this or it's to that, and not realizing that there are right patterns and wrong patterns, which can lead to the same result "running the rack". But that is as wrong as thinking that because you made the ball means that you it it right.

The hyporites are not realizing that when you say "9 ball runs rails and has big shots" that that is not pool, because you are the same ones who "on another topic" will say that a true player knows how to work a rack by moving the ball as little as possible and travling the least distance. Also forgetting that most "drills" for true cue ball control are all "small area drills", there for how can 9 ball, a game "when played by the inexperience" that requires that much stroke and ball movement "into a zone" beat out a game that requires faaaar more knowledge of cue ball path, deflection, speed, object ball reaction "as breaking out clusters and playing caroms", etc.

There are many great players, but not everyone can teach pool/be a good coach. I am not as good a player as I should be or others that that I am or should be (for other and personal reasons) but I have had great coaches and friends, people who were able to give me priceless information about this beautiful sport that we squabble over.

It is in my humble opinion that 14-1 is the best game for player development at an early stage, with 8 ball (proper 8 ball) being a very close second,mbut only so since the game reset after each rack following the most random act (breaking) limiting the contenious flow of shot making and position play that is 14-1. Thank you Mark Gefeller and Holden Chin just to name a few.

oh and P.S.
anyone one can drive but not everyone can pot

 

[Majic]

When you say you practiced that stuff, you mean those shots came up naturally a lot? Or you just chose to work on those tough shots?

Seems like you mostly shoot those when you're struggling... ended up stuck on the head rail after the break, or overran shape on the break ball and have to make a thin cut, etc.

I guess it's fair to say those shots come up in straight pool. Nobody goes through ten racks perfectly without having to hit a tester. Just seems like 9b is full of testers while straight pool you might shoot 50 balls without a tough shot if you're on a roll.

9 ball is full of testers because of weak position play !!!

 

[Pushout]

When you say you practiced that stuff, you mean those shots came up naturally a lot? Or you just chose to work on those tough shots?

Seems like you mostly shoot those when you're struggling... ended up stuck on the head rail after the break, or overran shape on the break ball and have to make a thin cut, etc.

I guess it's fair to say those shots come up in straight pool. Nobody goes through ten racks perfectly without having to hit a tester. Just seems like 9b is full of testers while straight pool you might shoot 50 balls without a tough shot if you're on a roll.

Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner, our internet was down from yesterday afternoon until about a half hour ago. I practiced those shots, like I said in my post, ok, I worked on them:wink: I was taught that you had to be ready for whatever shot came up. IMNSHO, Straight Pool makes a lot of those "testers" in 9 ball a lot easier to make. Just my opinion, ya unnerstand? Learning good position play, which you have to do learning Straight Pool, makes a lot less testers.

 

[Pete]

I voted straight pool, but think 9 ball is an important game to practice. It let's you use and develope a big swinging stroke (if i played better, I would say 10 ball).

 

[gopi-1]

If Pool 61 is the same as Rotation, then that's the game.

You got an overcrowded table (15 balls and the cb), lots of traffic and moving the cb to just one SPECIFIC target every shot. You'll get to learn your diamonds quick, use all the clubs available in your bag (stun shot, forced follow, hard and controlled draw). A game that has a lot of options like 14.1 and 8 ball doesn't do me any good, while 9 ball has less balls and you can end the game in one shot...

 

[mohrt]

Here is one I made up, there are probably games similar. This is essentially solo practice for 1 pocket.

Break 15 balls. Pick a pocket at the foot of the table. Proceed to run all the balls into that pocket, any order. For each miss, spot a ball. For a ball pocketed in the wrong pocket, spot it. Fouls spot a ball, scratches come in behind the head string.

See how many shots it takes to clear the table. Continue to improve your score.

Getting position for a single pocket is a lot of work. You will be attempting plenty of multi-rail bank shots and kicks too. ie. if you can't get behind a ball for shape, then get shape for the two-rail bank the other direction.

 

[CreeDo]

9 ball is full of testers because of weak position play !!!

Well, for some players I'm sure that's the case. Probably for me too.

But even with strong position play, after the break you're sometimes looking at a testy one ball. Not necessarily your fault, stuff gets kicked around. You'll also be looking at a tough shot after a push, if the opponent lets you see the one. And occasionally someone dogs a safety and leaves you a look, but it's still a shot only a mother could love.

Saying it another way, for every 50 balls run, 9b will have more testers than both straight pool and 8 ball (assuming the same guy shooting all three games, and he's about equal skill level in all of them).

 

[Bill812]

10.5 Straight Rotation

What is "pool 61"?

How about that Allen Hopkin's thing where you run first 10 balls like straight pool and last 5 balls like rotation game. Best of both world???

http://infohost.nmt.edu/~billiard/qskills_scorecard.html

I voted for straight pool, but Allen's "10.5 Straight Rotation" game is awesome for both practice and competition. You can find instructions & scoresheets on his 10.5 Straight Rotation Facebook page. In a nut shell, it starts with 15 balls in the standart triangle rack, leaving the highest face values in the center of the rack, with an 8 Ball open break. You play straight pool with the first 10 balls, each worth 1 point, then shoot the remaining 5 highest face value. You shoot the whole rack, a miss is a 2 point deduction, a scratch loses you 5 points. A perfect rack is 75 points. You play 4-12 racks each player (whatever is agreed upon before the start of the game), the highest total points wins. Eliminating lucky rolls and having to play defensive shots, it's you against the rack. Great concept, it's the best of most popular billiard games, IMHO!

 

[Playin4Dinner]

My choice is 12-ball ghost... A made thread for it below...

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=292444

Alot more intricate position involved as opposed to 9-ball ghost... Spots where balls have only one pocket or forced to carom/combo/bank out... Margin of error becomes pretty large once you get down to 5-6 balls in 9-ball ghost... So some racks begin wide open with little or no work if you have a big break...