Buyers Beware of Pathman
- Thread starter hotdogg
- Start date
Hotdogg lost a little credibility when he said,
" I love the case." HOWEVER, if I buy something
from an AZer & I feel that what I got was
definitely not what I was told I was going to
get, & then when I pm'd him, he told me to
quit whining; what other recourse do I have?
I'd call him out on the forum to explain his
actions to me & others. It would seem obvious
that no refund was offered. Plus, hearing about
other's high regard for Pathman may make Hotdogg
re-examine & re-think the cut.
" I love the case." HOWEVER, if I buy something
from an AZer & I feel that what I got was
definitely not what I was told I was going to
get, & then when I pm'd him, he told me to
quit whining; what other recourse do I have?
I'd call him out on the forum to explain his
actions to me & others. It would seem obvious
that no refund was offered. Plus, hearing about
other's high regard for Pathman may make Hotdogg
re-examine & re-think the cut.
hondo said:
No refund was requested. In my opinion this guy just wanted something to complain about. This has become a matter of principle for me at this point, hotdogg got one hell of nice case at one hell of a nice price and he doesn't realize it, what more can you ask for. I promise that any of the people in the know on this board would have been extremely happy with this case and the price. No hard feelings, I just don't think the guy knows what he's doing.
pathman said:
Sorry Mike, my words were a little strong. It's just that I've been on the end of deals where I was sold something that was not as I expected and the seller dumped me. If you are/were willing to refund the case, then thats all you can do. If fact, if the buyer did not discuss that with you prior to making his complaint public, then he did a disservice to you.
I hope that both parties reach an agreement.
Regards,
Doug
Maybe the cut happened in shipping or in opening the package?
To Continue the HORN BLOWING, I have also traded, bought, sold, and borrowed from Mike, and in fact I right now have THREE CUES, of his, on approval with no money changing hands, just to get a feel of their play. I have never received anything from Mike that was not as described. Further never paid anything out of line, in fact, often below value. We regularly talk and trade around sticks with no concerns of honesty, integrity, ethics and the like....
Mike is the most honest and open guy to talk pool, and equipment with.
I consider him a friend and have welcomed him to come visit my family if ever up this way.
If you ever want a reference on HOTDOG, I have had no dealings with him, but as in the sandwich, heartburn must follow close behind him.
JAY
"no faith in the humankind"
Mike is the most honest and open guy to talk pool, and equipment with.
I consider him a friend and have welcomed him to come visit my family if ever up this way.
If you ever want a reference on HOTDOG, I have had no dealings with him, but as in the sandwich, heartburn must follow close behind him.
JAY
"no faith in the humankind"
Selling something is not a matter of priciple, and it would be offensive to me if I complained about a transaction and someone told me to sell it and buy another from the maker. Clearly there is some personal conflict between both of them. If a buyer is unhappy for any reason then the resolution is quite simple, send it back and get your money back, or shut the f**k up. Any bantering back and forth only causes bad feelings and ends up being aired on this forum where no one really knows what happened. I do all of my transactions this way, and only this way, and have never had a problem.
PS, and negative comments about a poster because we are not familiar with them is equally not constructive. Thats not to say that the DAs we know don't deserve a shot now and then.
PS, and negative comments about a poster because we are not familiar with them is equally not constructive. Thats not to say that the DAs we know don't deserve a shot now and then.
hotdogg said:
- I think he should have taken the case back for a refund.
- I don't think he should insult you for raising what you consider to be legitimate concerns of damage not described.
- I don't think you should have posted this.
- I do think that if he had treated you in a polite manner, you would not have posted this.
The most important rule is always the Golden Rule, and I am pleased to say that examples of it are always right here to be found on A-Z Billiards.
Chris
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This will be my final reply to this silly post. No refund was requested. I did not insult him until provoked. This posting is silly. You have no idea if he was treated politely or not. I do have a short fuse when it comes to things like this. I admit that. I have been purchasing cues and cases for over 20 years now and don't suffer fools as well as I once did. I have always sought to bring integrity and fairness to the sport and hobby I love. Cue/case selling and swapping is full of shady characters with broken-repaired cues and shoe polished cases and buyers would do well to educate themselves, I've seen it all, and therefore have always been one of the most above board guys you could deal with. I have made some truly dear friends on this board and will contunue to support it. I just can't believe I'm in the middle of one of these silly pi$*ing matches over a 375.00 case, which I accepted pay-pal on and included shipping.TATE said:
I agree with TATE
I agree what TATE has stated about this issue. I would not have posted this thread if Mike had not been so impolite and unwilling. I also agree that it may not have been the best choice to post on the forum. But from Mike's replies I felt that I had no other choice than to do that. He was less than willing to even work with me. All he did was resort to name calling and told me to sell the case myself.
As far as others saying that I had cut the case when I opened it, I am 100% sure that I didn't because for one I was so excited that I just tore the box open with my bare hands and not with a box cutter and the cut looked old.
Another thing is I don't understand why everybody is so quick to jump on my back. All I had posted was what had happened to me, no lies no bs. I in no way said anything insulting about Pathman as well, all I did was state that I was in a state of disappointment.
As far as Mike saying that this is only a 375.00 dollar case, though that may not be much money for him or other collectors/dealers on this site, it is a significant amount of money for me.
I agree what TATE has stated about this issue. I would not have posted this thread if Mike had not been so impolite and unwilling. I also agree that it may not have been the best choice to post on the forum. But from Mike's replies I felt that I had no other choice than to do that. He was less than willing to even work with me. All he did was resort to name calling and told me to sell the case myself.
As far as others saying that I had cut the case when I opened it, I am 100% sure that I didn't because for one I was so excited that I just tore the box open with my bare hands and not with a box cutter and the cut looked old.
Another thing is I don't understand why everybody is so quick to jump on my back. All I had posted was what had happened to me, no lies no bs. I in no way said anything insulting about Pathman as well, all I did was state that I was in a state of disappointment.
As far as Mike saying that this is only a 375.00 dollar case, though that may not be much money for him or other collectors/dealers on this site, it is a significant amount of money for me.
TATE said:
Sorry bad picture, but a picture nonetheless
Here is a crappy picture of the slit/cut. I runs across the whole side of the case. This picture only shows a part of the whole slit, but I think it'll give you guys/gals a rough idea. The picture doesn't really do me justice but here is something for you guys to look at. I'll post better pictures when I can get ahold of a better camera. Sorry about not posting pictures earlier, but I am in the process of moving and haven't really had time. It is also time for Final testing as well.
Here is a crappy picture of the slit/cut. I runs across the whole side of the case. This picture only shows a part of the whole slit, but I think it'll give you guys/gals a rough idea. The picture doesn't really do me justice but here is something for you guys to look at. I'll post better pictures when I can get ahold of a better camera. Sorry about not posting pictures earlier, but I am in the process of moving and haven't really had time. It is also time for Final testing as well.
Attachments
Hotdog,
I still need to understand something.
The transaction was private and you admit to "loving" the case, so why are you publicly lashing out at him.....rather than keeping it private?
As has been suggested, unless you are totally prepared to try this in the court of public opinion, you better be careful.
People already want to see the photo evidence of the claimed damage to the case and until you've shown what you claim, I don't see where you have a leg to stand on.
The burden of proof lies with you for now.
PS, I see your photo now, but at least focus the shot. the camera cannot be so bad it can't focus.
I still need to understand something.
The transaction was private and you admit to "loving" the case, so why are you publicly lashing out at him.....rather than keeping it private?
As has been suggested, unless you are totally prepared to try this in the court of public opinion, you better be careful.
People already want to see the photo evidence of the claimed damage to the case and until you've shown what you claim, I don't see where you have a leg to stand on.
The burden of proof lies with you for now.
PS, I see your photo now, but at least focus the shot. the camera cannot be so bad it can't focus.
Ouch. Those are cuts, not scratches.
It would take a very sharp object, like a razor or knife, to cut leather like that. The slits look old to me - looks like they picked up some oil from a cleaning.
My totally objective opinion is the case is damaged and should have been refunded, no doubt, no question, unless the cuts were disclosed before purchase.
There is no doubt in my mind that if this were to go to small claims, a judge would order Pathman to pay back Hotdogg.
Chris
It would take a very sharp object, like a razor or knife, to cut leather like that. The slits look old to me - looks like they picked up some oil from a cleaning.
My totally objective opinion is the case is damaged and should have been refunded, no doubt, no question, unless the cuts were disclosed before purchase.
There is no doubt in my mind that if this were to go to small claims, a judge would order Pathman to pay back Hotdogg.
Chris
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I am in no way wanting to goto small claims court. All I wanted to do was reach some sort of private resolution with Mike, but from the beginning he just didn't want to cooperate.
As a side note from those posters that have been jumping on my back, I haven't hid anything about the story. I have told the truth and the complete truth. If you look back on Pathman's posts, he pretty much repeats what I told you guys beforehand about him telling me to sell the case myself and that how he knew that I was going to be a "complainer." How would you guys like to be in my situation, buying something that wasn't completely described?
I adore the case because of its functionality and because my other case isn't really that great, just one of those cheap box cases. Prior to buying the case, I had to save my precious dollars to even buy a case. I saved hard so that I could get one of those dreams cases that many of the other Azers have. When I saw the Mike's Justis case for sale, I thought that it would be my dream case, but maybe without as many thrills as some of the other cases posted on the forum. BUT when I received the case, my dream was shattered, I DIDN'T GET WHAT I PAID FOR. I paid for a "nearly new" Justis case, NOT one with a cut in it. I still adore it because it is BY FAR better than any case that I have owned. That is why I like the case, BUT it still wasn't the case I was expecting and paid for. So why do some of you guys get on my case for saying that I liked the case? Jack's cases are works of art. Just because I like the case does not mean I am wrong to make a post and Mike was right to sell me case with a cut on it? I am just a poor college kid working his way through school.
As a side note from those posters that have been jumping on my back, I haven't hid anything about the story. I have told the truth and the complete truth. If you look back on Pathman's posts, he pretty much repeats what I told you guys beforehand about him telling me to sell the case myself and that how he knew that I was going to be a "complainer." How would you guys like to be in my situation, buying something that wasn't completely described?
I adore the case because of its functionality and because my other case isn't really that great, just one of those cheap box cases. Prior to buying the case, I had to save my precious dollars to even buy a case. I saved hard so that I could get one of those dreams cases that many of the other Azers have. When I saw the Mike's Justis case for sale, I thought that it would be my dream case, but maybe without as many thrills as some of the other cases posted on the forum. BUT when I received the case, my dream was shattered, I DIDN'T GET WHAT I PAID FOR. I paid for a "nearly new" Justis case, NOT one with a cut in it. I still adore it because it is BY FAR better than any case that I have owned. That is why I like the case, BUT it still wasn't the case I was expecting and paid for. So why do some of you guys get on my case for saying that I liked the case? Jack's cases are works of art. Just because I like the case does not mean I am wrong to make a post and Mike was right to sell me case with a cut on it? I am just a poor college kid working his way through school.
TATE said:
Fart sniffer said:
He probably got all geeked when it came and in a hyper way hacked at the package and butchered up the case....
________
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