Chemically enhanced......found this odd bc...

formidableone14

formidableone14

Changing the stars
Silver Member
Last night at my league night I was talking with an older gentlemen by the name of "B". This conversation started b/c he was selling the CJ Wiley TOI discs and he does minor cue repairs while at the pool hall. He was telling me about how he played with CJ and some of the "inside knowledge" he had. We got on the subject about how top players are using drugs to gain an edge. I was curious to hear what the thoughts were on this. I asked him what made him think that and he said "I dont think, I know. I have been around it".

I would just like to know what everyone else thinks or has to say about this since the thread I saw made me question it even more myself.
 
I loved dopers

formidableone14 said:
Last night at my league night I was talking with an older gentlemen by the name of "B". This conversation started b/c he was selling the CJ Wiley TOI discs and he does minor cue repairs while at the pool hall. He was telling me about how he played with CJ and some of the "inside knowledge" he had. We got on the subject about how top players are using drugs to gain an edge. I was curious to hear what the thoughts were on this. I asked him what made him think that and he said "I dont think, I know. I have been around it".

I would just like to know what everyone else thinks or has to say about this since the thread I saw made me question it even more myself.
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At just the right point in their high dopers can have an edge especially in very long or late night battles. For the most part their edge is imagined though and even when they have one all you have to do is hang with them. They are gonna get too high or come crashing down. Since they are under the influence they rarely quit on you until they are flat busted.

Most people using drugs, even top players, are doing it for the high not enhanced performance although they might kid themselves.

Years ago I bought a bottle of yellows. This was very weak speed. Three or four gave you a serious rush, one taken once in awhile could somewhat balance out alcohol and fatigue playing all nighters. Still didn't have the fresh and well rested edge but an edge on people that were exhausted and in the bag. Used like that it was some help. Our US military pilots were issued speed for decades, still are as far as I know. Wouldn't be surprised if the same was true of our astronouts. At the right dosage it can make you sharper than nothing at all when going long hours at a task.

Funny story about speed from years ago. The dad of some friends had a business putting on a plastic roofing product. It was used as a primary coating sometimes and to repair roofs. It was used to repair leaks on the superdome many years ago. They employed many of their kid's friends on a part time basis and I sometimes helped out without pay, I had my own things going. One day Mr. T's son had decided they would impress the old man and the whole crew had taken speed. I came through a few hours later. Mr. T's son came up to where we were talking, "We are really getting it on today aren't we?"

"You are all brushing like hell but you aren't moving your feet!"

I looked around and it was true. About ten people were all speeding their asses off and swinging brooms in a blur while standing in the same place. That is often the story with people on drugs, easy for them to believe they are setting the world on fire when they are standing in one place.

Hu
 
Not that I condone it, but I think the only "useful" drug to take when playing pool is a beta blocker to calm nervousness.

Any other drug will just make you feel like you have an edge but you are just fooling yourself. It will eventually bite you in the ass. Either you will just feel like you are playing stronger than you actually are or your game will go to crap the minute you are out of that "perfect balance" you need to be in for the drugs to be effective at all. You do a little too much and your game falls apart or you drop a little too low and your game falls apart. Also, in a long set, trying to maintain a balance over an extended period of time is near impossible. Then you factor in the financial cost, the emotional toll, and the physical damage and you end up with a losing equation.

Nothing teaches you this lesson better than waking up after sleeping for 2 days because you were up for 3 days straight and then realizing that not only did you lose big money gambling but you are also out an additional 500 for the drugs and you physically feel like a truck ran you over.
 
hated beta blockers

You are spot on about everything else but I hated the beta blockers I was prescribed for blood pressure for years too. They left me flat footed and I need that little bit of adrenalin pumping to perform at my best. Beta blockers were originally prescribed in conjunction with another drug, I forget what now. After years and millions if not billions made selling beta blockers newer studies concluded the other drug was just as effective without the beta blocker at controlling blood pressure!

Hu


PaulieB said:
Not that I condone it, but I think the only "useful" drug to take when playing pool is a beta blocker to calm nervousness.

Any other drug will just make you feel like you have an edge but you are just fooling yourself. It will eventually bite you in the ass. Either you will just feel like you are playing stronger than you actually are or your game will go to crap the minute you are out of that "perfect balance" you need to be in for the drugs to be effective at all. You do a little too much and your game falls apart or you drop a little too low and your game falls apart. Also, in a long set, trying to maintain a balance over an extended period of time is near impossible. Then you factor in the financial cost, the emotional toll, and the physical damage and you end up with a losing equation.

Nothing teaches you this lesson better than waking up after sleeping for 2 days because you were up for 3 days straight and then realizing that not only did you lose big money gambling but you are also out an additional 500 for the drugs and you physically feel like a truck ran you over.
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Beta blockers were what I thought of when I saw this thread (and the other similar one).

I seem to recall this coming up a few years ago, but don't remember the details.
 
First off, everyone feels their own experience is indicative of how things 'are'. Not true.

secondly...uhh

Why do you think they call it dope?
 
ShootingArts said:
You are spot on about everything else but I hated the beta blockers I was prescribed for blood pressure for years too. They left me flat footed and I need that little bit of adrenalin pumping to perform at my best. Beta blockers were originally prescribed in conjunction with another drug, I forget what now. After years and millions if not billions made selling beta blockers newer studies concluded the other drug was just as effective without the beta blocker at controlling blood pressure!

Hu
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A lot of times they would prescribe a beta blocker with a fluid pill, like hyrdochlorothiazide.

Also, if you aren't anxious when playing a match, I can only imagine that they would make you feel dull and flat footed, as you described. I used to have to take mine at night, as they would put me to sleep. However, when I first played league, I was very nervous about letting my team down, and it helped if I took my pill a little bit earlier on league nights. This was years ago though, as after a better diet and some exercise I no longer need the meds, as my blood pressure is naturally under control.
 
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Drugs

Yep keeplng calm is what they want i havnt been to many tourns, latley but last sat. and last night i went out. Sat. was an acs tourn . 1 player in the final 4 didnt go out and smoke.last night i went out because there was some out of town guys looking for 100 200 sets. I pull into the lot behind out of state car inside 2 guys getting the munchies. In the come ready to play after every race outside. NO HEART.
 
Rico said:
Yep keeplng calm is what they want i havnt been to many tourns, latley but last sat. and last night i went out. Sat. was an acs tourn . 1 player in the final 4 didnt go out and smoke.last night i went out because there was some out of town guys looking for 100 200 sets. I pull into the lot behind out of state car inside 2 guys getting the munchies. In the come ready to play after every race outside. NO HEART.
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bad you didn't have any heart coz the come ready to play after every race outside.
 
what is this i dont even...



OK but seriously... I've seen countless dudes like the "older gentleman" who are very In The Know about What Really Happens Behind the Scenes™.

They probably saw some local hotshot smoking cloves out back and twist that into "85% of the top pros are hopped up on Dexedrine and Adderall." They love to be the center of drama and gossip.

They'll also be the first to tell you that every time a big name player lost, there was a secret dump, and about such-and-so was in a secret $50,000 money match and took down Archer in his basement but nobody witnessed it.
 
CreeDo said:
what is this i dont even...



OK but seriously... I've seen countless dudes like the "older gentleman" who are very In The Know about What Really Happens Behind the Scenes™.

They probably saw some local hotshot smoking cloves out back and twist that into "85% of the top pros are hopped up on Dexedrine and Adderall." They love to be the center of drama and gossip.

They'll also be the first to tell you that every time a big name player lost, there was a secret dump, and about such-and-so was in a secret $50,000 money match and took down Archer in his basement but nobody witnessed it.
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Not that Im trying to say he is or isnt lying but if he truley did play with CJ on a regular basis as he said he did (he said CJ use to beat up on him all day everyday, sparring partner) Im sure he would have some sort of knowledge or insight that a normal player like you mention wouldnt. Like I said though who knows, I was just curious since a thread popped up about it.
 
Sometimes you can get some serious, serious, focus going on. Running drills while smoking? Well gee there goes 5 or 6 hours.

So I've heard. I'm a middle aged tax paying law abiding schmuck now so what do I know.


I do know that sometimes that focus can be too much.

A "friend" of mine once came back from the losers bracket in a decent size tavern bar box 8-ball tournament to end up in the finals. Beat the winners bracket guy game 1. In game 2 opponent gets to the 8 ball and misses, leaving it by the side pocket but not an easy cut in. Our intrepid brain dead hero, after spending too much time in the parking lot between matches smoking all day, gets up, runs out to the 8 but leaves himself a bad angle. While studying the cut on the 8, he notices a tiny fragment of chalk is right by the cue ball. So of course he lifts the cueball up, brushes the chalk fragment away and sets the cueball back down. Opponent yells FOUL, gets ball in hand and rolls the 8 up the rail into the corner for the win and first place.

Definitely an embarrassing "you have smoked yourself retarded" moment.
 
Cocaine, pot and speed was the drug of choice of many pool players in the 70s 80s 90s, now it is pain pills!

And alcohol of course!
 
Do some pool players use specific drugs to gain an advantage? Yes.
Do I? No.
Do I win local tourneys? Not anymore...tourneys are going to 4-6am to avoid the "2-day" stigma & I can't compete with the users.
 
The 5 hour energy drink is commonly seen at a lot of pool tourneys along with Redbull etc drinks the speedup is all based on the natural human reflex of adrenalin. The rush changes your blood flow and breathign to optimize performance for a short period of time. This triggers systems that were evolved to allow the person to run from the bear or whatever when flight or fight systems are triggered. Now the same effect is being used to sharpen vision, wake up the user, be more creative using drugs. There is only so much up up up in the human system and it will be burned out after a while. The US military has looked at speed and speed like substances for enhanced performance from soldiers and pilots. Recently products like Provigil and Nuvigil have been tested for the same result by them, these drugs wake up the user without the rush of speed. Desoxyn were preferred by players at one time it was definitely a strong speed pill. I think alot of truly high speed pool on Desxyn pills, I have heard this from many good players who i will not name. I believe most of the chemical players from days gone by can all tell you stories about those pills. These pills would be very easy to abuse as they had a strong rushlike effect.

I have to agree with Hu that a lot of people on drugs think they are playing better than they actually playing. Also, playing on pot/THC is extremely common and it is liable to cause quality issues as the buzz wears off. I would recommend that players who do not take drugs now not take drugs in the future to improve there pool game.
 
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probably the best pool i have ever witnessed was played by a road agent who was lit up on pcp. he also consumed a case + of beer.
 
formidableone14 said:
Last night at my league night I was talking with an older gentlemen by the name of "B". This conversation started b/c he was selling the CJ Wiley TOI discs and he does minor cue repairs while at the pool hall. He was telling me about how he played with CJ and some of the "inside knowledge" he had. We got on the subject about how top players are using drugs to gain an edge. I was curious to hear what the thoughts were on this. I asked him what made him think that and he said "I dont think, I know. I have been around it".

I would just like to know what everyone else thinks or has to say about this since the thread I saw made me question it even more myself.
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I'm assuming you're talking about Ben Tubbs, who is a close friend of CJ's. He's seen plenty, and I wouldn't discredit most of what he says. I'm sure he has 1st hand knowledge of various gambling stories/sets that were played in and around Dallas in the 90's.

Staying on topic with "chemicals," we saw a guy a few weeks ago that was down against a friend of mine. He literally walks into the bathroom for about 10 secs, and walks out wiping his nose. He then proceeds to play lights out and can't sit still at all. It's just one of those things that makes you go hmm...
 
Saw many young players age fast........

When you have been around for a long time you have seen most of it.

One time I came into a town and beat this kid out of $2000 giving him the 6 ball. He had a backer that lost the money.

I came back about 2 months later and his backer wasn't around and he could only bet $200.

He ran out from everywhere on that bar table. After 2 sets of this i told him that I couldn't spot him. I wasn't even getting to shoot.

He almost ran out the next set without me shooting. I looked at his pupils and they were as big as golf balls.

I lost 3 sets in a row and never had a chance but I knew he had some ramped up stuff he was on. When I quit he offered me a spot. It wouldn't have mattered if he just kept running out.

I came back about 3 weeks later and looked at his pupils. They were huge again so i didn't play. Told him I had to be someplace to play later that day.

Came back 2 months later and the pupils were small again. His backer was there also and knew how his boy had drubbed me the last time.

I played him even for one set and beat him pretty bad. I had to give him back the spot but I kept an eye on the pupils.

Beat them out of about $2000 again. He never was in the game at all.

Now this was an extreme example that taught me a lesson. I lived it in the 70's 80's and the 90's. One of the pills that the players would take was the meds for narcalepsy. I don't even know how to spell it. These guys all played well but their social lives and marriages all went to crap. Once there was no pills they couldn't play.

I'm not going to name any other pills because I'd hate some young guy to start taking them to see if it would help. You have to have the skills to begin with for sure but many players do. They just can't keep the nerves in check.

I wish they would have had drug tests years ago like other sport so the players are all playing on a level playing field.

Baseball a guy hits over .300 and smacks 30 homeruns. Without the drugs he hit 250 the year before and 5 homeruns.

Tell me again the drugs don't matter!

Lance Armstrong won all those tour de frances.

Tell me again that the drugs don't matter.

The problem on the road was you never could tell when you were playing against the drugs. Hard to outrun them but it could be done.

I did it a few times but it was because my skill level was just too much but they gave me a fight. It usually had to do with out smarting them allot.

This is what is so cool about one pocket. The guy on drugs might try the shots that would sell him out where the steady eddie will just keep chipping away.

I'm all for no drugs at all.

One top player that is really struggling is on the clean side right now. It's tough to get your real emotions in check when you've used the chemicals for years.

The good news is that once a player is off the chemicals they are so much nicer to be around and deal with. Allot less drama without the drugs.

Just more common sense with everything including real life..
 
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