Chohan V Orcollo October 5 –8

[Cory in DC]

Eight days of One-Pocket:

Orcollo - Chohan

July 2017

• Day 1: 3 - 10
  Day 2: 11 - 10
  Day 3: 15 - 10
  Day 4: 9 - 10
  
  4-Day Total: 38 - 40

Oct. 2017

• Day 1: 10 - 7
  Day 2: 10 - 6
  Day 3: 10 - 8
  Day 4: 10 - 12
  
  4-Day Total: 40 - 33

8-Day Total: 78 - 73

(I did these quickly, but Mike Page or Bob Jewett, etc. will correct me if I'm wrong I'm sure.)

You could this as Tony winning 3 out of 8 days of play. If they are dead even, meaning the probability of winning is 50/50, then the odds of Tony winning exactly 3 of 8 days are 22% (and the probability of winning 3 or fewer days if it's actually even is 36.3%). The odds of him winning exactly 4 of 8 are 27%. So, the odds of Tony (1) winning 3 of 8 days are too close to (2) his odds of winning 4 of 8 days to statistically reject the null hypothesis that Tony and Dennis are even.

You could also view it by the game. Out of 151 trials, if the odds are in fact 50/50, then Tony's chance of winning between 70 and 75 games (i.e., coming close but not ahead) are about 33.6%. You still can't definitively reject the null hypothesis that Tony and Dennis are even.

It is still more likely than not that Dennis is better than Tony given the available data (so don't take the above to mean I'll bet on Tony at even odds), but we need more data to be statistically definitive. I.e., a rematch.

Cory

 

[one stroke]

(I did these quickly, but Mike Page or Bob Jewett, etc. will correct me if I'm wrong I'm sure.)

You could this as Tony winning 3 out of 8 days of play. If they are dead even, meaning the probability of winning is 50/50, then the odds of Tony winning exactly 3 of 8 days are 22% (and the probability of winning 3 or fewer days if it's actually even is 36.3%). The odds of him winning exactly 4 of 8 are 27%. So, the odds of Tony (1) winning 3 of 8 days are too close to (2) his odds of winning 4 of 8 days to statistically reject the null hypothesis that Tony and Dennis are even.

You could also view it by the game. Out of 151 trials, if the odds are in fact 50/50, then Tony's chance of winning between 70 and 75 games (i.e., coming close but not ahead) are about 33.6%. You still can't definitively reject the null hypothesis that Tony and Dennis are even.

It is still more likely than not that Dennis is better than Tony given the available data (so don't take the above to mean I'll bet on Tony at even odds), but we need more data to be statistically definitive. I.e., a rematch.

Cory

Well I'm not a numbers guy but my eye test told me the first time around Dennis simply didn't play his best he was having a hard time with the cue ball , simple safes he normally hits with ease were way off especially his drawing off balls to the side rail and back to the foot rail and sticking the cue ball on or behind a ball , he left countless shots for TRex either a clean bank or a bank into the stack where TRex took full advantage of and made countless shots or put ball towards his hole
This time around DO hit those shots consistently not only on the lower end of the table but sending the cue up table leaving balls close to his pocket and sticking TRex behind cover balls at the breaking end of the table , he was clearly making TRex beat him from a distance and that's where DO is clearly the better player ,,
Imho if they play again DO is a clear favorite because what you got in the second match is more likely repeatable for DO than how he shot the first time around and I'm not so sure TRex can win the same game



1

 

[Get_A_Grip]

Well I'm not a numbers guy but my eye test told me the first time around Dennis simply didn't play his best he was having a hard time with the cue ball , simple safes he normally hits with ease were way off especially his drawing off balls to the side rail and back to the foot rail and sticking the cue ball on or behind a ball , he left countless shots for TRex either a clean bank or a bank into the stack where TRex took full advantage of and made countless shots or put ball towards his hole

This time around DO hit those shots consistently not only on the lower end of the table but sending the cue up table leaving balls close to his pocket and sticking TRex behind cover balls at the breaking end of the table , he was clearly making TRex beat him from a distance and that's where DO is clearly the better player ,,

Imho if they play again DO is a clear favorite because what you got in the second match is more likely repeatable for DO than how he shot the first time around and I'm not so sure TRex can win the same game







1

I agree. In fact Dennis said after the first bad day of the first match that he just wasn't used to the table yet.




_______

 

[one stroke]

I agree. In fact Dennis said after the first bad day of the first match that he just wasn't used to the table yet.




_______

Had more to do with the cue ball than the table , hence the change in cue ball for this match , either way he clearly was better dialed in this time around right off the bat

1

 

[mikepage]

(I did these quickly, but Mike Page or Bob Jewett, etc. will correct me if I'm wrong I'm sure.)

You could this as Tony winning 3 out of 8 days of play. If they are dead even, meaning the probability of winning is 50/50, then the odds of Tony winning exactly 3 of 8 days are 22% (and the probability of winning 3 or fewer days if it's actually even is 36.3%). The odds of him winning exactly 4 of 8 are 27%. So, the odds of Tony (1) winning 3 of 8 days are too close to (2) his odds of winning 4 of 8 days to statistically reject the null hypothesis that Tony and Dennis are even.

You could also view it by the game. Out of 151 trials, if the odds are in fact 50/50, then Tony's chance of winning between 70 and 75 games (i.e., coming close but not ahead) are about 33.6%. You still can't definitively reject the null hypothesis that Tony and Dennis are even.

It is still more likely than not that Dennis is better than Tony given the available data (so don't take the above to mean I'll bet on Tony at even odds), but we need more data to be statistically definitive. I.e., a rematch.

Cory

I checked all of these numbers. I agree with the numbers and the conclusions.

 

[Nick B]

Tony simply didn’t make enough of the Makeable free shots. I’m not talking about one pocket type shots. I mean the free look table length type stuff.

Dennis is now king....for now. Time for either Scott to tune up or let Alex or SVB show him who is the boss.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Get_A_Grip]

Had more to do with the cue ball than the table , hence the change in cue ball for this match , either way he clearly was better dialed in this time around right off the bat



1

I think that you're right about this too. I vaguely remember a comment about the cue ball being made back then.




_______

 

[Get_A_Grip]

Tony simply didn’t make enough of the Makeable free shots. I’m not talking about one pocket type shots. I mean the free look table length type stuff.

Dennis is now king....for now. Time for either Scott to tune up or let Alex or SVB show him who is the boss.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As straight of a shooter that Dennis is, I think that Alex might eat his lunch.



_______

 

[Nick B]

As straight of a shooter that Dennis is, I think that Alex might eat his lunch.



_______

One of two things will happen. Option 1: Alex flat out beats him. Option 2 After falling a bit behind he figures out how to beat Dennis. Either way. Long match of one pocket. Lion roars.

Ditto for SVB just different options.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Get_A_Grip]

One of two things will happen. Option 1: Alex flat out beats him. Option 2 After falling a bit behind he figures out how to beat Dennis. Either way. Long match of one pocket. Lion roars.

Ditto for SVB just different options.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And Alex is also a very straight shooter.



_______

 

[Justin Bergman]

Alex is for sure the better one pocket player. I think right now he's best in the world now that Efren has been getting older even a few years ago maybe 5 I would still maybe say Efren was the best but now it's Alex.

But you can't really compare Dennis game to Scott's or Tony's one pocket games to Dennis. This is his worst game by far and he's still competing with these guys. If the play him 8 ball, 9 ball, 10 ball, rotation, snooker, straight pool they get tortured except Alex. Although I think Dennis is a hair favorite playing rotation games but Alex is for sure the favorite playing one pocket. Dennis told me that he thinks Alex is the best 1 pocket player.

 

[one stroke]

I checked all of these numbers. I agree with the numbers and the conclusions.

It's a pretty easy conclusion to make since DO is clearly a better player overall however if that's Alex or Shane I'm not so sure the same conclusion could be made after all it was 2 matches different equipment and venues

1

 

[one stroke]

Alex is for sure the better one pocket player. I think right now he's best in the world now that Efren has been getting older even a few years ago maybe 5 I would still maybe say Efren was the best but now it's Alex.

But you can't really compare Dennis game to Scott's or Tony's one pocket games to Dennis. This is his worst game by far and he's still competing with these guys. If the play him 8 ball, 9 ball, 10 ball, rotation, snooker, straight pool they get tortured except Alex. Although I think Dennis is a hair favorite playing rotation games but Alex is for sure the favorite playing one pocket. Dennis told me that he thinks Alex is the best 1 pocket player.

what else would he say , I don't see him as a clear underdog as the game of one pocket and how you play it is clearly changing from how it used to be played

1

 

[Nick B]

Alex is for sure the better one pocket player. I think right now he's best in the world now that Efren has been getting older even a few years ago maybe 5 I would still maybe say Efren was the best but now it's Alex.

But you can't really compare Dennis game to Scott's or Tony's one pocket games to Dennis. This is his worst game by far and he's still competing with these guys. If the play him 8 ball, 9 ball, 10 ball, rotation, snooker, straight pool they get tortured except Alex. Although I think Dennis is a hair favorite playing rotation games but Alex is for sure the favorite playing one pocket. Dennis told me that he thinks Alex is the best 1 pocket player.

Justin,
If you had to play Dennis a long match for comparable cash, which game would you like most?

 

[jay helfert]

The biggest difference between match one and match two as far as Dennis was concerned was the tighter table (4.25" pockets) used in the second match. He prefers it tough. He said the first table was too loose for him. He felt that gave Tony an advantage.

I will agree that Dennis may still be a 9-8 underdog (half a ball) against Shane or Alex at One Pocket. It doesn't sound like much but it is, especially in a long match. Given 9-8 then it would be a good match. I seriously doubt he wants to play either guy even, but I could be wrong. If he has a backer of course he will get up there. One thing about Dennis, he will give it his best shot to win no matter what the game is.

You would think that after his two losses to Shane in the U.S. Open finals he wouldn't want to gamble with him. You would be wrong. Dennis will play Shane some Ten Ball in a heartbeat and Shane knows that. When it comes to money games Dennis may be the King and that includes Alex. Alex is in no hurry to tangle with Dennis, you can believe that. I think they both have a grudging respect for each other, but I know who has the bigger cajones.

There are other very good One Pocket players right here and one or more of them might get the backing they need to challenge Dennis. I suspect the next big match we see will feature one of them, someone like Justin Hall or Danny Smith. Dennis loves playing the BIG match, the bigger the better. You might see him giving weight to one of the high rollers in pool just to make a game. He knows the real money is in One Pocket so he's ready to make a game if asked.

 

[Black-Balled]

I am pretty excited to see who steps up for a dose of Dennis next.

Win or lose, he has set a very high bar, not for quality of play and the amount of sand in the box.

 

[Dave714]

The biggest difference between match one and match two as far as Dennis was concerned was the tighter table (4.25" pockets) used in the second match. He prefers it tough. He said the first table was too loose for him. He felt that gave Tony an advantage.

I will agree that Dennis may still be a 9-8 underdog (half a ball) against Shane or Alex at One Pocket. It doesn't sound like much but it is, especially in a long match. Given 9-8 then it would be a good match. I seriously doubt he wants to play either guy even, but I could be wrong. If he has a backer of course he will get up there. One thing about Dennis, he will give it his best shot to win no matter what the game is.

You would think that after his two losses to Shane in the U.S. Open finals he wouldn't want to gamble with him. You would be wrong. Dennis will play Shane some Ten Ball in a heartbeat and Shane knows that. When it comes to money games Dennis may be the King and that includes Alex. Alex is in no hurry to tangle with Dennis, you can believe that. I think they both have a grudging respect for each other, but I know who has the bigger cajones.

There are other very good One Pocket players right here and one or more of them might get the backing they need to challenge Dennis. I suspect the next big match we see will feature one of them, someone like Justin Hall or Danny Smith. Dennis loves playing the BIG match, the bigger the better. You might see him giving weight to one of the high rollers in pool just to make a game. He knows the real money is in One Pocket so he's ready to make a game if asked.

Jay when Dennis was being back by Pacquiao in the Philippines did Dennis ever lose and how big did some of the sets play for.

 

[jay helfert]

Jay when Dennis was being back by Pacquiao in the Philippines did Dennis ever lose and how big did some of the sets play for.

He may have lost once or twice but avenged those losses with multiple wins. A big set over there might have been the equivalent of 5-10K here. Manny and Dennis remain close friends, although now Manny has distanced himself from the gaming world entirely. I can remember when Manny owned a poker room/poolroom located in a high rise hotel/casino in Manila. Those were the days for high stakes pool back then (only maybe four or five years ago). Manny had some game as well, getting into several partners matches, usually taking Ronnie Alcano as a partner. I watched Efren and Rubelin take them off to the tune of ten grand one night. :wink:

 

[gxman]

Danny Smith seems like he loves 1p action. Maybe he'll try Dennis.

Did Danny lose to Darren Appleton maybe during those Fight Night 1p matches?

 

[Koop]

Did anyone else notice that Siming Chen played Albin Ouschan a race to 9 yesterday in the Eurotour/Austria Open?

The long-term expectation from Fargorate is she gets to the hill against Albin; in fact she lost 9 to 5.

Whatever you do, don't tell Rhea this.