CJ are you better than Hank Haney??

xianmacx

xianmacx

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hey CJ,

Just got done reading The Big Miss and Hank Haney mentioned you guys had worked together and exchanged golf/pool lessons.

Care to share any stories about your work together or golf in generat? If you had to compare your golf game to his pool game, who is better at their "second" sport?

Thanks for the continued contributions to this forum,
Ian
 
xianmacx said:
Hey CJ,

Just got done reading The Big Miss and Hank Haney mentioned you guys had worked together and exchanged golf/pool lessons.

Care to share any stories about your work together or golf in generat? If you had to compare your golf game to his pool game, who is better at their "second" sport?

Thanks for the continued contributions to this forum,
Ian
Click to expand...

Hard to compare my golf game to Hanks pool game cause I don't know who the gentleman is.

As far as my golf game, if it helps you determine, I can get through the clown mouth 90% of the time, but I'm even money at best getting by the windmill. :thumbup:
 
Pool, in a lot of ways is a miniature version of golf, especially involving......

xianmacx said:
Hey CJ,

Just got done reading The Big Miss and Hank Haney mentioned you guys had worked together and exchanged golf/pool lessons.

Care to share any stories about your work together or golf in generat? If you had to compare your golf game to his pool game, who is better at their "second" sport?

Thanks for the continued contributions to this forum,
Ian
Click to expand...

Yes, I had a deal with Hank Haney for two years (right before he started coaching Tiger Woods), he trained me in golf and I coached him at pocket billiards. I actually sold him a professional table to put in his house and met with Hank frequently to talk (and play) golf, pool and the vast similarities.

Pool, in a lot of ways is a miniature version of golf, especially involving approach angles, maximizing margin of error, paying position, course/table management, using spins to increase target angles, backs-wing and follow through formulas, playing under pressure, physical training for specific muscle groups, diet, and when to eat before playing, mental techniques to lower brain waves, breathing techniques to go into "the zone", "working" the ball with "fade" and "draw" - which is like the TOI technique in pool.


At some point we may do a show, video or book together on the subject, in the mean time I'd be happy to share details of any of these similarities in hopes that improves your pool game. Sometimes, if you're stuck at a level of play you simply need to hear something in a different way.

Words provide different trigger depending on your background and life experiences. If someone plays golf well, a bridge of learning can be built to pool, the same bridge can connect to most anything, fishing, hunting, bowling, tennis, music, art, poker, etc. This is a very effective way to learn at an accelerated rate 'Life's Activities are the Teacher'
 
Golf and pool have a ton of similarities. I played pool before taking on golf, but I was not in tune with "carry over" at that time at a conscious level. CJ, if you got something together with Hank, that would be great to witness. I was a plus 2 ten years ago, but life turned, so I got to a minus 12 in pool instead ;) .

Played Merion Golf Club 2 weeks ago (site of the 2013 US Open, Ardmore, PA) - it made Kiawah's Ocean Course look like a walk in the park. A good walk spoiled.

Anyway, I think Hank could give CJ 3 a side, and CJ could give Hank the orange crush. :grin-square:
 
CJ Wiley said:
Yes, I had a deal with Hank Haney for two years (right before he started coaching Tiger Woods), he trained me in golf and I coached him at pocket billiards. I actually sold him a professional table to put in his house and met with Hank frequently to talk (and play) golf, pool and the vast similarities.

Pool, in a lot of ways is a miniature version of golf,
Click to expand...

Wait a second.

I thought miniature golf was the miniature version of golf. And bumper pool to regular pool is what miniature golf is to regular golf.

So bumper pool would be a miniature version of golf not regular pool.

My logic is irrefutable.
 
I play a lot of Guitar. I was watching a guitar player (Tom Emanuael) just last night and he spoke of this one point that I thought had great meaning. Guitar is one of the most confounding instruments that one could ever imagine. You pick it up sometimes and play it like you were born into the instument--there's nothing you can't do or imagine that can't be done. The very next day you can pick up the same instrument and you can fall flat on your face and think to yourself that your a complete Moron--Hmmmm:)
 
Bumper Pool is the miniature version of Miniature Golf.

hang-the-9 said:
Wait a second.

I thought miniature golf was the miniature version of golf. And bumper pool to regular pool is what miniature golf is to regular golf.

So bumper pool would be a miniature version of golf not regular pool.

My logic is irrefutable.
Click to expand...

Bumper Pool is the miniature version of Miniature Golf.....Pocket Billiards is the miniature version of Regular Golf. imho ;)
 
CJ Wiley said:
Bumper Pool is the miniature version of Miniature Golf.....Pocket Billiards is the miniature version of Regular Golf. imho ;)
Click to expand...

So you're saying pool is miniature golf... is snooker regular golf? Or a miniature version of golf which will make pool a miniature version of a miniature version of golf? Thus making Bumper Pool almost microscopic.


I bet after this thread, the readers of AZB will hate hearing, reading or saying the word "miniature".
 
Chip Roberson said:
I play a lot of Guitar. I was watching a guitar player (Tom Emanuael) just last night and he spoke of this one point that I thought had great meaning. Guitar is one of the most confounding instruments that one could ever imagine. You pick it up sometimes and play it like you were born into the instument--there's nothing you can't do or imagine that can't be done. The very next day you can pick up the same instrument and you can fall flat on your face and think to yourself that your a complete Moron--Hmmmm:)
Click to expand...

Tommy is my favorite guitarist too; okay, he's my hero.

For those not familiar with guitarist Tommy Emmanuel, watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wo8U20LicdU

Very much like SVB, he's an example of what passion and practice can accomplish.

Speaking of acronyms, my other favorite was SRV.
 
I sat on a piano bench once beside a well known conductor who also loved snooker.
We talked about music theory and hitting the keys and the similarity to hitting a cue-ball.
.....it seems to me that EVERYTHING is connected...your advancement in any discipline
will help you at whatever you do.

At the end of our conversation, I said "Can you imagine people in your field talking like
pool players.....like in ....Hey, George, you couldn't conduct electricity."
He laughed and said "That's why I like you pool players."
 
Tommy is a Certified Guitar Player--only 3 in the world have that title--bestowed upon him, and the other 2 by Chet Atkins--and that gent would know one fer sure
 
CJ Wiley said:
At some point we may do a show, video or book together on the subject, in the mean time I'd be happy to share details of any of these similarities in hopes that improves your pool game. Sometimes, if you're stuck at a level of play you simply need to hear something in a different way.
Click to expand...

CJ,

I know exactly what you are saying about 'simply need to hear something in a different way.'

I bought your last DVD and it helped me in just that sort of way. It made me look at my game in a different way. I didn't incorporate everything you said in the videos but have approached my pre-shot routine a bit differently and it has definitely helped. It's kind of funny how the brain works out solutions; subtle changes can have a big impact.

It was like I already knew what I needed to do but could not figure out how to get there.
 
I know I'm better than Hank Haney at a lot of things. I'll bet CJ is better than Hank at teaching pool but not at teaching golf.

Is a postage stamp better than a can opener? Yes, if you need to mail a letter. Maybe not if you need to open a can.
 
.any type of performance shows the outer world what's happening in the inner world

pt109 said:
I sat on a piano bench once beside a well known conductor who also loved snooker.
We talked about music theory and hitting the keys and the similarity to hitting a cue-ball.
.....it seems to me that EVERYTHING is connected...your advancement in any discipline
will help you at whatever you do.

At the end of our conversation, I said "Can you imagine people in your field talking like
pool players.....like in ....Hey, George, you couldn't conduct electricity."
He laughed and said "That's why I like you pool players."
Click to expand...

We had a piano growing up and being from a small town I had plenty of time to practice. I put scotch tape on the keys with the letters of the notes and taught myself to read music. After a few years I had the opportunity to play in some classical contests and for the school jazz band.

There's actually a connection between pool and the piano and I, personally have always considered pool an "art form" rather than a sport or game. I've talked to many of the top players through the years and they all seem to believe pool was a way to express themselves....any type of performance shows the "outer world" what's happening in the "inner world," much like art and music does. "All the world's a stage"......made up of a variety of art forms.
 
The Subconscious Level - this level is where "the Zone" is aka: "Dead Stroke"

BigDeal52 said:
CJ,

I know exactly what you are saying about 'simply need to hear something in a different way.'

I bought your last DVD and it helped me in just that sort of way.
It was like I already knew what I needed to do but could not figure out how to get there.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Yes, we teach on the subconscious level, after all there's three levels to learning pocket billiards.

1) The Surface Level - this level all players can see and understand
2) The Deep Level - this can only be seen and understood by experienced players
3) The Subconscious Level - this level is where "the Zone" is aka: "Dead Stroke" and is triggered by the part of the mind that controls Touch, Creativity and Alpha Thinking.

Anyone that's ever run a rack has all the tools needed, they just don't quite connect mental to physical skills - like a fireplace that's died down, it just needs someone to "stir" it up to get it blazing...that is our job......the game is the teacher.
 
CJ Wiley said:
....There's actually a connection between pool and the piano
Click to expand...

good God - yáll must have been eating BFDLAD's chili yesterday! and only CJ could factor pool down to the equivalent of a keyboard....

i will add this, CJ - i can beat it out on my piano, and i can crack balls across the table, when necessary. not sure it's an "art" @ this state of mind?

(perhaps golf has the same release?)
 
The game is played with the hands so learn the best technique possible

xianmacx said:
Hey CJ,

Just got done reading The Big Miss and Hank Haney mentioned you guys had worked together and exchanged golf/pool lessons.

Care to share any stories about your work together or golf in generat? If you had to compare your golf game to his pool game, who is better at their "second" sport?

Thanks for the continued contributions to this forum,
Ian
Click to expand...

Yes, in Hank's book he describes when we were working together he was making most of the "hard" shots and missing some of the "easy" ones.

I told Hank "when I started playing championship speed I had to come to the conclusion that there were no "hard" shots and there were no "easy" shots....they were all just "shots" and I had to find a way to make them all the same".

I had developed a game that I could use approxemately the same "shot speed," the same "cue ball target" (TOI), and the same alignment system to create all the necessary angles. Combined with my 'Ultimate Aiming System' I had the most effective way to treat all shots the same. You see, they aren't naturally alike, it's up to us to make them that way

Later I'll tell more of the story that Hank mentions in the book about how he used this with Tiger Woods, and how Tiger used it to apply directly to golf.

Pool is much easier learned if you already do something well. I have a friend/student that bridged his talent for carpentry to pool and got amazingly quick results. Of course the "Hammer Stroke" was natural for him and within a few days the new wrist release was enabling him to play much better pool.

The game is played with the hands so if you want to accelerate your learning make sure you know the best way to use your wrist/fingers/forearm to make the cue go straight (in a groove/slot) every time.
 
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