Cleaning or Polishing Balls

I think Brian is right about the mucking up factor with carpet material........the Aramith polish easily rubs off the surface of the balls and re-deposits on the carpet fibers accumulating over time I imagine......I have a Ballstar machine and the pads and made differently. In fact, I still have the replacement pad that came with the Ballstar machine and after 4 years, I haven't had to replace the original pad and it's been used a lot. If the pad was more carpet like, I never could have done this and would definitely avoid using Aramith on the balls being cleaned.

Matt B.
 
Dan White said:
Dale - I kind of know you are making a joke, but it isn't fair to say that just because the company makes the balls, that their cleaner is not better than plain soap. I mean, what makes you say that Ivory soap is so great? Have you tested the throw results when using soap, for instance?

For the money, you aren't going to do much better than Aramith. Only a little drop is necessary and the bottle will last a very long time. so why not use it?
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Dan, actually, I was as serious as heart failure.

My feeling to not use polish or anything to make the balls shine is because it leaves a film on the balls.
The film makes the balls play 'differently'. Specifically how different depends on which
product, how much, etc

Ivory soap because it is milder than dish washing detergent - and, any film can easily
be removed with clean water and a towel. Any mild, true soap would be fine, but
Ivory is widely available in the liquid version.

HTH
Dale
 
pdcue said:
Dan, actually, I was as serious as heart failure.

My feeling to not use polish or anything to make the balls shine is because it leaves a film on the balls.
The film makes the balls play 'differently'. Specifically how different depends on which
product, how much, etc

Ivory soap because it is milder than dish washing detergent - and, any film can easily
be removed with clean water and a towel. Any mild, true soap would be fine, but
Ivory is widely available in the liquid version.

HTH
Dale
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We are in agreement, then. The Aramith product is a cleaner not a polish or wax. It leaves no residue as my throw experiment would suggest. Soap is good for dishes. I don't know what the throw characteristics are when using soap.
 
Dan White said:
We are in agreement, then. The Aramith product is a cleaner not a polish or wax. It leaves no residue as my throw experiment would suggest. Soap is good for dishes. I don't know what the throw characteristics are when using soap.
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Cleaning with soap and water has no effect on the throw effect.

HTH
Dale
 
pdcue said:
Cleaning with soap and water has no effect on the throw effect.

HTH
Dale
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I'll take your word for it. I didn't realize Novus had a dramatic effect on throw until I tested it under controlled conditions. I haven't seen that done with soap and water, but it would make sense that throw wouldn't change from one shot to the next with soap and water since you aren't leaving a film on the ball.
 
Dan White said:
I followed up on Dr. Dave's video on ball throw with different cleaners. I found that if you use Novus, probably not that different from any wax or car polish, the throw characteristics change dramatically in a short time. I found with Novus that the ball initially threw about 1" over 6 diamonds and after only 15 or 20 shots the same ball was throwing over 4". On the other hand, if you use Aramith cleaner, which is specifically made to clean pool balls, the throw was the same for shot 1 as it was for shot 30, about 4 or 5 inches (don't recall the exact throw, but they all threw the same).

IMO, use car waxes for cars, use billiard ball cleaners for billiard balls. Your own experience is a good example.
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None of the Novus products contain wax. The Aramith Ball Cleaner, however, does have wax in it. Here are links to the MSDS of both products.


Aramith - https://na.suzohapp.com/msds_sheets/29-0352-00.pdf

Novus 1 - https://www.novuspolish.com/pdf/PP No 1 SDS USA CAN Jan 2015.pdf

Novus 2 - https://www.novuspolish.com/pdf/PP No 2 SDS USA CAN Feb 2015.pdf

Novus 3 - https://www.novuspolish.com/pdf/PP No 3 SDS USA EU CAN Jun 2014.pdf

In my experience (strictly hand cleaning) the Aramith cleaner leaves a coating that chalk sticks to quite firmly. It is hard to remove by hand without using more cleaner (but maybe a machine cleaner has better luck). Chalk also sticks to the Novus treated balls, but it wipes off fairly easily with a dry cloth.

FWIW the Novus 1 and 2 contain a small amount (about 7%) of polydimethylsiloxane, which is found in some silicone sprays. This may be what is responsible for producing such an initially low amount of throw. It may also be why chalk doesn't stick well to ball cleaned with it.
 
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I have a Diamond ball cleaner machine and the only carpet insert that is easily removable is the one that goes all the way around the edge and that is velcroed in place. The center insert carpet piece and the round bottom carpet piece that spins are both glued on. How are you supposed to remove and wash them?
 
BogeyFree said:
I have a Diamond ball cleaner machine and the only carpet insert that is easily removable is the one that goes all the way around the edge and that is velcroed in place. The center insert carpet piece and the round bottom carpet piece that spins are both glued on. How are you supposed to remove and wash them?
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The carpeted Diamond polisher center insert is easily cleaned with a wet wash cloth, fingers and a little elbow grease in each of the cut-out areas. Literally takes less than 2 minutes to clean it almost back to new condition IF you don't let it get "mucked" up and nasty between cleanings. I clean the removable outside ring carpet the same way. Let them dry overnight and good as new. I have multiple center sections labeled for polishing vs restoring so the Aramith compounds at least stay on the same areas. Same for the pit used carpet. You can get spare ones through Diamond of course - cheaply I might add.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Dan White said:
We are in agreement, then. The Aramith product is a cleaner not a polish or wax. It leaves no residue as my throw experiment would suggest. Soap is good for dishes. I don't know what the throw characteristics are when using soap.
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I am more than happy when using the Aramith ball cleaner. I have no idea how it affects throw but how much does it really matter? If you play in tournaments or league you probably play at a variety of locations and they probably do not all clean their balls the same using the same products. Throw is something you will just need to adjust to anyway. What I like about the Aramith cleaner is that when the balls come out of my polisher they feel the same as when the balls were new out of the box. If I were to use wax I can state for a fact that the balls would be considerately more slippery when handling them. I keep all of my sets in nice condition, I have not tried dropping them in the polisher without the ball cleaner yet, I may try it. When I clean them I usually put 1 drop on every other ball or 1 drop on 2 balls 180 degrees apart.
 
the rules

It seems that using wax is introducing a variable. Not a good idea.

WPA Tournament Table & Equipment Specifications

(Effective November 2001 )
16. Balls and Ball Rack
All balls must be composed of cast phenolic resin plastic and measure 2 ¼ (+.005) inches [5.715 cm (+ .127 mm)] in diameter and weigh 5 ½ to 6 oz [156 to 170 gms]. Balls should be unpolished, and should also not be waxed. Balls should be cleaned with a towel or cloth free of dirt and dust, and may also be washed with soap and water. Balls contaminated with any slippery substance - treated with a polishing or rubbing compound and/or waxed - must be cleansed and dewaxed with a clean cloth moistened with diluted alcohol before play.
 
I think using car products on pool balls is a mistake unless you don't care how much they throw and how much that throw changes during play. If throw is not part of your game, then feel free.

I recommend Aramith polish or an equivalent. I like to rinse the balls with plain water after polishing to make sure any residue is gone and then rub dry with a towel. The polish does restore scuffed spots on the surface of the balls.
 
Dave said:
It seems that using wax is introducing a variable. Not a good idea.

WPA Tournament Table & Equipment Specifications

(Effective November 2001 )
16. Balls and Ball Rack
All balls must be composed of cast phenolic resin plastic and measure 2 ¼ (+.005) inches [5.715 cm (+ .127 mm)] in diameter and weigh 5 ½ to 6 oz [156 to 170 gms]. Balls should be unpolished, and should also not be waxed. Balls should be cleaned with a towel or cloth free of dirt and dust, and may also be washed with soap and water. Balls contaminated with any slippery substance - treated with a polishing or rubbing compound and/or waxed - must be cleansed and dewaxed with a clean cloth moistened with diluted alcohol before play.
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Well, there you go. You cannot use Aramith ball cleaner without using a rag moistened with diluted alcohol to remove the residue.

Again, from Saluc's MSDS:

COMPOSITION / INFORMATION ON INGREDIENTS
2.1 Description: Emulsion, suspension of wax and aliphatic solvents with mineral abrasives 2.2 Composition: Petroleum distillate (hydroprocessed) 4%; Xn; R65
Monocyclic terpene 4%; Xi; R38
Fatty alcohol ethoxylated; 2.5%; R36/38 Other components: not dangerous classified
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Aramith ball cleaner is an emulsion composed of wax, solvents, and abrasives (polishing/rubbing compounds). There is no magic about it, just a proprietary mixture of commonly available compounds, none of which has any place on the surface of a billiard ball.

I'm taking Dale's advise and switching to Ivory soap. 99 and 44/100ths percent pure. What more could you ask for in a cleaner. ;)
 
Bob Jewett said:
I could ask it to restore the scuffed surface of the ball to its pre-scuffed state.
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Well, that's what the Aramith ball restorer is for, isn't it? Use it and then rinse off the residue with a mild soap (not a detergent) to my way of thinking.

The point is that the Aramith cleaner does contain wax, a substance that is against the rules (and isn't such a good idea anyway). Do you believe it's some special kind of wax that was formulated just for phenolic billiard balls? I don't. It's 99.9% likely that it's just plain old cheap carnauba... which is automobile wax.
 
I use the Aramth cleaner, but if you want to try another option, pick up some motorcycle clear plastic windshield cleaner. Its made for clear plastic and wont leave a film.

You can buy a plastic spray bottle for a buck or two at home depot and cut the aramith cleaner with a little water. Spray it on the balls and it wont build up on your ball cleaner like it would otherwise.
 
Dan White said:
I followed up on Dr. Dave's video on ball throw with different cleaners. I found that if you use Novus, probably not that different from any wax or car polish, the throw characteristics change dramatically in a short time. I found with Novus that the ball initially threw about 1" over 6 diamonds and after only 15 or 20 shots the same ball was throwing over 4". On the other hand, if you use Aramith cleaner, which is specifically made to clean pool balls, the throw was the same for shot 1 as it was for shot 30, about 4 or 5 inches (don't recall the exact throw, but they all threw the same).

IMO, use car waxes for cars, use billiard ball cleaners for billiard balls. Your own experience is a good example.
Click to expand...
Good post. For those interested in the video and follow-up articles dealing with the effects of different cleaning and polishing products, here they are:

NV D.16 - Pool ball cut-induced throw and cling/skid/kick experiment
"Throw Follow-up: Part I: Cling" (BD, July, 2014).
"Throw Follow-up: Part II: More Results" (BD, August, 2014).

Enjoy,
Dave
 
I had considered the Aramith ball cleaner the holy grail... oh well....? now what?
Thanks for finding the MSDS sheet Mr Pockets. It is curious that Saluc, the premier manufacturer of balls and the sponsor supplying their name and balls to just about all tournaments, sells a product that is clearly not within the rules.
I love my home made bucket ball cleaner, in which I've used Brillianize for years.
I knew it left something on the balls, but seemed pretty neutral... at least for my playing.
I've tried to figure this ornery cleaning problem out. The ideal would be to be able to use some liquid cleaner in the bucket and be done with it... not have to clean and then remove the cleaner with a more neutral product. Thanks for kicking this around.

Additionally, my guess [ yes, guess] is Saluc's cleaner is nothing proprietary... an off the shelf product that meets their specifications.
Hummmm.... 55 gallon drum..... @ $1/oz retail.. hummm ... there's good margin there, my man!... book it, bill it, SHIP IT!
 
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