Code Of Conduct
- Thread starter JoeyA
- Start date
I'm Never Too Busy To Help Someone
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22eWXsqeOY8
Doug
(I once ran 100M, well, I ran a foot each day for a year......same difference) imo
.
Casey said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22eWXsqeOY8
Doug
(I once ran 100M, well, I ran a foot each day for a year......same difference) imo
.
Smorgass Bored said:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22eWXsqeOY8
Doug
(I once ran 100M, well, I ran a foot each day for a year......same difference) imo
.
Thanks for the info.
Great work. I think that you have started something that is needed to develop a truly viable sport. My suggestions are more about tone and setting out wide guidlines that could be used to identify who is an is not a true professional. My suggestions are nothing more than a quick example of a style that may be conducive to a code that nearly everyone could agree with and yet would serve as a reference to evaluate another's behavior.
A written code of conduct is a statement of the principals, values and standards that are followed by a group in the interest of that group. It represents what the groups believes. I would only change the tone to reflect a description of a professional player that one can aspire to live up to. Over time such a description becomes the standard. In this sense I might re-write something along the lines:
A professional pocket billiards player believes in good sportsmanship. The professional encourages behaviors that respect the value and integrity of all players, their opponents, the equipment and the fans. Professional players will not engage in underhanded tactics and will bring such matters to light as needed to protect the integrity of the sport.
A professional player is a representative of the sport and is at all times well dressed, approachable and willing to interact with anyone who seeks additional information about the sport.
Professional player values and encourage younger players to become involved. They are actively involved in free clinics for young people and often give freely of their time to encourage young people to become involved in the sport of pocket billiards.
Specifics about such things as standards of dress for various events could be relegated to an appendix where examples can be given of "best practices."
A written code of conduct is a statement of the principals, values and standards that are followed by a group in the interest of that group. It represents what the groups believes. I would only change the tone to reflect a description of a professional player that one can aspire to live up to. Over time such a description becomes the standard. In this sense I might re-write something along the lines:
A professional pocket billiards player believes in good sportsmanship. The professional encourages behaviors that respect the value and integrity of all players, their opponents, the equipment and the fans. Professional players will not engage in underhanded tactics and will bring such matters to light as needed to protect the integrity of the sport.
A professional player is a representative of the sport and is at all times well dressed, approachable and willing to interact with anyone who seeks additional information about the sport.
Professional player values and encourage younger players to become involved. They are actively involved in free clinics for young people and often give freely of their time to encourage young people to become involved in the sport of pocket billiards.
Specifics about such things as standards of dress for various events could be relegated to an appendix where examples can be given of "best practices."
Last edited:
Time for updates
It is now 5 months since JoeyA and I published the COC.
During this time it has been seen by literally 100s of people - pro players,
amateurs, fans both of our game or other sports. The reaction has been extremely positive and now it is time to consider some of the suggestions to update the COC.
I will be contacting Joey when he returns from his expedition next week. This is your chance to read through it again and see if you can improve it or add something.
Doug Gordon
It is now 5 months since JoeyA and I published the COC.
During this time it has been seen by literally 100s of people - pro players,
amateurs, fans both of our game or other sports. The reaction has been extremely positive and now it is time to consider some of the suggestions to update the COC.
I will be contacting Joey when he returns from his expedition next week. This is your chance to read through it again and see if you can improve it or add something.
Doug Gordon
I'd been away from the forum and missed this, but I'm glad something like this was drawn up. More professionalism from the players will add legitimacy to the sport, which still suffers from an image problem. There's something wrong when I've had this exact conversation with a half dozen people:
[them] So what do you like do do?
[me] Well I play a lot of pool.
[them] oh, haha, so are you a hustler?
Sometimes they substitute "shark" for hustler. Occasionally they'll say "oh, so do you play in tournaments and stuff?" which I think is a much better response... a more polite way of saying 'are you any good?'.
We've got to get it out of people's heads that the typical shooter is the old guy with a cigarette dangling out of his mouth who who tries to trick people out of cash, or the loudmouth trashtalking kid.
That being said, I think something like this has to find a line between regulations for how a pro handles himself on the table and how he acts off the table.
It's fair to have certain expectations of a player at an event, because if you fail to meet those expectations it can be disruptive to play... it can shark the opponent, it can delay this game and any following matches, and it can generally cause upset or even controversy. So no objections to expecting someone to be clean, presentable, punctual and polite.
But it's not our place to tell people how to live their lives or act in general, we should limit it to the areas where it makes sense in terms of keeping an event 'professional and well-run' and go no further. For example I would not tell the player that it's part of his general code of conduct to walk up to and talk to amateurs, or accept their dinner invitations. If Mika Immonen never does anything to bother his opponent, doesn't smile, and goes straight home after a loss without stopping to talk to the fans or sign autographs, can you (and would you) say he's violated these rules? If Ralf Souquet is an otherwise excellent human being but refuses to teach amateurs, and charges 100 euro for everyone else, did he really do anything wrong?
I see my time away from the table is mine, and if I am by nature a solitary type and prefer to eat alone, I should be free to do so without feeling like I'm violating either the letter or the spirit of this code. If I am otherwise polite and reserved and do nothing specific to outrage anyone, then I have done my job as an ambassador of pool, and anything above and beyond that is really the player's business.
Also my choice is who I gamble with. There's no easy way to measure how amateur is 'amateur enough' to be over the line. I can't imagine fining a player because he beat a starstruck kid... because maybe the kid was willing to blow 50 bucks just for the opportunity to play with a legend. If he goes in knowing the odds, there's no reason two consenting players can't make a game. Especially one where the right amount of weight gives the amateur a real chance to brag to his friends that he beat a pro. There are many ways an amateur can wager with a pro and be the richer for it (even if he loses he can get a cheap lesson).
----
It's not that stuff like donating time to encourage amateurs is wrong, it's just wrong for this particular document. Those issues should be addressed in an article or an open letter or an editorial in a magazine. But the goal for this specific document should be to make rules that are concrete and enforceable. The tone should not be one that says 'here's how I think you should live your life as a pro' or 'I expect you to be a good, sociable, and all around upstanding human being if you're going to be in my event'. If you want something that has legitimacy it cannot sound like it's soapbox-y or has an agenda. It should simply be a cut-and-dried statement of facts:
"here are a list of very specific rules that will be enforced and requirements that you must abide by. Please follow them at all events or you risk sanctions."
[them] So what do you like do do?
[me] Well I play a lot of pool.
[them] oh, haha, so are you a hustler?
Sometimes they substitute "shark" for hustler. Occasionally they'll say "oh, so do you play in tournaments and stuff?" which I think is a much better response... a more polite way of saying 'are you any good?'.
We've got to get it out of people's heads that the typical shooter is the old guy with a cigarette dangling out of his mouth who who tries to trick people out of cash, or the loudmouth trashtalking kid.
That being said, I think something like this has to find a line between regulations for how a pro handles himself on the table and how he acts off the table.
It's fair to have certain expectations of a player at an event, because if you fail to meet those expectations it can be disruptive to play... it can shark the opponent, it can delay this game and any following matches, and it can generally cause upset or even controversy. So no objections to expecting someone to be clean, presentable, punctual and polite.
But it's not our place to tell people how to live their lives or act in general, we should limit it to the areas where it makes sense in terms of keeping an event 'professional and well-run' and go no further. For example I would not tell the player that it's part of his general code of conduct to walk up to and talk to amateurs, or accept their dinner invitations. If Mika Immonen never does anything to bother his opponent, doesn't smile, and goes straight home after a loss without stopping to talk to the fans or sign autographs, can you (and would you) say he's violated these rules? If Ralf Souquet is an otherwise excellent human being but refuses to teach amateurs, and charges 100 euro for everyone else, did he really do anything wrong?
I see my time away from the table is mine, and if I am by nature a solitary type and prefer to eat alone, I should be free to do so without feeling like I'm violating either the letter or the spirit of this code. If I am otherwise polite and reserved and do nothing specific to outrage anyone, then I have done my job as an ambassador of pool, and anything above and beyond that is really the player's business.
Also my choice is who I gamble with. There's no easy way to measure how amateur is 'amateur enough' to be over the line. I can't imagine fining a player because he beat a starstruck kid... because maybe the kid was willing to blow 50 bucks just for the opportunity to play with a legend. If he goes in knowing the odds, there's no reason two consenting players can't make a game. Especially one where the right amount of weight gives the amateur a real chance to brag to his friends that he beat a pro. There are many ways an amateur can wager with a pro and be the richer for it (even if he loses he can get a cheap lesson).
----
It's not that stuff like donating time to encourage amateurs is wrong, it's just wrong for this particular document. Those issues should be addressed in an article or an open letter or an editorial in a magazine. But the goal for this specific document should be to make rules that are concrete and enforceable. The tone should not be one that says 'here's how I think you should live your life as a pro' or 'I expect you to be a good, sociable, and all around upstanding human being if you're going to be in my event'. If you want something that has legitimacy it cannot sound like it's soapbox-y or has an agenda. It should simply be a cut-and-dried statement of facts:
"here are a list of very specific rules that will be enforced and requirements that you must abide by. Please follow them at all events or you risk sanctions."
CJ's Secret Comment
In Pool Gambling (and Life in General) - Money MUST Always be the RESULT, Not the INCENTIVE - So Always "Strive" to Uncover the PERFECTION that Already Exists in the Game". C J Wiley www.cjwiley.com
In Pool Gambling (and Life in General) - Money MUST Always be the RESULT, Not the INCENTIVE - So Always "Strive" to Uncover the PERFECTION that Already Exists in the Game". C J Wiley www.cjwiley.com
In the thread "Pro Pool in America", Jerry Forsythe asked the forum members to make suggestions to express positive ideas for assisting the growth of professional pool in America.
I suggested that a way to do this is to have a written set of conduct guidelines for professional pool players to adhere to. Mike Janis suggested that I could be one who might be able to write it.
In thinking about it, I realized some of the contributions that are made by all of our members all over the world and enlisted the assistance of Doug Gordon who is on the other side of the "pond". Doug has made many contributions to pool over the years and is respected by many. I liked his writing style, his humor, his intelligence and we all know how prim and proper the English can be.I felt the CODE OF CONDUCT for Professional Pool Players should have an international perspective and Doug has made a fine collaboration with me and I am honored to have had him work on this project.
Doug is on his way over to the U.S. to witness his grandson's graduation at this time, so if you see him be sure and express your sentiments on our collaboration.
The CODE OF CONDUCT for Professional Pool Players has been written by Doug and I as a contribution to the entire pool world. We hope that the AZ Main forum members will read the BETA VERSION of the Code of Conduct which is in a Word Document format attached to this thread, think about it some and offer suggestions as to how it could be improved. Please be concise with your suggestions.
Doug and I will read and consider all of your perspectives. We do not want to lengthen it very much but if you have some suggestions, please feel free to express them in this thread.
Thanks again for your time and consideration!
Sincerely,
Joey Aguzin & Doug Gordon
View attachment 68763
Nice words, CJ. Thanks for signing in.
Wow! That is, without a doubt, one of "the" best pool websites I have ever seen. Well done. I look forward to more of your posts.
Here's my C.J. picture, depicted on the left, posing with KM.
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pearlcabrezos
New member
Playing pool has a very narrow scope of fans but the best ways to promote pool is to keep the fans wanting more i guess..
A Code Of Conduct is a great idea and what you have is a good one but what needs to happen first is a travel friendly tournament calendar. Have them so that its easier for the pool players and fans to make it to them. Not one in California then the next in Georgia then the next in Vegas then South Carolina make them so its easy to travel from one to the next.
Nice Idea....
You are absolutely correct. I have asked several people in the business to create a database for pool tournaments which anyone could use to search the database by specific data. Like most things, a good one, cost money and then you need money/person power to maintain it.
I always envisioned one database which would be open to tournament promoters and they would be issued an ID to access the database and would only be able to alter their information. Visitors could search by Date, Geography, Added Money, Discipline, Table Size et cetera.
Then the next big job is to get the promoters to realize that this is THEIR tool to make pool bigger and better. A searchable calendar for pool events already listed would make promoters job a lot better if everyone was on the same page.
JoeyA
You are absolutely correct. I have asked several people in the business to create a database for pool tournaments which anyone could use to search the database by specific data. Like most things, a good one, cost money and then you need money/person power to maintain it.
I always envisioned one database which would be open to tournament promoters and they would be issued an ID to access the database and would only be able to alter their information. Visitors could search by Date, Geography, Added Money, Discipline, Table Size et cetera.
Then the next big job is to get the promoters to realize that this is THEIR tool to make pool bigger and better. A searchable calendar for pool events already listed would make promoters job a lot better if everyone was on the same page.
JoeyA
dress honorably
Shoot honorably
Be Honorable
show Respect
Reap what you sow
JoeyA... Thank you.
You get it, Doc! Thank you!
14:1 Player
150 n Out Billiards
Cudos to Doug & Joey. This is a great step to exactly what professional pool needs to adopt, as this is what will surely help in attracting high dollar sponsors and corporate America... look at NASCAR folks.