Do You Wish to Stake a Pro at Derby City?

[JAM]

40 percent is EXTREMELY generous. It was not so long ago that Keith was offered 20 percent to dance like a monkey while being filmed and the backer would get 80 percent.

It was insulting.

I do understand the purpose of the thread. Pool players, the ones who do it full-time, are broke dogs.:frown:

Yeah, I know, I know. They can flip burgers at McDonald's or sell hot dogs in the Big Apple.

I think that to attend the DCC, especially if you stay the entire week, it takes money to get there. I don't see anything wrong with the thread at all.

If a player were to come on here, like C.J. said, they would be put under a microscope by this forum. The forum would come to the conclusion that he's a dump artist, can't run two games in a row, got beat by Joe Blow, and is 10 percent Neanderthal. And then there's infamous James Walden thread. :embarrassed2:

As well, I am sure Greg Sullivan is hoping to get as many in attendance as possible. This is the pool mecca of the year for some. There's the One Pocket Hall of Fame Banquet, pool vendors, mini tournaments, big tournaments, and no mosquitoes in January. :grin-square:

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

This is an interesting concept that I, personally, don't like.

Getting into a blind bidding war for the chance to stake (gamble on / invest in) a player is wholly unappealing to me.

I'd be happy to stake certain players, but not in this format.

It appears some would, though. :wink:

best,
brian kc

 

[SJDinPHX]

Plus, some players would be embarrassed to come on here and ask for a stake as they fear being accused of looking for 'charity'. This way I can keep the whole deal confidential if that is what the parties wish or we can open someone up for bidding.

It is just something I felt AZB could do that could help some folks and I see no way it can harm anyone.

I applaud you for taking the initiative, Jerry..I don't understand all the negativity being displayed here. We (players and horses) are all big boys, and should know who we want to deal with, and who we'd rather not. If its kept on a somewhat private level, hopefully all the posting of needless opinions, (and knocking) would be held to a minimum !

The biggest plus, in your offering this service, is that a very large percentage of the player's who could be involved, are either computer illiterate, or for whatever reason, don't post here anyway ! The regular forum members could/should advise these players, as to what is now available.

It is a thankless task for you to undertake, and I darn sure don't see any harm in it either ! :thumbup:

 

[Jerry Forsyth]

First, this is just an idea to get a willing buyer and a willing seller together. Nothing more. And no, AZB is in no way responsible if either the buyer or seller gets burned as we are not making anything off of this and so have no reason to bear responsibility.

Next, this is obviously not for everybody, but I have five stakehorses now that did not exist before yesterday. I have told all of them that I personally would not do this unless I was at the DCC myself or knew the staked player personally. Of course I would not just mail money off to a stranger. Unless the stranger is the IRS.

To all of you who dislike this program, please feel free to come up with an idea of your own and post it here. Whether you like it or not pro pool players at the moment need financial assistance and we are just trying to help. So, chill!

 

[Fast Lenny]

First, this is just an idea to get a willing buyer and a willing seller together. Nothing more. And no, AZB is in no way responsible if either the buyer or seller gets burned as we are not making anything off of this and so have no reason to bear responsibility.

Next, this is obviously not for everybody, but I have five stakehorses now that did not exist before yesterday. I have told all of them that I personally would not do this unless I was at the DCC myself or knew the staked player personally. Of course I would not just mail money off to a stranger. Unless the stranger is the IRS.

To all of you who dislike this program, please feel free to come up with an idea of your own and post it here. Whether you like it or not pro pool players at the moment need financial assistance and we are just trying to help. So, chill!

I appreciate your efforts Jerry. There are certainly many players out there who could use some help.

 

[PETROBOY]

40 percent is EXTREMELY generous. It was not so long ago that Keith was offered 20 percent to dance like a monkey while being filmed and the backer would get 80 percent.

It was insulting.

I do understand the purpose of the thread. Pool players, the ones who do it full-time, are broke dogs.:frown:

Yeah, I know, I know. They can flip burgers at McDonald's or sell hot dogs in the Big Apple.

I think that to attend the DCC, especially if you stay the entire week, it takes money to get there. I don't see anything wrong with the thread at all.

If a player were to come on here, like C.J. said, they would be put under a microscope by this forum. The forum would come to the conclusion that he's a dump artist, can't run two games in a row, got beat by Joe Blow, and is 10 percent Neanderthal. And then there's infamous James Walden thread. :embarrassed2:

As well, I am sure Greg Sullivan is hoping to get as many in attendance as possible. This is the pool mecca of the year for some. There's the One Pocket Hall of Fame Banquet, pool vendors, mini tournaments, big tournaments, and no mosquitoes in January. :grin-square:

So why don't the players get a job flipping burgers? I never understood why they don't have jobs if pool payed more I could see it but it doesn't. There are Olympic athletes that have jobs and compete at very high levels why can't pool players?


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[SCCues]

I can't tell you how disgusted I am in reading this thread. That there's a need for it, among professional players, is so terribly disheartening.

The best hot dog vendors in the world are in NYC. The best ones are making $500K per year. The best skilled, at anything, shouldn't have to have "fans" pay their way.

I hear what you are saying and I'm sad that this is the state of Pro Pool. In any other sport I can think of Pro Players don't need their fans to pay expenses. I hope it changes one day soon.

 

[JAM]

So why don't the players get a job flipping burgers? I never understood why they don't have jobs if pool payed more I could see it but it doesn't. There are Olympic athletes that have jobs and compete at very high levels why can't pool players?


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Well, I guess if they got a job flipping burgers, then there soon would be no pro players left in the existing lot of American professional pool players. In order to compete at a high level, a professional pool player must hit THOUSANDS of balls every single day to keep in stroke. Unfortunately, the traditional 9-to-5 job, such as McDonald's, doesn't afford them enough time to keep their skills up shooting pool.

As well, most traditional employers, like McDonald's, will not give an employee time off several times a month to compete in various tournaments around the country, especially the week-long events like DCC.

When you speak of Olympic athletes, let's get real about this. Those Olympic athletes have sponsors (stakehorses), and believe it or not, most of them have their own specialty industry organization looking out for their interests. We used to have that with the BCA, but the BCA has orphaned professional pool from its existence. The industry members of the BCA prefer to get fat and watch professional pool die a slow and ugly death.

So there you have it. Next? :smile:

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

how about a separate forum (maybe a sub-forum of wanted / for sale) where players in need could match up with stakehorses who are interested in them. Open, transparent, like, for instance:

hello, I'm Joe Blow, I just won the XYZ State Amateur 9 Ball Championship and I'd love a shot at the ZYX Tourney coming up but need help with getting there and the entry fee. If someone can help I will get proper rest, play my hardest, and will give you, my backer, xx% of whatever I win.

or

hello, this is Joe Famous player and I am looking for anyone interested in staking me for the upcoming YXY Event where I think I have a great chance at taking it down. I have a place to stay there and can cover my meals, etc., but could use a hand with the travel ($xxx) and the $xxx entry fee. In return I am willing to do a XXyou/XXme split on all that I win.

or

hello, I am interested in staking one or two players in the upcoming US Open 9 ball in Chesapeake, VA. Upper to top tier pros are who I am after and am willing to cover their travel and entry fee. In exchange I will want XX% of what you win at the event.

maybe even have a rating system like iTrader specific to the members using this service. Maybe iStaker. :wink:

All of the business doesn't necessarily have to be out in the open, that's certainly optional.

An ad could simply read:

I'm looking for a backer for the upcoming ZZZ Tourney. Anyone interested, please contact me so we can discuss details and see if we can become partners.

best,
brian kc

 

[decent dennis]

Well, I guess if they got a job flipping burgers, then there soon would be no pro players left in the existing lot of American professional pool players. In order to compete at a high level, a professional pool player must hit THOUSANDS of balls every single day to keep in stroke. Unfortunately, the traditional 9-to-5 job, such as McDonald's, doesn't afford them enough time to keep their skills up shooting pool.

As well, most traditional employers, like McDonald's, will not give an employee time off several times a month to compete in various tournaments around the country, especially the week-long events like DCC.

When you speak of Olympic athletes, let's get real about this. Those Olympic athletes have sponsors (stakehorses), and believe it or not, most of them have their own specialty industry organization looking out for their interests. We used to have that with the BCA, but the BCA has orphaned professional pool from its existence. The industry members of the BCA prefer to get fat and watch professional pool die a slow and ugly death.

So there you have it. Next? :smile:

Next. Harry Connic Jr, plastic surgery. Yes or no.

 

[PETROBOY]

Well, I guess if they got a job flipping burgers, then there soon would be no pro players left in the existing lot of American professional pool players. In order to compete at a high level, a professional pool player must hit THOUSANDS of balls every single day to keep in stroke. Unfortunately, the traditional 9-to-5 job, such as McDonald's, doesn't afford them enough time to keep their skills up shooting pool.

As well, most traditional employers, like McDonald's, will not give an employee time off several times a month to compete in various tournaments around the country, especially the week-long events like DCC.

When you speak of Olympic athletes, let's get real about this. Those Olympic athletes have sponsors (stakehorses), and believe it or not, most of them have their own specialty industry organization looking out for their interests. We used to have that with the BCA, but the BCA has orphaned professional pool from its existence. The industry members of the BCA prefer to get fat and watch professional pool die a slow and ugly death.

So there you have it. Next? :smile:

What's the point of hitting thousands of balls as you say if you can't afford to go anywhere and play? Those Olympians do have sponsors but they still have full time jobs.


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[Joe T]

To all of you who dislike this program, please feel free to come up with an idea of your own and post it here. Whether you like it or not pro pool players at the moment need financial assistance and we are just trying to help. So, chill!

I don't dislike the program and hope some players do get help. And I too applaud your effort.

We did come up with and post an idea that I hope you'll suggest to the players that are looking to get staked. It really is a chance for them to help themselves and pool at the same time.

 

[JAM]

What's the point of hitting thousands of balls as you say if you can't afford to go anywhere and play? Those Olympians do have sponsors but they still have full time jobs.


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You should join the BCA. I think your philosophy would complement the members there. :smile:

Let's just do away with the professional pool world. Then we can all live happily ever after, right?

Unless you walk in the shoes of a professional player, don't knock them, because you don't totally understand what it's all about. You are on the outside looking in.

 

[West Point 1987]

Well, I guess if they got a job flipping burgers, then there soon would be no pro players left in the existing lot of American professional pool players. In order to compete at a high level, a professional pool player must hit THOUSANDS of balls every single day to keep in stroke. Unfortunately, the traditional 9-to-5 job, such as McDonald's, doesn't afford them enough time to keep their skills up shooting pool.

As well, most traditional employers, like McDonald's, will not give an employee time off several times a month to compete in various tournaments around the country, especially the week-long events like DCC.

When you speak of Olympic athletes, let's get real about this. Those Olympic athletes have sponsors (stakehorses), and believe it or not, most of them have their own specialty industry organization looking out for their interests. We used to have that with the BCA, but the BCA has orphaned professional pool from its existence. The industry members of the BCA prefer to get fat and watch professional pool die a slow and ugly death.

So there you have it. Next? :smile:

Jen, I gotta disagree...there have been a great number of players that had day jobs yet still managed to have very successful pool careers...Irving Crane sold cars full time and practiced during his lunch hour and after work, for example. Joe Balsis was a butcher... Let's not get carried away here...a talented pro player can succeed while being gainfully employed, they just have to carve out the time. I'd be willing to bet there are plenty of pro golfers that don't have big sponsors and have to pay the bills from elsewhere. What about pro bowlers? I'd be shocked if more than a few make all their money on the lanes. I've personally known Olympic athletes (especially in sports like archery and shooting, but even boxing) that didn't have big time sponsors or the opportunity to do nothing but train for months on end until they actually made the Olympic team. They had day jobs or were full time college students. So it can be done.

 

[PETROBOY]

You should join the BCA. I think your philosophy would complement the members there. :smile:

Let's just do away with the professional pool world. Then we can all live happily ever after, right?

Unless you walk in the shoes of a professional player, don't knock them, because you don't totally understand what it's all about. You are on the outside looking in.

who is knocking who I asked why they cant get a job when pool doesnt allow them to make a living and travel to the tournaments that they want to play in. I wish pros made millions a year it would be great for the game at all levels but the truth is they dont.

 

[JAM]

Jen, I gotta disagree...there have been a great number of players that had day jobs yet still managed to have very successful pool careers...Irving Crane sold cars full time and practiced during his lunch hour and after work, for example. Joe Balsis was a butcher... Let's not get carried away here...a talented pro player can succeed while being gainfully employed, they just have to carve out the time. I'd be willing to bet there are plenty of pro golfers that don't have big sponsors and have to pay the bills from elsewhere. What about pro bowlers? I'd be shocked if more than a few make all their money on the lanes. I've personally known Olympic athletes (especially in sports like archery and shooting, but even boxing) that didn't have big time sponsors or the opportunity to do nothing but train for months on end until they actually made the Olympic team. They had day jobs or were full time college students. So it can be done.

Think about what the cost of living was when Irving Crane and Joe Balsis were hitting 'em.

Think about what the tournament payouts were when Irving Crane and Joe Balsis was hitting them.

Now fast-forward to today. What are the tournament payouts today? What is the cost of living today compared to the '50s and '60s?

To compare an American professional pool player to an Olympic athlete is ridiculous. Two different animals. American professional pool players are outcasts in the eyes of the American pool culture. The Olympic athletes are valued and cherished by the American Olympic culture.

 

[TATE]

Sadly I'm not putting my $ towards staking or Fundraisers any more.

Disclaimer: Prizes may vary slightly from the photo.

(ps. in reality that jersey really did suck and you have a right to be disappointed).

Photo:Left Reality: Right (same girl) (really)

 

[PETROBOY]

Think about what the cost of living was when Irving Crane and Joe Balsis were hitting 'em.

Think about what the tournament payouts were when Irving Crane and Joe Balsis was hitting them.

Now fast-forward to today. What are the tournament payouts today? What is the cost of living today compared to the '50s and '60s?

To compare an American professional pool player to an Olympic athlete is ridiculous. Two different animals. American professional pool players are outcasts in the eyes of the American pool culture. The Olympic athletes are valued and cherished by the American Olympic culture.

The comparison to Olympians is that they can hold jobs and compete at the highest level in their sports.
I hope all the players find their way to the DCC this year and sorry Jerry for detouring this thread.

 

[JAM]

The comparison to Olympians is that they can hold jobs and compete at the highest level in their sports.
I hope all the players find their way to the DCC this year and sorry Jerry for detouring this thread.

The comparison is ridiculous. I have never heard of an Olympian athlete flipping burgers or selling hot dogs. Gimme a break.

 

[West Point 1987]

Think about what the cost of living was when Irving Crane and Joe Balsis were hitting 'em.

Think about what the tournament payouts were when Irving Crane and Joe Balsis was hitting them.

Now fast-forward to today. What are the tournament payouts today? What is the cost of living today compared to the '50s and '60s?

To compare an American professional pool player to an Olympic athlete is ridiculous. Two different animals. American professional pool players are outcasts in the eyes of the American pool culture. The Olympic athletes are valued and cherished by the American Olympic culture.

Good points...but I still maintain that regardless of the payout/public support (which I am totally with you on), my point was that excellence in a sport and a separate job are not incompatible. It's always been done, and still can be. I do agree that a full time job can make meaningful participation in the truly good paying events difficult (probably too difficult for many) because of the distances and time off required. There too far apart, too few and require a week off from work to participate in. That's a different problem that isn't solved by being staked and I hope things change to get more promoters and industry involvement in getting more big events out there. Unfortunately, it looks like we're in a shrinking market.

If I were SVB, I'd have moved to Japan 10 years ago. Sometimes a career forces you to move to where the work is...