Equipment and the U.S.Open golf

[Grady]

I love how tough the golf courses are at US Opens. Pool should always be that way. Huge pockets and new cloth don't championship play make.
The last UPA event I played in had enormous pockets, Sardo racks and soft rails to boot.
My first opponent made five balls four times and four balls four times. I asked if there were any recourse and was told NO!!
Diamond tournament tables are perfect, not too easy, not too tough. I'm not through doing events. Please look for what I do in the future.

 

[ManifestEcstacy]

that #2 course that they played the US Open, which I have been watching, not one person finished the whole tournament underpar... thats amazing, for a golf course to own the worlds best golf players like that...

 

[stevelomako]

Grady, read this and think about it and tell me if I might not be correct.

I posted something about pocket size in another thread.

(1) Pocket size has always been 5" whether it was the old 10fts they played on or 9 footers. At least Anniversarys', Cenntenials' and Gold Crowns always have been. The 8, 9 and 10 footers were all 5" pockets.

(2) The biggest thing if you think about it has been that most tournaments years ago were played in POOL ROOMS and the cloth was already played on and worn, PLUS, it was thick and slow so you had to have a stroke to draw your rock.

(3) Nowadays they set up tables outside of pool rooms and the cloth is brand new and fast (should just play on the slate). You can bunt your ball and go up and down the table.




What do people want from 9-ball? Is it supposed to be a run-out game or tough with safeties and kicking. Two foul is still the best way to play it because you can be more aggressive and not get penalized.

We all know one-pocket and straight pool are the best games. Even 8-ball is better than 9-ball.

 

[LastTwo]

Grady, read this and think about it and tell me if I might not be correct.

I posted something about pocket size in another thread.

(1) Pocket size has always been 5" whether it was the old 10fts they played on or 9 footers. At least Anniversarys', Cenntenials' and Gold Crowns always have been. The 8, 9 and 10 footers were all 5" pockets.

(2) The biggest thing if you think about it has been that most tournaments years ago were played in POOL ROOMS and the cloth was already played on and worn, PLUS, it was thick and slow so you had to have a stroke to draw your rock.

(3) Nowadays they set up tables outside of pool rooms and the cloth is brand new and fast (should just play on the slate). You can bunt your ball and go up and down the table.




What do people want from 9-ball? Is it supposed to be a run-out game or tough with safeties and kicking. Two foul is still the best way to play it because you can be more aggressive and not get penalized.

We all know one-pocket and straight pool are the best games. Even 8-ball is better than 9-ball.

Grady has the same opinion as me. Does that mean he doesn't know about pool either? LOL I didn't realize you were the all-knowing pool guru

 

[pete lafond]

I love how tough the golf courses are at US Opens. Pool should always be that way. Huge pockets and new cloth don't championship play make.
The last UPA event I played in had enormous pockets, Sardo racks and soft rails to boot.
My first opponent made five balls four times and four balls four times. I asked if there were any recourse and was told NO!!
Diamond tournament tables are perfect, not too easy, not too tough. I'm not through doing events. Please look for what I do in the future.

I love the Diamond Pro table. Plays great. Here is a case were the manufacturer designed tighter pockets, the way it's suppose to be done.

 

[LastTwo]

I love the Diamond Pro table. Plays great. Here is a case were the manufacturer designed tighter pockets, the way it's suppose to be done.

Actually I think it was Ernesto who showed Diamond how to do it properly. He is best table mech out there IMO.

 

[sjm]

I strongly agree that the supertough conditions befit the occasion in the US Open golf, but far more impressive to me is the qualification system to get into the tournament. It is a system that ensures that only the truly elite get to play in our national golf championship.

Over 9,000 attempted to qualify for about 100 spots. However, not just anybody could play in a qualifier. You had to have an established handicap of 1.4 or less to even tee it up at a qualifier. Qualifiers were not just held all over the country but all over the world, and, sure enough, the winner earned his spot in a qualfier held in Great Britain. Imagine if the US Open golf used the obviously comical "just show up and you can play" approach that is deemed within the boundaries of sanity in the US Open nine ball event!

The US Open golf tournament highlight three advantages to which pool must aspire.

1) an objective system for rating players worldwide (the handicap system)
2) an objective methodology that ensures that all of the elite have a chance to qualify for the event, and a strict enough standard to ensure that only the very best can earn a spot in the field
3) playing conditions in the main event that tests the skills of the truly elite

Grady is absolutely right, we should learn from golf's example. Golf's formula for the national championship is simple:

Find an ojective method of assembling a field restricted to truly great players and once that field is in place, test that field's skills to the limit.

 

[nfty9er]

I agree, but something to note

I strongly agree that the supertough conditions befit the occasion in the US Open golf, but far more impressive to me is the qualification system to get into the tournament. It is a system that ensures that only the truly elite get to play in our national golf championship.

Over 9,000 attempted to qualify for about 100 spots. However, not just anybody could play in a qualifier. You had to have an established handicap of 1.4 or less to even tee it up at a qualifier. Qualifiers were not just held all over the country but all over the world, and, sure enough, the winner earned his spot in a qualfier held in Great Britain. Imagine if the US Open golf used the obviously comical "just show up and you can play" approach that is deemed within the boundaries of sanity in the US Open nine ball event!

The US Open golf tournament highlight three advantages to which pool must aspire.

1) an objective system for rating players worldwide (the handicap system)
2) an objective methodology that ensures that all of the elite have a chance to qualify for the event, and a strict enough standard to ensure that only the very best can earn a spot in the field
3) playing conditions in the main event that tests the skills of the truly elite

Grady is absolutely right, we should learn from golf's example. Golf's formula for the national championship is simple:

Find an ojective method of assembling a field restricted to truly great players and once that field is in place, test that field's skills to the limit.

And although for different reasons, as in not to cheat to raise your handicap like pool, there are thousands of golfers who cheat to lower their handicap so they can try qualifying just for the fun of it and maybe get lucky and make it. Especially people whose handicap is close to the cutoff. No system is perfect is it?

 

[sjm]

And although for different reasons, as in not to cheat to raise your handicap like pool, there are thousands of golfers who cheat to lower their handicap so they can try qualifying just for the fun of it and maybe get lucky and make it. Especially people whose handicap is close to the cutoff. No system is perfect is it?

Point well taken, Nifty, but the golf handicap system , though objective, is not free from abuse. Still, only great golfers make it through the US Open qualifiers. The cream rises to the top.

 

[Ktown D]

I strongly agree that the supertough conditions befit the occasion in the US Open golf, but far more impressive to me is the qualification system to get into the tournament. It is a system that ensures that only the truly elite get to play in our national golf championship.

Over 9,000 attempted to qualify for about 100 spots. However, not just anybody could play in a qualifier. You had to have an established handicap of 1.4 or less to even tee it up at a qualifier. Qualifiers were not just held all over the country but all over the world, and, sure enough, the winner earned his spot in a qualfier held in Great Britain. Imagine if the US Open golf used the obviously comical "just show up and you can play" approach that is deemed within the boundaries of sanity in the US Open nine ball event!

The US Open golf tournament highlight three advantages to which pool must aspire.

1) an objective system for rating players worldwide (the handicap system)
2) an objective methodology that ensures that all of the elite have a chance to qualify for the event, and a strict enough standard to ensure that only the very best can earn a spot in the field
3) playing conditions in the main event that tests the skills of the truly elite

Grady is absolutely right, we should learn from golf's example. Golf's formula for the national championship is simple:

Find an ojective method of assembling a field restricted to truly great players and once that field is in place, test that field's skills to the limit.

It sometimes seems like a minor miracle to find 156 pool players with 500 dollars. If players were made to qualify on their merit we might have a shorter event field. If not for the cash from these people that might not qualify the payout would suffer. And in the end, we would have the Chesapeake Classic instead of the U.S. Open.

 

[JohnnyP]

(1) Pocket size has always been 5" whether it was the old 10fts they played on or 9 footers. At least Anniversarys', Cenntenials' and Gold Crowns always have been. The 8, 9 and 10 footers were all 5" pockets.

The corner pockets at DannyK's are just wide enough for two balls to fit.

 

[chefjeff]

I(snip some good stuff)

Golf's formula for the national championship is simple:

Find an ojective method of assembling a field restricted to truly great players and once that field is in place, test that field's skills to the limit.

You left out a "minor" detail, SJM, in golf's successful formula : The USGA makes most of their annual income from the US Open because __________.

Jeff Livingston

 

[sjm]

You left out a "minor" detail, SJM, in golf's successful formula : The USGA makes most of their annual income from the US Open because __________.

Jeff Livingston

Darn, I hate cliffhangers. Enlighten me, Jeff.

 

[Fore Rail]

A player can claim to be a 1.4 index or less & pony up their $125 for local qualifying but beware.

Performance in Local Qualifying​

If a player fails to return a score within 8 strokes of the USGA Course Rating, an entry filed by him for a future U.S. Open Championship may be declined, unless the player can document that he is capable of competing at the national championship level.

Players are only hurting themselves & perhaps their playing competitors pretending to be something they are not.

 

[Celtic]

I agree with you about the pockets 100% Grady, but what do you think about 9-ball and its future in this sport? Can 9-ball stand the test of time or is it time to introduce a new game that is also more challenging and brings back a scoring system yet keeps rotational pool?

We need a new game. Not 8-ball, not straight pool, not 1-pocket, a new game. All those games are great but they are all flawed. 8-ball will be no different then 9-ball in that top pro's will all have it mastered to the point of luck being the difference, TheOne showed us that (no offense man, you clearly shoot great but if you can put pressure on Efren like that then how is the game going to stand up to the top 20 players doing battle, it will be a runoutfest). 1-pocket I love but it is clearly too slow a game to use for TV and to interest the crowds, it is also not a game that would be taken up by the majority of Joe Public in the pool halls and familiarity of the common player is an important part of a sport becomming huge in viewership. Straight pool had it's moment in the sun, and again it is a game where the top 20 players would be a flip of a coin once they all played it for a few years. It is a game where one player gets hot and the other player gets to watch. I watched the 150 of Sigel against Rempe, I cannot say if Sigil was actually shooting better that day because Rempe never shot. A good competition needs sparing back and forth by top players, not whitewashes of one against the other.

1 point per a ball rotation would work as the game, it would be siffuciently difficult that no player could master it. Races to 60 points or whatnot also gives is a scoring that is alot more accepted by Joe Public who more times then not find 9-ball stupid in that the last ball is the only one that matters. 15 ball Rotation pool for a point per a ball would also bring back the big break as a important feature and yet give the finesse players a playing ground where moving the cueball with skill is critical. The added bonus of such a game is it's possiblity of being played in the bars as a past time, as it uses all the 15 balls and is simple (a point per a ball, 8 points wins) to adapt to bar-pool.

That there is a game I have tried to get out there many times. Rotation in its known form is a game that gives the most points to the last few balls on the table and that is the wrong way to go since those last few balls are the easiest to run. Make it 1 point per a ball though, allowing combos and such, called shot, and that would make a great game I would think. I would LOVE to see the pros try out a game like that.

The above is a game that I thought up that merges the best parts of 9-ball with the best parts of straight pool for a new game that would be more challenging then either of its predesessors.

I would still go for tightening the pockets even with the new game, just think 9-ball is part of the problem and not just the equippment.

 

[frankncali]

You left out a "minor" detail, SJM, in golf's successful formula : The USGA makes most of their annual income from the US Open because __________.

Jeff Livingston

Not sure what you are going for here but I think the Open benefits from
being played on Public Courses. I am not sure if it has to be or not but it seems like it is. People were sleeping in their cars to get on Bethpage.

Golf events draw crowds of avid players as well as non-players. A wife or husband thinks nothing of letting their SO go to a golf event. Some might even attend with them. Its not that way in pool,

Also the USGAs events that they conduct are all very big and have great draws. I wonder if they own the rights to the US Open merchandise or
if the PGA Tour gets a part.

 

[Black-Balled]

Over 9,000 attempted to qualify for about 100 spots. However, not just anybody could play in a qualifier.

Yeah, but even with the come one- come all approach of the (pool) USOpen, there aren't 9k people who want to play. I think that the comparison, based on a shared name, is completely illogical.

 

[pete lafond]

Yeah, but even with the come one- come all approach of the (pool) USOpen, there aren't 9k people who want to play. I think that the comparison, based on a shared name, is completely illogical.

I'll bet if you were paying first place $500,000 you would easily have 500 who want to play. How do we get there though? Until then you are 100% correct.

 

[ScottR]

Not sure what you are going for here but I think the Open benefits from
being played on Public Courses. I am not sure if it has to be or not but it seems like it is. People were sleeping in their cars to get on Bethpage.

Golf events draw crowds of avid players as well as non-players. A wife or husband thinks nothing of letting their SO go to a golf event. Some might even attend with them. Its not that way in pool,

Also the USGAs events that they conduct are all very big and have great draws. I wonder if they own the rights to the US Open merchandise or
if the PGA Tour gets a part.

Only a few Opens are played on courses available to the public. Bethpage was one and so is Pinehurst #2. Normally, they are played on very exclusive private clubs. The USGA has total control of everything related to the U.S. Open (and all USGA events), including merchandising. The PGA Tour runs most everything else (except the Masters and PGA Championship) in the U.S. for professional men.

 

[the scorpion]

Steve are you completely NUTS! or is that just where your brains are, I canno't beleive you said that 8 ball is actually better than 9 ball I have just sat and watched the finals of the world 8 ball pool championships and to say that it bored me to death is an understatement it is so slow with no safety or tactics, as I mentioned in another thread it is all just a case of picking a ball, potting it and moving onto the next shot. So go get a life and try telling earl or francisco that 8 ball is better than 9 ball.