Fight at Hardtimes in Sacramento?

Absolutely Untrue ...

CaPoolFan said:
HARDTIMES WILL BE FINE THIS IS ONE MISS HAP, I WORKED AT THE JOINTED CUE FOR YEARS NOW THAT PLACE IS TUFF TO DEAL WITH. HARDTIMES IS A GREAT PLACE LETS NOT LET THIS DISCURAGE US FROM BEING LOYAL TO A GREAT POOL HALL. LETS ALL JUST HAVE GOOD THOUGHTS FOR CHUCK AND HIS CREW AND HOPE HE MAKES IT OUT OF INTENSIVE CARE SOON.

I play at The Jointed Cue at least 5 days a week (4-6 hrs.) and Tournament nights ... Dave Stonier runs the "tightest ship" in the Pool business and does not even allow problems to get started ... I definitely feel much safer there, day or night, than at Hard Times, day or night ...
 
The little room that I had had evetything in it. Thiefs, mob guys, drug dealers, and ex cons. I knew most of them and had very little trouble. One night four big biker guys came in and were raising hell and scareing the people at the tables around them. I went back to them and told them to get out, they didn't owe me anything for time. One of them started giving me a bunch of s*** how he was going to flatten me like a bug. I pulled my shirt away showing a 38 and I said, "come on assh*** I just got out after 5 years for manslaughter, I'll be glad to do 5 more for you. They all walked. Johnnyt
 
Tom In Cincy said:
I don't have any first hand knowledge of what happened. I left there around 11pm and it happened sometime around 2am.

I do know that Chuck Markulis (owner) is in the hospital and as of late last night was still not out of the intensive care. He did get a broken leg.

I do know that NO ONE WAS SHOT.

Do you know how Chuck is doing? Searched the Sacremento paper and didn't find any update. Thanks
 
Scott Lee said:
I'll echo what Jay said, and add to it, Hard Times in Sactown used to be a MUCH worse place than it is today. Chuck and Mike have cleaned up the place, ousted the gangs, and imo do a great job of offering a nice place to play pool. Obviously at some point, it's get's so crowded that problems can and will occur. But to put down the efforts of the owners to clean the place up, because of this one incident is imo out of place. Tom does a great job as tournament director, and Chuck & Mike do a great job as room owners. PERIOD! Many room owners could learn something from the way they run their business.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com


It was a real rough spot in 89-90, there was guns in there then, once a shot was fired outside and hit someone inside in the leg by accident, it wasnt a fight just a accident. But there was alot of rough people and drugs in there back then, I have heard its much better now.
 
Str8PoolPlayer said:


I play at The Jointed Cue at least 5 days a week (4-6 hrs.) and Tournament nights ... Dave Stonier runs the "tightest ship" in the Pool business and does not even allow problems to get started ... I definitely feel much safer there, day or night, than at Hard Times, day or night ...

That's the way you gotta run a poolroom. Or else you're asking for trouble. Good for David. His dad Terry was a huge promoter of pool on the West Coast and just about the nicest man you would ever meet. He's another guy I sorely miss.
 
Hi Jack;

Chuck is improving, slowly, but getting better every day. But he is still in ICU and in very serious condition. Thanks for asking.

Mike
 
Str8PoolPlayer said:


I play at The Jointed Cue at least 5 days a week (4-6 hrs.) and Tournament nights ... Dave Stonier runs the "tightest ship" in the Pool business and does not even allow problems to get started ... I definitely feel much safer there, day or night, than at Hard Times, day or night ...

While David does an excellent job on cornering problems, there is no comparison to Hardtimes. The Joint is located in one of the toughest areas of Sacramento. For those of us whom have gone there for many years, our feelings of safety are based on familiarity, not actual safety issues. As you can see from my other posts and pictures, I know the place well and it is one of my favorite rooms of all times. The mistique and history make it stand alone among the greater pool rooms. I love the place and the Stoniers have been my friends since the 60s. But it is not as safe, in any way as Hardtimes is today. And frankly, neither one has any real safety problems.
 
Deadon said:
While David does an excellent job on cornering problems, there is no comparison to Hardtimes. The Joint is located in one of the toughest areas of Sacramento. For those of us whom have gone there for many years, our feelings of safety are based on familiarity, not actual safety issues. As you can see from my other posts and pictures, I know the place well and it is one of my favorite rooms of all times. The mistique and history make it stand alone among the greater pool rooms. I love the place and the Stoniers have been my friends since the 60s. But it is not as safe, in any way as Hardtimes is today. And frankly, neither one has any real safety problems.


I awalys felt more comfortble in the Joint than Hardtimes back from 86 to 91, Terry ran a great room, my favorite room I have ever been to. He ran the best room ever and he is in a bad neighborhood.
 
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just came from hardtimes, chuck woke up last night and is currently having surgery on his leg. multiple fractures so they are putting a steel rod in. its going to be a long rehabilitation for chuck. but as of a few hours ago things look good.
oh and pre 1998, it was Great American Billiards. different owners and really a different atmosphere.
BIG DADDY
 
Mike & b d
Thanks for the update --- what hospital is he in? btw, I have always liked Chuck and have some good memories of him when I played in HIS room. I have a neighbor (very small world) who worked for him for awhile.
 
I don't have good news about Chuck Markulis, the part owner (with his son) of Hard Times Sacramento. He is in very serious condition in the intensive care unit of Mercy San Juan Hospital. He suffered major trauma to his head and leg. He is still comatose and has some internal head injuries. How serious they are has not been determined. At best, he faces a long and arduous recovery, and at worst he will be disabled for life. Chuck is a 70 year old man, so his prognosis is not as good as it would be for a 40 year old.

Chuck was one of the best friends any pool player ever had. He put on absolutely the best poolroom tournaments I ever saw (or worked on). We used to get world class fields at the original Hard Times in Los Angeles. Chuck would do anything for a pool player to help them out. He had tremendous respect for the talent they possessed.

The incident was a serious gang war with multiple participants. The fight spilled over from the poolroom into the parking lot. The gangsters were using short billy clubs to administer a beating to two individuals they were feuding with. When Chuck tried to break it up, one of the gangsters jumped in his pick-up truck and ran him down. He then crashed through the wall into the poolroom, dragging a security guard along. The security guard was fortunate to only receive major leg injuries.

When people started screaming that Chuck was down, someone from inside the poolroom emerged with a gun and shot and killed one of the gangsters. This caused the rest of them to flee. The police have rounded up several suspects.

This was not a minor street fight. Four people are in the hospital and one is in the morgue. Chuck will likely never return to work at Hard Times, and it may take years for him to learn to walk and talk again.

I felt that it is important that if people are talking about something, they should know what really happened. Covering up the seriousness of the crime is not the answer.

My prayers are for Chuck, that he recover from this horrendous experience and enjoy the rest of his life. He has worked hard for so long, he deserves a rest. That is all that matters to me now. What happens with the poolroom is secondary. Chuck Markulis and I were partners in producing some of the greatest tournaments ever in Southern California. We got along great and he was a pleasure to work with every day. Anything I asked for to make an event better, he would say yes to immediately. He would look at me and say "Let's do it!" And we damn sure did!

When he regains consciousness I plan to go visit him. I'll let you know how he's doing. Almost all the top players know Chuck and have tremendous respect for him.
 
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Sorry for the pain I know you are experiencing Jay. I pray your friend will recover.
 
Jay thanks for the update. That sounds like some crazy shit went down at Hard times. While I don't know Chuck, he sounds like the kind of pool room owner I always have liked, one who loves the game and supports it. This is really sad news that this has happened.
 
jay helfert said:
I don't have good news about Chuck Markulis, the part owner (with his son) of Hard Times Sacramento. He is in very serious condition in the intensive care unit of Mercy San Juan Hospital. He suffered major trauma to his head and leg. He is still comatose and has some internal head injuries. How serious they are has not been determined. At best, he faces a long and arduous recovery, and at worst he will be disabled for life. Chuck is a 70 year old man, so his prognosis is not as good as it would be for a 40 year old.

Chuck was one of the best friends any pool player ever had. He put on absolutely the best poolroom tournaments I ever saw (or worked on). We used to get world class fields at the original Hard Times in Los Angeles. Chuck would do anything for a pool player to help them out. He had tremendous respect for the talent they possessed.

The incident was a serious gang war with multiple participants. The fight spilled over from the poolroom into the parking lot. The gangsters were using short billy clubs to administer a beating to two individuals they were feuding with. When Chuck tried to break it up, one of the gangsters jumped in his pick-up truck and ran him down. He then crashed through the wall into the poolroom, dragging a security guard along. The security guard was fortunate to only receive major leg injuries.

When people started screaming that Chuck was down, someone from inside the poolroom emerged with a gun and shot and killed one of the gangsters. This caused the rest of them to flee. The police have rounded up several suspects.

This was not a minor street fight. Four people are in the hospital and one is in the morgue. Chuck will likely never return to work at Hard Times, and it may take years for him to learn to walk and talk again.

I felt that it is important that if people are talking about something, they should know what really happened. Covering up the seriousness of the crime is not the answer.

My prayers are for Chuck, that he recover from this horrendous experience and enjoy the rest of his life. He has worked hard for so long, he deserves a rest. That is all that matters to me now. What happens with the poolroom is secondary. Chuck Markulis and I were partners in producing some of the greatest tournaments ever in Southern California. We got along great and he was a pleasure to work with every day. Anything I asked for to make an event better, he would say yes to immediately. He would look at me and say "Let's do it!" And we damn sure did!

When he regains consciousness I plan to go visit him. I'll let you know how he's doing. Almost all the top players know Chuck and have tremendous respect for him.

Jay
Thank you. When you visit him would you please tell him we have him in our prayers. I will try to contact him. He was good to me when I was working construction away from home in California.
 
Damn it all, I was at Hardtimes a few weeks ago and consider it one of the best pool halls I've ever been in. Due to the 24/7 hours it always had a few young people hanging around outside but nothing serious I noticed.

Folks, we can't afford to lose places like this! Or the people that own or work at them.
 
Chuck Markulis is out of Intensive care and in the Trauma unit.
He's been responsive to questions from his son but hasn't spoken yet.
His leg has been operated on and it was a complete success.

The doctors are expecting a recovery period of approximately 1 year.

No visitors will be allowed for another few days. Maybe longer.

If you want to send any cards or letters to Chuck, please address them to

Hard Times Billiards
Attn; Chuck Markulis
5536 Garfield Ave
Sacramento CA 95841

Thanks everyone that has wished Chuck well and kept him in your prayers.
 
jay helfert said:
The most exciting part of my day was walking out at night with the days receipts in my pocket. It was after two in the morning and I was alone. Yes, I was packing my little .25 but I watched all around me to see if anyone was following me or hiding somewhere. I never parked in the same spot two nights in a row.

Not to tell you your business (or former business, in this case), Jay, but... wasn't that a risk you could have avoided? Meaning, stash the cash inside in a safe or somesuch, and take it to the bank in daylight (i.e. safer) hours?

I'm glad to hear this Chuck fellow is doing better. Always hate hearing about people getting jacked like that.

Just yesterday, I was at a small tournament and someone had a flyer in their hand - it was for a memorial event for this kid. The last name looked familiar - it turns out he was the grandson of a fellow I played against in Valley league here. The kid was killed ten years ago, when he was sixteen - he and a pal were in the more metro-y area of Denver from out in the sticks, and some kid walks up behind him and caps him in the head, and tries to shoot his buddy too. The kid got caught - turns out it was a gang initiation.

Humanity is broken.
 
VonRhett said:
Actually, what keeps pool and pool halls "stigmatized" is the fact that we've had yet another fight in yet another pool hall!

I haven't heard, seen or read about many fights, guns, etc., on a golf course or tennis courts.

My understanding is that there was indeed a gun shot; whether someone was hit or not.

But the fact remains that it was yet another big ass brawl in a Pool Hall, and the Owner is absolutely in the hospital. THAT'S what keeps the public opinion rather low.

Can you blame them??

Hell, after all these years we are still our own worse enemy.

-von

Hi Von. unfortunately, the public persona that pool rooms are negative or the element is bad comes from incidences like this - just because an incident happens at a pool room (or in the parking lot) doesn't mean the sport is negative or shaddy. people can't seem to separate the two.

9balllvr
 
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