Get upset if you want, I will never do it!

Cannonball55

Cannonball55

This is cool
Silver Member
Hi again,

There is one thing that's common place in pool games, whether it's in tournament play, casual/recreational matches or in money games ( of any amount ) everyone does it, it's so common that's it's understood without saying a word .

got an idea what it is ?

I'll give you a scenario : player A is running balls ( apply this to any game ) and he seemingly has the game in his reach as his cue ball falls in position for his case/money/winner ball, and then the inevitable happens, player b walks up to the table ( while the cue ball is still rolling ) and proceeds to rack the balls .

That's right sports fans, I don't ever rake the balls/conceit games . No matter how easy the out may appear or how straight in the other guy gets on the 9 ball, he has to shoot it!

As long as I've played this game i've seen too many hangers dogged, too many miscues, too many displays of weakness, too many strange things happen to rake the balls for the other guy . Hell, i've seen champions miss with ball in hand; which leads me to reflect upon all those times ive been in money matches with guys and during the course of his run out, I would conceit that straight in 8 ball . Only to be puzzled a few games later when this same guy ( who displayed that he can play ) gets ball in hand and he does'nt get out with only 4 balls on the table . Thoughts would creep in mind like "damn, i should'nt have conceited that 8 ball/7ball/etc"

The fact of the matter is this . Some players have problems with the case ball. they have a level of anxiety that they don't feel in any other time during the run and sometimes ( because we are all human ) the case ball is struck differently then the ones before. Translation : players choke . We all do or have done at one time or another, so why not allow yourself to be the beneficiary of your opponents choke . Ya never know

I remember hearing Nick Varner talk about that . He said that the main reason why players dog the case ball is because it's not shot with the same rhythm and intentions as all of the other balls . theres that " oh my god, i'm on the 9ball factor" that comes into play . - Now, what Varner meant when he touched on intentions is actually specifically dealing with the cueball . when we play pool, our intentions for the cueball is to have a desired path of travel after contact with the object ball ( for shape/position ) this develops a natural rhythm, so when there is the last and final ball to shoot, what are the intentions for the cueball? The difference between dogging the case ball and splittin the wiket on the 9ball is found in that very element of retaining an intention for the cue ball .This way, your rhythm is never broken and your delivery and execution is done normaly ( as with any other shot )

I know i'm rambling on right now, but I just wanted to thoroughly explain why I will never rake the balls ( I don't care if i'm playing efren ) after all, we're all human and ya never know what the other guy's anxiety level is and if he understands what i said above on rhythm and cueball intentions .

Take care & good shooting!
 
BFD...

Would you like to double the bet on said "gimme" shot? You know, just to increase that pressure...and your likelyhood of winning from the chair.
 
Some folks consider scooping that last ball up as a sign of respect to the other player, as an acknowledgement that he's not going to miss that last shot.

Though I kinda agree with that sentiment - I consider doing that just driving nails into your OWN game's coffin. You're giving up on that game before it's done. And such actions can compound on your own mental game and screw you up later in the match.

I was told, some years ago, NEVER scoop up that last ball - no matter how much of a slam-dunk it is for the other player to make. Sure, they're going to make it 99 out of 100 times - but that one time out of a hundred that they miss, it could be the difference between losing the match and winning it.
 
Same here...never conceid a game. I've seen people rattle the nine in the jaws on an easy shot. LOLz
 
ScottW said:
...they're going to make it 99 out of 100 times - but that one time out of a hundred that they miss, it could be the difference between losing the match and winning it.
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Higher, unless the person is <B level. Especially if there is a raisin or more on the line.
 
depends on whats at stake.

Some people do it just to mess with your rythm. Like taking a long bathroom break when your opponent is in stroke.
 
I never could see it either. Some of the old time stuff I just couldn't buy. Jelly is another one. Never give a sucker a second chance to beat you with your own money. I'd give someone money that set up a good profiable game for me or at least steered me to it. And yes if I was friends with the guy I beat I'd give him a few bucks, but I really didn't gamble very much with friends. You lose a lot of friends that way. Johnnyt
 
I can certainly understand what you're saying Cannonball55, but just like with a lot of things in pool, some feel strongly about this, and others do not. A personal preference.

I feel it depends on whom you are playing and what level you're playing at. But for the most part, at higher skill levels with more experienced players, I think it can be a waste of time bordering on "Nitville".

Some players hate to see the final ball go in, and others hate to give the satisfaction of making the money ball to their opponent. It really boils down to your demeanor and what you can mentally handle more than waiting on a 1 in 1000 chance of your opponent choking on a six inch shot.

Gene
 
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I could write a book on all of the hangers/gimmes ive seen missed by short stops and champions alike . especially in pressure packed situations .
 
Especially when two players are giving each other two or three balls, I don't care how good you are a lot can happen in two or three shots.

I generally make my opponent shoot it and expect them to do the same to me.
 
A lady got mad at me recently for conceding the game, I had run a couple of racks and hung a sort of difficult 9-ball. She got mad because I had "disrespected her" by not letting her shoot the ball, I interpreted her anger as something different to what she said though.

To me she didn't get mad because I disrespected her, when you give someone the game it's because you respect their shooting ability. I think she got mad because I didn't let her shoot period and she wanted to shoot the ball because she was getting cold.

Usually I will concede a game if the shot is below a 2 on a scale to 10, these are the times I will have someone shoot out:

-first game ball
-last game ball
-combinations
-caroms
-cue ball on the rail
-a shot they have missed previously in the match
-if they make me shoot every ball

To me I give respect a little too much sometimes but I would rather give someone a game than "win" a game because someone misses something they normally make.
 
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I have seen the concession used as a shark move by either trying to get a guy out of rythm or by conceding some easy to moderate shots over and over and then when one comes up in a crucial situation making the guy shoot it. Sometimes this causes the guy shooting to take the heat because he is thinking "He has been giving me these all night now he wants to make me shoot it because it is a crucial situation" thus inducing the dreaded Self Shark.

Personally in a tournament or action game I make the guy shoot everything. If I am backing a player and I have a say, he makes the guy shoot everything. I am a firm believer that Murphy is alive and well and will get in your ass at the most inopportune times. Why make it easy on them?
 
Johnnyt said:
Some of the old time stuff I just couldn't buy. Jelly is another one. Never give a sucker a second chance to beat you with your own money. Johnnyt
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AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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JCIN said:
I am a firm believer that Murphy is alive and well and will get in your ass at the most inopportune times. Why make it easy on them?
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Murphy's law is definetly alive and well, and so are the pool gods that govern it .
 
I veiw it from a slightly different perspective.

I won't give up moderatly hard 9-balls, but I will give up hangers.

I really don't want to win just because my opponenet mis-cued on a hanger 9-ball.

That would be like running a race and the guy in front of you trips right before the finish line.....

I am not a fan of winning from the chair.....sure it happens, but I would prefer to win because I outplayed my opponent.

However...If the rule states that the player must pocket all balls...I do follow the rules and make them shoot everything.

I really think the "shoot everything" is more a rule for the spectators and to avoid the shark artists taking advantage of a players rythum or future nerves.
 
In others, the game can get to the point I'm so disgusted with my game, I personally don't care if the shooter makes the ball or not; I don't want/deserve the game.

That said, I've played people who WANT to shoot that last ball, and become offended even if you kindly explain that they don't have to take that last shot, and reach for the rack.
 
it all depends WHY you give up the remaining balls. if it's just because you're being negative and have given up then it's wrong, they can always miss.

but if you're doing it to challenge yourself slightly as I do then it's fine IMO.

a lot of the time I will concede the last three balls if they're hanging over the pocket - same mentality as playing the ghost sort of. you've had you chance, he's won the rack, let's move on. I want to win sometimes by playing well, not by relying on an earthquake to stop my opponent missing a hanger.
 
JCIN said:
I have seen the concession used as a shark move by either trying to get a guy out of rhythm or by conceding some easy to moderate shots over and over and then when one comes up in a crucial situation making the guy shoot it. Sometimes this causes the guy shooting to take the heat because he is thinking "He has been giving me these all night now he wants to make me shoot it because it is a crucial situation" thus inducing the dreaded Self Shark.
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As I read this thread, I wondered when or if someone would realize the move.

Not only is this a low down move by the majority of those who pull it, it is at the very least, when performed by the intellectually challenged, who don't have a clue what they are doing, poor pool etiquette.

Over and over give up the last shot, and then, in the match game, with only a very slightly more difficult shot at stake, the bum merely crosses his legs the opposite way, or some other subtle shark move as you get down on your shot. It takes you out of your rhythm, it puts thoughts in your mind as to whether that was intentional and it offers the offender just a touch more edge than he had a minute ago.

You wanna laugh? :) Ok, I'm going deep here. LOL. Here is a method I use to help my rhythm and confidence when its faltering. If you think I'm nuts and want to throw a net over me, so be it, but if it works it works.

I mentioned this in a post a long time ago, regarding what I call our "mental pool tool boxes". We must posses a number of tools to get the job done. Lots of these tools are a manifestation of our individual feel for shots at the table. Its how you perceive a shot, how you adjust your attidude, or whatever, that helps your confidence at the table.

Lots of guys, myself included go so far as to name some of these tools to get the job done. In jest perhaps, but none the less they are additions to the toolbox.

I got the "pop stun" the "smoothie" the "super slide" LOL ... and on and on.

Well, here's my answer (the tool in the box) to the shark move, whatever it may be. It's my pacman stroke. LOL, yep my pacman stroke and I'll teach it to you in case you want to try it.

The key to the stroke is to be aware you have it, the good news is we all already have it. Lots of guys just don't know it, or know how to get to it.

The pacman stroke happens when a meanie is coming for you. You realize an a$$hole has just made a move on you, but what he didn't realize is he made you take your pacman stroke out. He just gave you a powerpill, and now you can't miss! His act of sharking has empowered you to shoot your shot center pocket! Works every time. :)

It may be funny, but I strongly believe that turning negative happenings into positive ones for you at the table give you the edge back, however you accomplish it, and I just shared my crazy method, of what works for me. :)
 
Fart sniffer said:
...I will have someone shoot out:

-first game ball
-last game ball
-combinations
-caroms
-cue ball on the rail
-a shot they have missed previously in the match
-if they make me shoot every ball

...
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:withstupid: :withstupid::withstupid: :withstupid:
 
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