Good for the real HER…..

[skogstokig]

You and I both have no clue what dialogue took place.

The real issue resides within the people who make the rules. Regardless of whether there's backlash one way or the other. They make the rules and the woman participated within those rules.

i obviously know a heap load more than you, both about the specific matter and about the e8b scene in general. i even made a (seemingly pointless) attempt to explain the situation with the promotor, the law and haynes position. you seem to have a minimal interest in the specific situation though, and a massive interest in spouting political drivel, so i won't waste my time in enabling that crap

 

[Bishop]

i obviously know a heap load more than you, both about the specific matter and about the e8b scene in general. i even made a (seemingly pointless) attempt to explain the situation with the promotor, the law and haynes position. you seem to have a minimal interest in the specific situation though, and a massive interest in spouting political drivel, so i won't waste my time in enabling that crap

I haven’t dismissed anything from you. I even acknowledged that if you want to identify as an owl you can.

I support working towards resolving the problem with an unfair playing field. I’m not disagreeing with you.

What I don’t support is doing so by demeaning and trivializing trans people because they identify in a way you don’t approve of.

 

[skiergd011013]

Identify however you like.

See, it wasn’t hard. I didn’t melt nor is my life altered in any way.

when it starts depriving women of opportunities, scholarships etc, their lives have been altered and the line has been crossed.

 

[JolietJames]

The biggest problem is the constant need for some to dehumanize people in order to make a point.

I find the discussion to be valid and there’s a perfectly acceptable argument as to the advantages of being born and raised a male. Physical advantages such as testosterone etc.

But look at the thread title. “Real HER”. To dehumanize the other person who is simply playing within the rules provided to them. Yet op and others didn’t take issue with the tournament directors or those rules. They took issue with the person.

Because it was never about what’s fair or not. It was always about how much they hated the woman for simply existing and playing in a tournament that welcomed and allowed her to play. When the discussion shouldn’t have been about her participation but the premise of her participation and how can that be handled in a more balanced manner.

Perhaps they did not take issue with the tournament director or with the rules because those two entities did not gain by stealing from the women.

OP did not say "Good for the real HER -not her animal opponent".
To state a fact that only one of them is an actual woman is not dehumanizing.
That is a tactic of the "Victimhood is life" crowd.
We will all acknowledge the guy's existence. Not pretending as others pretend is not dehumanizing them.
You are turning a factual statement into "violence" or "oppression", neither of which is true.
Kindly make your way back to NPR and give that sweet Toyota of yours to someone who deserves it.

 

[Bishop]

when it starts depriving women of opportunities, scholarships etc, their lives have been altered and the line has been crossed.

Attacking trans people doesn’t resolve that. It’s what created the response in the first place.

The trans woman didn’t write the tournament rules. She simply competed where she was told she was allowed to compete.

Your issue is with the tournament director.

 

[jalapus logan]

A side note brought on by some earlier posts: When Jean Balukas was a major threat in open events some open events rebranded as mens events. Nobody wanted Jean embarrassing them and taking money out of the mens purses.

Hu

Men's purses huh? So who, exactly are all these purse carrying fairies on the men's tour? I mean, I can give a fanny pack a pass (I guess), but a purse will not gain one entry to the men's club...not now, not ever!!!

Note: I see now that others have made this same joke. But it's funnier when I say it.

 

[Bishop]

Perhaps they did not take issue with the tournament director or with the rules because those two entities did not gain by stealing from the women.

OP did not say "Good for the real HER -not her animal opponent".
To state a fact that only one of them is an actual woman is not dehumanizing.
That is a tactic of the "Victimhood is life" crowd.
We will all acknowledge the guy's existence. Not pretending as others pretend is not dehumanizing them.
You are turning a factual statement into "violence" or "oppression", neither of which is true.
Kindly make your way back to NPR and give that sweet Toyota of yours to someone who deserves it.

This is nothing more than an excuse to treat people poorly because you don’t like the rules another person made.

I traded the truck for the 61 Fairlane.

 

[JolietJames]

This is nothing more than an excuse to treat people poorly because you don’t like the rules another person made.

I traded the truck for the 61 Fairlane.

Years ago the local humane society put on an easter egg hunt for dogs.
The eggs had treats in them, biscuits, etc. We brought our dogs and when one of our pups sniffed an egg, we picked it up, declaring it "found".
We probably got 10-12 eggs in total for our pups.
A woman was also there with a small dog and two children.
When the "hunt" started, her two children sprinted all over the field, collecting well over 100 eggs.
The rules did not specifically state that people couldn't take all the eggs while people were walking their dogs around the field.
We were not mad at the rules. We were mad at the entitled thieves and that trash parent who benefited at others' expense.
I guess the rules gave us an excuse to give the thief and her thieves-in-training dirty looks.

I personally do not feel gender dysphoria gives someone an excuse to steal. That is where you and I disagree.

Person to person trade I assume.
Must be a nice Fairlane -that yota was sweet.

 

[Bishop]

Years ago the local humane society put on an easter egg hunt for dogs.
The eggs had treats in them, biscuits, etc. We brought our dogs and when one of our pups sniffed an egg, we picked it up, declaring it "found".
We probably got 10-12 eggs in total for our pups.
A woman was also there with a small dog and two children.
When the "hunt" started, her two children sprinted all over the field, collecting well over 100 eggs.
The rules did not specifically state that people couldn't take all the eggs while people were walking their dogs around the field.
We were not mad at the rules. We were mad at the entitled thieves and that trash parent who benefited at others' expense.
I guess the rules gave us an excuse to give the thief and her thieves-in-training dirty looks.

I personally do not feel gender dysphoria gives someone an excuse to steal. That is where you and I disagree.

Person to person trade I assume.
Must be a nice Fairlane -that yota was sweet.

I have doubts that the dogs were caused harm and stress. I’m sure everyone had a good time.

That situation could have been avoided with better communication on both ends.

The Fairlane is getting coilovers and rack and pinion up front. It’s more of a project. Just need to find the time.

 

[JABSolstice]

My sister had a child, born Anthony. Somewhere along the line, after a very traumatic childhood, Anthony changed to Amber.

Whenever I refer to Amber, I go out of my way to not say him or her. I will call Amber whatever name is requested as that is just a noise made with your mouth. I refuse, however, to be forced into certain speech.

I believe that there are males and females, boys and girls, men and women. Others believe that you can be any number of different genders. Good for them. I don't want you to change what you want to be called. I also don't want you to try to force me to deny MY reality that you are not something that I don't believe you are. I will not be forced into speech because someone else thinks that mouth noises are 'violence.'

 

[JABSolstice]

The Fairlane is getting coilovers and rack and pinion up front. It’s more of a project. Just need to find the time.

I am not a fan of most of the Ford lineup, but I really do like the Fairlane. Good luck with the work.

 

[CaptainBly]

Again as mentioned previously no one is confused by man vs woman.

What you don’t understand or are ignorant about is gender identity vs born sex.

It boils down to common courtesy.

Asking to be an attack on you than a buddy asking to be called Bubba or for Richard to be called Dick or for Michael Jordan to be called MJ.e referred to a certain way is no mor

The problem is people’s unwillingness to show a common courtesy because of their own prejudice.

I don’t care if you prefer to be called by your middle name and it’s no more of an inconvenience for me if you identify as a woman and prefer to be called Sarah.

The only thing stopping people like you from calling them their preferred name is your own intolerance to it.

That’s where you start. Fair play and competition is something different altogether.

A better analogy would be Michael Jordan saying you MUST now refer to me as Larry Bird. Also I want full access to the Celtics Locker room and all their plays. And we say, but Michael you are Black and play for the Bulls. And he says, no, that is your assumed reality. In my head I am white and play for the Celtics. Call me Larry now and if you don't let me in your locker room I'll sue.

Everyone sees that he is not Larry even if he truly believes it to be so.

 

[Bishop]

A better analogy would be Michael Jordan saying you MUST now refer to me as Larry Bird. Also I want full access to the Celtics Locker room and all their plays. And we say, but Michael you are Black and play for the Bulls. And he says, no, that is your assumed reality. In my head I am white and play for the Celtics. Call me Larry now and if you don't let me in your locker room I'll sue.

Everyone sees that he is not Larry even if he truly believes it to be so.

This is just your own angst and bitterness oozing out.

Most of what you’re pissed about falls at the feet of the msm way before the feet of trans people.

There are a few outspoken trans people who I’m sure you and I both would disagree with but the majority of the problem is rooted in sensationalism across the media and fear mongering.

 

[CaptainBly]

As always, the turn around to those of us who don't bend the knee to the trans mafia. I have not attacked Trans, I have pointed out how unfair it is to the Women competing in WOMENS sports. YOU, equate that to attacking Trans.
I am bitter, as a father of two daughters it sickens me to see what they have to deal with. It's like they don't even matter. The boy who wants to wear the skirt and use their bathroom overrules all their feelings.
Again, what about the women and their feelings? Women's sports were setup as a place they could compete fairly among themselves without MEN! We have generally had Open categories and Women's categories. If you are a Trans you play in the OPEN category. Problem solved.

Simple question?
Do Women have rights? Or, are they just rights below Trans?

 

[ShootingArts]

I don't know what percentage of "female" competitors are male to female transsexuals. I do know the 95% or more born females shouldn't have to give up their rights to accommodate the people who want to compete unfairly.

Anyone know what an ox is? A steer as I think most will know, is a bull that was castrated when it was very young. An ox is allowed to mature as a bull then after it has the size and bulk of a bull is castrated to be more docile to handle and play well with other cattle. An ox isn't quite as powerful as a bull but it is more powerful than a cow or steer. The trans people that transition as adults are much the same as oxen. They have the growth, bone structure, most of the assets of a male, now some want to compete as women. This is basically unfair.

The ideal solution would be a division for male to female transsexuals but there would have to be far more transsexual competitors for that to be practical. Dumping all over womens' athletics in the meantime isn't fair or reasonable. Can anyone imagine what would have happened had George Foreman decided he was female in his twenties and been allowed to fight women?

I don't want to be unfair to transsexuals but they are what they are by choice. That doesn't mean the whole world should have to change to accommodate them.

Hu

 

[SBC]

Every time this comes up someone posts what you posted.

So, we have 150+yrs of results that have almost no women competing on par with the guys, vs. twenty years of this question.

The results speak for themselves, loudly. Sex makes a difference. Testosterone is linked to aggressiveness.

As for strength, that is only one part off the equation. The accuracy vs. effort is the real difference. The average male is about twice as strong as the average female. This means that a man uses about half the effort on any stroke. It is easier to be very accurate when one uses less effort. Any pool player knows this from their own experience.

I've beaten quite a few lady pros....most were none too pleased.

I can't say why there's such a distance between men and women in pool...you'd think it wouldn't be so....but.it really is.

Handful of women in past 20 years could be considered low level male pros.

 

[Bishop]

As always, the turn around to those of us who don't bend the knee to the trans mafia. I have not attacked Trans, I have pointed out how unfair it is to the Women competing in WOMENS sports. YOU, equate that to attacking Trans.
I am bitter, as a father of two daughters it sickens me to see what they have to deal with. It's like they don't even matter. The boy who wants to wear the skirt and use their bathroom overrules all their feelings.
Again, what about the women and their feelings? Women's sports were setup as a place they could compete fairly among themselves without MEN! We have generally had Open categories and Women's categories. If you are a Trans you play in the OPEN category. Problem solved.

Simple question?
Do Women have rights? Or, are they just rights below Trans?

I agree about fair competition. It’s a valid concern and I’ve not suggested that women are beneath anyone else.

Your solution comes at the discretion of the tournament director. Not trans people.

Yet your problem seems to be fixated on trans people who you think are demanding you bend a knee rather than the tournament director who actually bended the knee on their own terms.

All I’m suggesting is that you point a finger at the right people.

If a trans person demands to play with women and lobbies for that I’ll point a finger at her and say that’s wrong. But most trans people aren’t looking for this fight.

It’s tournament directors or organizations that have made a decision about what’s allowed. That’s on them to not stand up on behalf of their women participants and you for not blaming the tournament director for backing women.

 

[skiergd011013]

As always, the turn around to those of us who don't bend the knee to the trans mafia. I have not attacked Trans, I have pointed out how unfair it is to the Women competing in WOMENS sports. YOU equate that to attacking Trans.

Most people understand this. The words bigot, transphobe etc have been thrown around so much that they have become diluted. Its this new victim culture we are living in, and people, mostly the left, use it to try and win arguments. Its actually ruining educational debate at academic settings. Its a lot easier to just call someone a bigot than to break down their argument and win a debate based on facts. This author wrote a book about it and explains it perfectly.

 

[trob]

As much as i dislike this Trans stuff. I mean this is pool it's not football. We all should be playing on even level. Oh wait the women pros stink to the men and don't stand a chance.

I’m kind of torn on it because while I completely disagree with trans men Playing women’s sports I’m not sure how testosterone helps you play pool better but as long as females have events that men can’t play in in pool I guess they get their own space.

 

[Bishop]

Most people understand this. The words bigot, transphobe etc have been thrown around so much that they have become diluted. Its this new victim culture we are living in, and people, mostly the left, use it to try and win arguments. Its actually ruining educational debate at academic settings. Its a lot easier to just call someone a bigot than to break down their argument and win a debate based on facts. This author wrote a book about it and explains it perfectly.

Let me break down the argument for you.

The tournament organizers made the rules and welcomed trans people to play.

Yet you and others refuse to hold them accountable for creating an environment that you believe is a disadvantage for born women.

Instead you want to complain about trans people and point a finger at them for participating where they’re told they’re welcome to participate.

Your failure to hold accountable the people who created the policies and rules that paved the way for a trans person to participate is why it’s easy to conclude that your issue is with trans people and not the actual problem with the rules that were created by other people.