Where did I say they were not well made?
Help me choose a cue case
- Thread starter bhale
- Start date
Where did I say they were not well made?
Reread original post. Misread your phrase with the double negative. My apologies.
Excellent point. Riding around with a cue case 'strapped' to the back of a motorcycle seems like a great idea to begin with.
My point is, people say things like someone knocked my open cue case off the table and my cues hit the floor". Well, why did you leave your open case on a table unattended to begin with??
When you watch Jon Barton's videos comparing his cases to a Justis, he does the shake test. He shakes the Barton cases and you hear very little. Then he proceeds to shake the Justis in a manner that rivals a massive earthquake... to illustrate the weak level of protection a Justis offers. Frankly, if I'm ever in a massive earthquake my choice of Barton vs. Justis will be the least of my concerns.
B <--------- has a GTF and likes the protection but is a realist when it comes to what I put my cue/case through
It was in my Inbox when I logged on this morning. I would've posted it then, but I needed to go find a Mac-compatible keyboard, because mine crashed this morning.
Apparently John has been banned, and know's not the reason why. I do not wish to be in the middle of it...but he has been very supportive of me during a very trying time in my personal reality, and this favor was the least I could do in return.
I think Lisa does know her JB cases
I wanna say I support Lisa in her ongoing support for Johns cases as he does make an amazing case as well. But what I've did over the last week was a lot of research on the cases he makes for the "GTF" line!! Wow what an amazing case!!!! See the video below here & Lisa good work for supporting John Barton and his cases as as you'll see in this video John has been in the case industry for a long time and knows his stuff. I believe in storing cases in this style Of case
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3cfNB2uSO4&feature=youtube_gdata_player
I wanna say I support Lisa in her ongoing support for Johns cases as he does make an amazing case as well. But what I've did over the last week was a lot of research on the cases he makes for the "GTF" line!! Wow what an amazing case!!!! See the video below here & Lisa good work for supporting John Barton and his cases as as you'll see in this video John has been in the case industry for a long time and knows his stuff. I believe in storing cases in this style Of case
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3cfNB2uSO4&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Color me surprised....I almost dreaded reading your post, after our 'head-butting' session a while back. I'll be the first to admit I may have gone a bit more on tilt than warranted....for that, I apologize.
Anywho....funny thing, John and I used to head-butt too, but I simply could not take away the fact that he just made an damn fine case (Instroke), and was quite passionate about what he was doing. Being a bit of a creative soul myself, I could easily understand his passion. Before long, we had become friends. I like John...and he reacts pretty much as most do when they're buttons are pushed...and lord knows there are plenty of button pushers on AZ...LoL!
I, too, am a fan of that style of case (GTF) and hopefully someday will own one, having owned a Thomas and Engles, but am still pretty darn tickled with my Tough Love Series case with a few little extra features. The man certainly knows what he's doing, and there is no denying that.
Thank you, sir...for your post!!
Lisa
Just some advice; being a spokesperson for someone who is banned and forwarding messages for them is bad form.
Please do not continue this practice.
Please do not continue this practice.
Just out of curiosity, how often where your cues damaged or fell out of the Thomas or Murnak case?
And had you read the post before deleting it, I did quite clearly state that it was a one shot deal...doing the right thing isn't always 'comfortable'.
It's also 'bad form' for a site to continue to allow the usual suspects to continue to bully and push buttons as if it is sport, with little to no consequence. Some members here can hardly make a post without having the same individuals making snarky remarks and/or name-calling, completely unprovoked, time and time again...and if someone comes to their defense, they too are summarily attacked. Is this right? You know it's bad when newer members start threads about how mean and nasty this place can be, and they wished it wasn't so. It doesn't present AZB in the best light, nor our sport.
So, if I must go as a result of standing on my convictions, so be it. I am secure in the fact that I have contributed far far more to this site than I have detracted from it.
Thank you.
Lisa
I thought I had relayed clearly that it was when I owned my Murnak case, and that someone else had knocked it off the table accidentally as I was getting ready to take my cue out to play at a tourney. I never made any mention of cues falling out of the Thomas case I owned. Both makers craft fine cases....I never stated they didn't. I happen to prefer the interior that JB makes, is all.
I do find it rather amusing that the very detractors that continue to slam JB for crafting his cases in China and his pricing, conveniently overlook that Jack Justis also had decided to have his cases crafted in China when he attempted to retire several years back....anyone remember Justis West cases? The price point on those cases were not far off of what JB's pricing is. Yet no one but no one gave Jack near the amount of grief over that decision as JB has suffered here....pretty darn hypocritical.
Get over it...
Let me start with the easy part as to why is it always about attacking Justis.Jack Justis Cases are some of the best cases hands down for many reasons.Justis west cases are no longer being made as that was jacks decision to no longer allow them to be made and he had only allowed to be made for about a year and less than a dozen cases ever made it into the usa.
Now as far as jb or barton is concerned.Not 1 person I have ever seen including myself have ever said he has made a bad case not 1 person.It is simple that people on here attack at him because of his actions toward all of us.If barton would never had the attitude that he had than he certainly would have sold more cases and even could have got more money for his cases.Its amazing that I cant think of a single cuemaker or case maker that has ever being banned from azbilliards except Barton not 1 and he has been banned at least 10 times so why is that you can offer an excuse for him.As far as im concerned azbilliards is a much better place without Barton and his little kid rants and since he is banned that will leave him 15 extra hours a day to focus on his company and seek the help he probably needs.Also this is my 1 and only post or comments regarding this issue.God Bless The U.S.A.
Let me start with the easy part as to why is it always about attacking Justis.Jack Justis Cases are some of the best cases hands down for many reasons.Justis west cases are no longer being made as that was jacks decision to no longer allow them to be made and he had only allowed to be made for about a year and less than a dozen cases ever made it into the usa.
Now as far as jb or barton is concerned.Not 1 person I have ever seen including myself have ever said he has made a bad case not 1 person.It is simple that people on here attack at him because of his actions toward all of us.If barton would never had the attitude that he had than he certainly would have sold more cases and even could have got more money for his cases.Its amazing that I cant think of a single cuemaker or case maker that has ever being banned from azbilliards except Barton not 1 and he has been banned at least 10 times so why is that you can offer an excuse for him.As far as im concerned azbilliards is a much better place without Barton and his little kid rants and since he is banned that will leave him 15 extra hours a day to focus on his company and seek the help he probably needs.Also this is my 1 and only post or comments regarding this issue.God Bless The U.S.A.
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With this being said, JB really has no idea why he was banned? Really?
I go by what I was told when I received the email. I prefer to take people at face value until they give me reason otherwise. It is now my understanding that there was a misunderstanding between Mike Howerton and JB...that's all I now know. Unlike some folks here, I do not follow (stalk) every freakin' post that JB makes. A bigger person realizes that sometimes you just have to agree to disagree and let it go. It's pretty easy to take pot shots at someone from behind a keyboard....it's pretty chickenshit too.
I firmly believe that John really wanted to address your 'issue' with your case. If there was a problem 'in house', then he needed to address it so similar 'issues' didn't arise. Unlike every other manufacturer out there concerning warranty work...he was attempting to save you the expense of having to send your case back to China for inspection. He asked you to take very specific photographs, so he could assess the problem correctly. You failed to take the proper photographs requested. How is he supposed to help you when you cannot comply with a simple, but necessary, request? So, because it didn't go your way (and who's fault is that?), you began hammering him at every opportunity. Is that fair?
Lisa,
You may not understand that I didn't want John's help with the "issue". I am not going to get into the reason's why I wouldn't comply with JB's request other than to say I posted clear photos and my review of the case was unbiased. But let me just say that he was less than nice the first time we had any contact which is when I made my decision not to like him. Additionally, he stalked me, threatened me, and posted a bunch of lies and BS about me and others on his blog. He has tried numerous times to bait me into saying something that would get me banned from this site and/or thrown out of the SBE. In fact, he pm'd me telling me he would "have Allen throw me out of the expo if I went near him" and then wanted me to bring the case to Sterling's booth so Matt Carter could examine it. Did he really expect me to be that stupid?
I'm sorry if we disagree but if you really want the truth shoot me a pm and I'll tell you all about it.
I do not know all the particulars, as that is John's bag o' donuts...but why would you think that his reaction would be any different than a cue maker's might be when blindsided publicly about a problem that could have been just as easily addressed in private first? How many times have we seen this same scenario go down in countless disgruntled custom buyers' threads...and it simply never ever ends well...for both parties involved.
As to the supplied pics...it doesn't matter if you felt they were good enough....John was obviously looking for something very specific, otherwise he wouldn't have been so specific in his request. If it meant getting a problem solved in a satisfactory manner...I would've sent him pics of whatever was requested....damn sure cheaper than shipping it back to China for inspection! His interiors are his bread and butter, so if there is something going on causing damage to the cues inside, he wants to fix that ASAP. I am sure he would have taken good care of you, had he been given the proper opportunity to do so.
I had one of the very first Sterling Wave production cases made out of the old facility in China. I had an issue where the handle had started tearing out of the case. I contacted John privately. He responded pretty quickly that he had had some issues with the workers at that facility not stitching in the handles as he had instructed them to be stitched in. Mine was not the first case to have this problem. He was still learning that as here in the States, there are differing levels of quality workers as well. He told me that he was changing facilities as well as the workers, and that the new cases should be issue-free. He took care of me without a quibble...likely because I afforded him the courtesy of making a resolution to my issue in private, instead of blindsiding him publicly. Not only did he resolve my issue, but he resolved the issue overall, in a big big way. His name goes on or is attached to these cases, and he expects a high quality product going out the door...he knows his reputation is at stake with each and every case that leaves his facility.
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BTW I believe Jacks reasoning was that the were being copied anyways, might as well make sure its done with some integrity.
Let me say this.. at the end of the day when China has labor upheaval and it becomes finanically more beneficial that case productions should be done in India or Bangladesh, where will the new GTF cases be made? Freakin' right, the new line will be called the Taj Mahals and Johns new name will be John Collin Barton Chin Muguarteeshi.
Then we'll be subjected to months of how India is so much better than the USA and the people are the hardest working people on the planet, and how he pays above minimum wage, and he treats his workers better than any other Indian company, and I'll have to go to NPR with pictures and articles about how BAD it actually is in India.. and the cycle of BS continues.
JV
It is my understanding that the reason JJ discontinued the Justis West line was the same reason that JB changed facilities and workers....the workers wanted to do the cases their way, not JJ's way...and they were not up to JJ's standards. I certainly cannot blame him one bit...he worked hard to build his reputation and business...and he likely could not abide with a product with his name on it that was not what his customers have come to expect.
BTW...@worldpro....I was not disparaging JJ at all. My point was that it's a bit hypocritical to hammer JB about making cases in China, when at one point JJ was doing it too....and no one ever gave him one ounce of grief over it. That was the point I was attempting to make.
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BTW...@worldpro....I was not disparaging JJ at all. My point was that it's a bit hypocritical to hammer JB about making cases in China, when at one point JJ was doing it too....and no one ever gave him one ounce of grief over it. That was the point I was attempting to make.
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I really have no idea what is up with the whole JB thing. I want to say I don't care...but I do.
I didn't read this whole thread so I don't know how it got here but I feel the need to comment.
John Barton encouraged me. He taught me. He informed me. I appreciate that. I am still working on my leather skills. I have done some work for myself alone up to this point but if I ever produce a case worthy of sale I will have to credit him for his guidance.
Truly the man stirred the pot. He has been beyond opinionated to the point of pushing his pseudo-intellectualism to be overtly insulting to many. I can only assume that has something to do with his not being around at the moment.
I can only hope that we will see him again in this forum. Although he has an ability like no other to stir up trouble his contributions are invaluable.
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I didn't read this whole thread so I don't know how it got here but I feel the need to comment.
John Barton encouraged me. He taught me. He informed me. I appreciate that. I am still working on my leather skills. I have done some work for myself alone up to this point but if I ever produce a case worthy of sale I will have to credit him for his guidance.
Truly the man stirred the pot. He has been beyond opinionated to the point of pushing his pseudo-intellectualism to be overtly insulting to many. I can only assume that has something to do with his not being around at the moment.
I can only hope that we will see him again in this forum. Although he has an ability like no other to stir up trouble his contributions are invaluable.
.
No problem with your comments and you sticking up for jb is ok.Like i said his chinese workers make nice cases and if he didnt have the piss poor attitude then my cash might have been green for him sometime.As for Mr.Justis he never made cases in china as he only gave permission to use his name and style of cases and he stopped allowing the cases to be made.
As for Mr.Justis should never catch any grief at all because he conducts himself professionally with courtesy to everyone.I really feel bad for the guy that started this thread and it has come to this point but it doesnt surprise me as anytime a thread appears that mentions the word CASE barton gets involved.
Hopefully we all can be friends now and move forward and azbilliards will be a better place for all players and collectors.
God Bless The U.S.A.