How Do the Pros Aim

So John, just to clarify what you said...do you believe yourself, and most other pros shoot by "feel" (which I happen to agree with)? I agree that aiming is way overrated. Human beings aim naturally quite accurately. Moving the cue accurately is another story.

BTW, the first thing a good instructor will tell a student is, think standing up...don't think at all once you're down on the table. Once someone has figured out what they want to do (standing up), then we absolutely want them to "airm, point, and shoot" (again, without thinking)! :D

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

JBKY said:
Aiming Is way over rated.What about the golfer who stands beside the golf ball,not behind It.How does he aim? Just alot of practice.But In competion,you really shouldn't be thinking about how you are aiming.Ya'll ever shoot a shotgun? The first thing an Instructor will tell you Is..don't aim,point and shoot,that's what they'll tell ya.99.9 percent of all pros play by feel.That's why their pros.They don't think and worry bout all this aiming stuff.I've been around the block.I've hung out with and learned from,oh..Buddy Hall,Nick Varner,Earl strickland,well quite a few pretty good players.I have never gotten Involved In these ole aiming threads,but I just can't take It anymore.Hope I don't offend to many with this,but It's sure how I feel.I'll probably be ran off after this,but so what.John B.
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Scott Lee said:
So John, just to clarify what you said...do you believe yourself, and most other pros shoot by "feel" (which I happen to agree with)? I agree that aiming is way overrated. Human beings aim naturally quite accurately. Moving the cue accurately is another story.

BTW, the first thing a good instructor will tell a student is, think standing up...don't think at all once you're down on the table. Once someone has figured out what they want to do (standing up), then we absolutely want them to "airm, point, and shoot" (again, without thinking)! :D

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

Yes Sir!! That's one of the best tips you can teach a player,Do your thinking first,then bend over and let It happen.Thanks for being nice too.lol
John B.
 
JBKY said:
Aiming Is way over rated.What about the golfer who stands beside the golf ball,not behind It.How does he aim? Just alot of practice.But In competion,you really shouldn't be thinking about how you are aiming.Ya'll ever shoot a shotgun? The first thing an Instructor will tell you Is..don't aim,point and shoot,that's what they'll tell ya.99.9 percent of all pros play by feel.That's why their pros.They don't think and worry bout all this aiming stuff.I've been around the block.I've hung out with and learned from,oh..Buddy Hall,Nick Varner,Earl strickland,well quite a few pretty good players.I have never gotten Involved In these ole aiming threads,but I just can't take It anymore.Hope I don't offend to many with this,but It's sure how I feel.I'll probably be ran off after this,but so what.John B.
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And the 1st person to twist what John is saying into a pro-CTE statement will be........
 
John...Heck it's not even a matter of "being nice"! I respect what any pro player has to say...even if sometimes it might go counter to what I teach. You all have put in tens of thousands of hours on the table, learning 1000 things that a normal player will never learn...without being able to "hang out" with other top players. I've said a hundred times...once someone has an accurate and repeatable stroke, taking lessons from a pro player like yourself is a fantastic investment. I also don't mean that you cannot teach someone how to correct a poor stroke...just that many pros who teach, tend to "gloss over" the quality of a students delivery, in favor of the old "if this shot comes up, do this..."! Hats off to you for sharing the "secrets" you have learned over the years! Personally, I'd love to take some lessons from you! :D

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

JBKY said:
Yes Sir!! That's one of the best tips you can teach a player,Do your thinking first,then bend over and let It happen.Thanks for being nice too.lol
John B.
Click to expand...
 
JBKY said:
Aiming Is way over rated.What about the golfer who stands beside the golf ball,not behind It.How does he aim? Just alot of practice.But In competion,you really shouldn't be thinking about how you are aiming.Ya'll ever shoot a shotgun? The first thing an Instructor will tell you Is..don't aim,point and shoot,that's what they'll tell ya.99.9 percent of all pros play by feel.That's why their pros.They don't think and worry bout all this aiming stuff.I've been around the block.I've hung out with and learned from,oh..Buddy Hall,Nick Varner,Earl strickland,well quite a few pretty good players.I have never gotten Involved In these ole aiming threads,but I just can't take It anymore.Hope I don't offend to many with this,but It's sure how I feel.I'll probably be ran off after this,but so what.John B.
Click to expand...

Your insights are appreciated.

But most of us are not pros and will never play close to that level. What do you think about aiming systems (and banking systems) for the casual player? Better to have structure, or to develop whatever "feel" you can?
 
MahnaMahna said:
And the 1st person to twist what John is saying into a pro-CTE statement will be........
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I don't know what you are saying really but If you don't mind I would like to use this to say something.

My good friend,Stan Shuffet's been to my house quite of few times and I've been to his a few times.I just feel the need to expound on this.
When Stan first started to use this method of teaching he tried to explain It to me,for when I'm teaching.( we've swapped a few Ideas before)Well he started to show me the system and I almost Immediately said to him, Stan..that's the way I've been aiming my whole life.He said,It Is? I said sure Is. Then he said that It was amazing to him that I had learned that I my own.So his system Is real
for sure.I don't have any Idea how I picked It up but like I said I had been doing It my whole pool life without knowing It.He found a good way to teach It and to show It.It just came to me naturally I guess.Give me a call Stan,I'll play Landon somemore here pretty soon.Thanks,John B.
 
I think feel aiming is great for people who play a lot of pool. When I played a lot, I never gave a single thought to using any sort of system to find out where to aim. As I started playing less and less, though, I began to use ghost ball, and I think that helped me a lot when I was cold or out of stroke.

What's weird for me is that, since I have switched to an LD shaft, I have had to return to a completely feel-based aiming method. I'm hoping this is a temporary thing, but at present I am liable to miss any shot, no matter how easy, if I use ghost ball with the predator shaft. LD has made the game 10x harder for me, but at the moment I am enjoying the challenge.

Aaron
 
Neil said:
See John, this is where I think a lot of people misconstrue aiming systems. The goal of any aiming system is to get one on the right line to make the shot. Many of the systems do this so well that on most shots, you don't even need to look at the ob once you get on that line. That does NOT mean that one should not look at the ob. Aiming systems are great to be able to get on the right line for those that have trouble doing so. Even good ball pocketers have trouble with certain shots, and on those an aiming system can help them be more consistent with it.

By the time anyone is up to the pro level, they are shooting on subconscious memory. They aren't consciously using any system to aim. However, they may very well have used a system in the past, and made it a part of them so well that now it is akin to just "feel". Feel is nothing more than using your subconscious to shoot, and that is what aiming systems are designed to do. If you are still consciously thinking about every aspect of an aiming system after a year or so, you are doing it wrong.

Buddy teaches the clock system for the cb. It works, and works well. And, I guarantee you he uses it. But, he doesn't use it the same way anymore that he first used it. At first, he learned 1:00 does this, 2:00 does that, ect. He no longer has to consciously think about those things. He just has to look at the ball, decide where he wants it to go, and his subconscious will automatically hit the right part of the cb.

So, the question now would be, does Buddy use a system, or not? If you answer "yes", you would be right. If you answer "no", you would be half right. His conscious doesn't use the system any more, but his subconscious does.
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Well,I guess Neil,If you want to call that a system.John B.
 
JBKY said:
I don't know what you are saying really but If you don't mind I would like to use this to say something.

My good friend,Stan Shuffet's been to my house quite of few times and I've been to his a few times.I just feel the need to expound on this.
When Stan first started to use this method of teaching he tried to explain It to me,for when I'm teaching.( we've swapped a few Ideas before)Well he started to show me the system and I almost Immediately said to him, Stan..that's the way I've been aiming my whole life.He said,It Is? I said sure Is. Then he said that It was amazing to him that I had learned that I my own.So his system Is real
for sure.I don't have any Idea how I picked It up but like I said I had been doing It my whole pool life without knowing It.He found a good way to teach It and to show It.It just came to me naturally I guess.Give me a call Stan,I'll play Landon somemore here pretty soon.Thanks,John B.
Click to expand...

Don't run away if some people tell you they don't believe this...because I'm sure some will....Like myself.
 
Not Dead Ted said:
Your insights are appreciated.

But most of us are not pros and will never play close to that level. What do you think about aiming systems (and banking systems) for the casual player? Better to have structure, or to develop whatever "feel" you can?
Click to expand...

Thank you.I don't use aiming systems,I use methods and techniques for the shot at hand.I'm not trying to turn everyone Into a pro.I just think people do way to much worrying about aiming,that's all.To your last ?
get a lesson from a good player and or good teacher,If you can.It will speed up your game and the amount of time It takes to get good.John B.
 
JBKY said:
Thank you.I don't use aiming systems,I use methods and techniques for the shot at hand.I'm not trying to turn everyone Into a pro.I just think people do way to much worrying about aiming,that's all.To your last ?
get a lesson from a good player and or good teacher,If you can.It will speed up your game and the amount of time It takes to get good.John B.
Click to expand...

Don't forget some Crown & Cokes on the down time to ease your mind and body. :thumbup:
 
Scott Lee said:
John...Heck it's not even a matter of "being nice"! I respect what any pro player has to say...even if sometimes it might go counter to what I teach. You all have put in tens of thousands of hours on the table, learning 1000 things that a normal player will never learn...without being able to "hang out" with other top players. I've said a hundred times...once someone has an accurate and repeatable stroke, taking lessons from a pro player like yourself is a fantastic investment. I also don't mean that you cannot teach someone how to correct a poor stroke...just that many pros who teach, tend to "gloss over" the quality of a students delivery, in favor of the old "if this shot comes up, do this..."! Hats off to you for sharing the "secrets" you have learned over the years! Personally, I'd love to take some lessons from you! :D

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

Thanks and when I'm teaching someone,never fails,I'll have to work on their stroke and mechanics first before I can show them the finer points.
Yep,they need a good stroke and stance first,then we can start working on the game of pool. Yeah just do this this way and that that way.Too funny,lol.John B.
 
JBKY said:
Thanks and when I'm teaching someone,never fails,I'll have to work on their stroke and mechanics first before I can show them the finer points.
Yep,they need a good stroke and stance first,then we can start working on the game of pool. Yeah just do this this way and that that way.Too funny,lol.John B.
Click to expand...

John, I just PM you. I would love to get the chance to play with you soon or possibly lessons..
 
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