How many of you can beat the 9-ball ghost?

[JimBo]

I can beat the ghost but it all depends on what table on how well I do. On bar table it is no challenge. On a gold crown with standard pockets I win 50 percent of the time in races to 11. with 41/2 in pockets about 35% of the time in a race to 11. Ball in hand after the break. I play the ghost almost every day. We gamble here in ohio on the ghost alot. Chris Bartrem plays 12 ball on diamonds and he usually wins. Any less balls for players of his speed the player will rob the ghost.

Maybe it's semantics, but the original poll said YES MOST OF THE TIME, that now has 21 people making the claim. I'm not even sure what most of the time means but I assume when you say MOST you mean around 80-90% of the time, in which case you're still loseing say 10-20% of the time. The second choice says YES 50% of the time, which in my opinion might as well say NO %50 of the time. I mean how can you say yes, yet you lose 1/2 the time? And BTW less people made that claim then the one's who said most of the time. If I did something 50% of the time I would not be in a hurry to say I could do it and I prolly wouldn't want to bet on it.

Jim

 

[etimmons]

Maybe it's semantics, but the original poll said YES MOST OF THE TIME, that now has 21 people making the claim. I'm not even sure what most of the time means but I assume when you say MOST you mean around 80-90% of the time, in which case you're still loseing say 10-20% of the time. The second choice says YES 50% of the time, which in my opinion might as well say NO %50 of the time. I mean how can you say yes, yet you lose 1/2 the time? And BTW less people made that claim then the one's who said most of the time. If I did something 50% of the time I would not be in a hurry to say I could do it and I prolly wouldn't want to bet on it.

Jim

I tried to point out that the table made a lot of difference, if you think it does not I will play the 9 ball ghost on a bar table with ball in hand and you can bet on it if you want, by the game or by the set I don't care which. The original question did not specify what table or the rules, so I was pointing out the difference.

 

[JimBo]

I tried to point out that the table made a lot of difference, if you think it does not I will play the 9 ball ghost on a bar table with ball in hand and you can bet on it if you want, by the game or by the set I don't care which. The original question did not specify what table or the rules, so I was pointing out the difference.

I agree with you 100% the rules and table size play a big role, if you can do it with ease on a bar box you are still a very good shooter IMO. Congrats!

Jim

 

[ironman]

I would totally agree with Colin. to beat the ghost on 1 rack is something. To beat the ghost in a race to nine you have to be in the top %5 of players.

The break is the biggest thing. You must get a good spread.
In the past year, i've played the ghost, races to 9 7 times, and lost once.
Break from the dead center and you will get a good spread more often.

 

[TATE]

NO. Playing the ghost is ball in hand after the break. If somebody was betting against Pagulayan against the ghost.. it mustve been a REALLY hard table or or like you said with NO ball in hand. I dont think the ghost has the slightest chance of beating Alex. 10 or 12 ball ghost for this guy is more like it.

This is how I actually practice at home all the time. My table is very tight (4" corners). I've been playing the ghost for about 3 years. On my home table, it's a pretty even battle. I have had sets where I've won 8 games in a row and the most I've ever lost was 7 games in a row. If I'm in stroke, I beat the ghost.

The stategy is to break hard with no fear of flying the ball of the table. You want to make a ball or two if you can. Since you have BIH after the break (even if you scratch or fly the ball) the problem is it's easy to get sloppy when you first place the cue ball. So before you do, you want to survey the whole table to see which balls have paths to what pockets, and to make sure your shape routes are clear and look for trouble.

Obviously, if you can get an easy combo on the nine, take it. I don't allow 9 ball combo's as a win when I play the ghost, but most people do. The main thing is to play good patterns and not get sloppy, especially the first couple of balls. Just keep your shape really simple at first.

It's not that hard if you keep your cool and you're a pretty good shot maker. If you make a ball on the break, you are really playing 7 ball, because your first shot is BIH - a gimme.

The first couple of balls are critical - lay out the whole table before you set the cue ball down.

How good players lose to the ghost is they get tight, because it is the kind of thing where you can get yips and start jumping up, just like a real match. It's also kind of like playing cheap - very easy to get sloppy and getting a feeling of "Like, Why?".

It is terrific practice and the closest thing to playing a match this side of having a talented Filipino shooting your nuts off.

Chris

 

[bigg7]

A player?

I think some of you are giving the ghost9 too much credit.In match play I'm lucky to B&R 2 in a race to 9 but with ball in hand I'll take that bet if it isn't for the rent.

 

[TATE]

I think some of you are giving the ghost9 too much credit.In match play I'm lucky to B&R 2 in a race to 9 but with ball in hand I'll take that bet if it isn't for the rent.

If a player can get out regularly, B and R has a lot more to do with the B than the R.

Ghost is a good bet, a lot of fun, and nerve racking. It's mainly a guage of your offensive play and nerves and is by no means a guage of your all around competitive game because you can't duck.

Chris

 

[JDB]

I would take the bet with the 6 ball ghost (9 foot table), assuming ball in hand and I don't have to make a ball on the break. In practice, I beat the 6 ball ghost more than I lose, but of course, there is no pressure of a bet.

I do find it amazing the difference when I go to the 7 ball ghost, though. I beat the 7 ball ghost much less frequently and would probably not bet on it, but may try it.

9 Ball ghost I can beat, but not very often.

However, I don't count early combos or on the break. I have to run everything in order to get the win.

 

[Colin Colenso]

This is how I actually practice at home all the time. My table is very tight (4" corners). I've been playing the ghost for about 3 years. On my home table, it's a pretty even battle. I have had sets where I've won 8 games in a row and the most I've ever lost was 7 games in a row. If I'm in stroke, I beat the ghost.

The stategy is to break hard with no fear of flying the ball of the table. You want to make a ball or two if you can. Since you have BIH after the break (even if you scratch or fly the ball) the problem is it's easy to get sloppy when you first place the cue ball. So before you do, you want to survey the whole table to see which balls have paths to what pockets, and to make sure your shape routes are clear and look for trouble.

Obviously, if you can get an easy combo on the nine, take it. I don't allow 9 ball combo's as a win when I play the ghost, but most people do. The main thing is to play good patterns and not get sloppy, especially the first couple of balls. Just keep your shape really simple at first.

It's not that hard if you keep your cool and you're a pretty good shot maker. If you make a ball on the break, you are really playing 7 ball, because your first shot is BIH - a gimme.

The first couple of balls are critical - lay out the whole table before you set the cue ball down.

How good players lose to the ghost is they get tight, because it is the kind of thing where you can get yips and start jumping up, just like a real match. It's also kind of like playing cheap - very easy to get sloppy and getting a feeling of "Like, Why?".

It is terrific practice and the closest thing to playing a match this side of having a talented Filipino shooting your nuts off.

Chris

Chris,
As you've played a lot against the ghost, and your good game is pretty equal to it, can you tell us where your overall game is on the scale of abilities?

Such as good tourney performances, players you've beaten. Things like B or B+ don't make much sense to me.

Now I know practice and competition are quite different things. I've seen some great practice players who rarely do well in tournaments or off their own table, and local players who don't seem to shine who can lift their game a couple of notches when they compete at higher level events.

Just for interest...appreciate your insights.

Colin

 

[cuetechasaurus]

Chris,
As you've played a lot against the ghost, and your good game is pretty equal to it, can you tell us where your overall game is on the scale of abilities?

Such as good tourney performances, players you've beaten. Things like B or B+ don't make much sense to me.

Now I know practice and competition are quite different things. I've seen some great practice players who rarely do well in tournaments or off their own table, and local players who don't seem to shine who can lift their game a couple of notches when they compete at higher level events.

Just for interest...appreciate your insights.

Colin

Let me just say that I know firsthand that Chris plays GOOD. He's an honest guy, he doesn't brag or exaggerate about his game.

 

[TATE]

Chris,
As you've played a lot against the ghost, and your good game is pretty equal to it, can you tell us where your overall game is on the scale of abilities?

Such as good tourney performances, players you've beaten. Things like B or B+ don't make much sense to me.

Now I know practice and competition are quite different things. I've seen some great practice players who rarely do well in tournaments or off their own table, and local players who don't seem to shine who can lift their game a couple of notches when they compete at higher level events.

Just for interest...appreciate your insights.

Colin

I think I'm the kind of player that can give a good game to anyone including some pros, but I have not put a priority on it or entered very many tournaments. I think I've played in 4 total regional type of tournaments, all here in Southern California. A lot of pros play in these events. For obvious reasons, I do not like to brag about who I've defeated, but in my last tournament, I went hill/hill with Ernesto Dominguez and lost. The next day I think Erensto either won it or finished in the top three. The only A-Z members I've played with are Cuetecsaurus (a strong player) , Corey Harper, Pizza Bob, and SJM. Corey Harper is a pro level player. He and I were practicing together regularly for awhile and when I get a chance I would like to resume that. SJM and I played at Amsterdam and I can tell you he is a very good player.

I want to play in more tournaments but I can't really leave my company unattended, so I pretty much stick to the local stuff.

Chris

 

[Colin Colenso]

Let me just say that I know firsthand that Chris plays GOOD. He's an honest guy, he doesn't brag or exaggerate about his game.

That's what I would have guessed from Chris' post and previous posts.

By GOOD, I would guess that would mean he is a chance to take race to 9 matches from recognized pros on occassion....perhaps one match in 5 or something around that mark.

Some others have mentioned the B or B+ level players can give the ghost a decent run, but I couldn't imagine calling someone who is capable of taking occassional matches off the better pros a B or B+ level player.

Perhaps it's just a matter of semantic understanding.

I would figure there are top pros, mid pros, short-stops (maybe A+) and then A level players. A level players being around on par with the 9-ball ghost. A B player would be around the 6-ball ghost which would represent good city league players.

Just my thinking on the categorization for whatever that's worth

Colin

FWIW: I rarely play 9-ball or the 9-ball ghost, but I often spread out 6 or 7 balls by hand and play them in rotation for practice. I get them more times than not, though that's not my major goal. I often experiment with positional routes during this drill which lowers the out probability. I guess I'd be around the 9-ball ghost level if I practiced it a bit and played it seriously. I consider my 8-ball to be significantly better for shot selection, patterns etc.

 

[TATE]

Colin,

By the way, I am coming to China during Thanksgiving week with my wife and daughter, Beijing, Xian, and Shanghai. We are only in Shanghai for two nights, but we are only planning to see the acrobats one night. Where are you located and would you like to get together?

Chris

 

[Colin Colenso]

Colin,

By the way, I am coming to China during Thanksgiving week with my wife and daughter, Beijing, Xian, and Shanghai. We are only in Shanghai for two nights, but we are only planning to see the acrobats one night. Where are you located and would you like to get together?

Chris

Sounds good Chris,
I'll PM you with my contact details.
Colin

 

[unknownpro]

I think I'm the kind of player that can give a good game to anyone including some pros, but I have not put a priority on it or entered very many tournaments. I think I've played in 4 total regional type of tournaments, all here in Southern California. A lot of pros play in these events. For obvious reasons, I do not like to brag about who I've defeated, but in my last tournament, I went hill/hill with Ernesto Dominguez and lost. The next day I think Erensto either won it or finished in the top three. The only A-Z members I've played with are Cuetecsaurus (a strong player) , Corey Harper, Pizza Bob, and SJM. Corey Harper is a pro level player. He and I were practicing together regularly for awhile and when I get a chance I would like to resume that. SJM and I played at Amsterdam and I can tell you he is a very good player.

I want to play in more tournaments but I can't really leave my company unattended, so I pretty much stick to the local stuff.

Chris

All I can say is I damn near won a pro event (3rd, I got sharked by a camera click, what can you do?) while the ten ball ghost was beating me to death on a double shimmed hang-up Gold Crown. Playing even with the ghost in 9-ball on your table is probably over 10-ball speed on 4 1/2 inch buckets. Good shooting...

unknownpro

 

[TATE]

All I can say is I damn near won a pro event (3rd, I got sharked by a camera click, what can you do?) while the ten ball ghost was beating me to death on a double shimmed hang-up Gold Crown. Playing even with the ghost in 9-ball on your table is probably over 10-ball speed on 4 1/2 inch buckets. Good shooting...

unknownpro

The difference is, it's my table, so my speed on it is perfect and I am used to the tight pockets. Also, a shimmed Gold Crown has deeper pockets than my table, so the balls jar in the corner. Mine was cut from one piece German rubber at a proper angele. I would say my table is about the same as shooting on a Gold Crown with 4.5" corners.

I think what makes my table difficult is the tight side pockets - which are only 4.5". If you ever play on a table with really tight sides, it just kills you. You miss shots that you think are certain to drop. I don't think there's anything easier than a table with huge side pockets. It opens up a lot of shots I don't get.

I thank my lucky stars for having the tight table at home to practice on. It's frustrating at first, but it forces you to play center pocket and better (read 'more') angles. When I used to play on sloppy equipment, it hurt my game. Believe it or not, it took me almost a year to fully adapt to the tight pockets. Now I can only pretty much shoot center pocket on any table I'm playing on.

Chris

 

[sharandrew]

beating the ghost

I beat the Ghost so many times that the fella doesn't come around anymore...................

 

[laser2507]

9ball ghost is a pain, today I was 4 - 0 up, it all looked easy after practising 12ball. Then my breaks were leaving real bad layouts, even taking BIH I had too many clusters etc to run out.
Ended up losing 11-5 to the ghost.
Once my break improve I'll be more consistant.

 

[jjinfla]

I want to change my answer from once in a blue moon to never.

You see, I had never played the ghost, but sitting at the computer it didn't seem all that hard.

So yesterday I tried it and found out it is not all that easy. In 10 racks I beat him once and once almost.

Now that I tried it I doubt that there is anyone playing around here that can beat the ghost in a race to 5. A couple people might come close but I doubt that they would bet on themselves.

Anyway, that does say a lot about people who can consistently beat the ghost. I sure have a lot more respect for their game.

Jake

 

[Salamander]

I think that most people that try this for the first time have a similar experiance to yours. It is not as "easy" as it seems, even for a great player.

I was coaching this young kid once, who is capable of running a rack of 9ball on occasion - giving him tips on practicing. I told him that a good drill to adopt was to throw out 3 balls on the table (yes only 3), take ball in hand, and run them sequentially. You can progress to 4 balls, etc....but only when you can run them 70% to 80% of the time. He scoffed at using only 3 balls and claimed that that was too easy. Needless to say, he was not able to beat this "ghost".

Trying to run a certain number of balls sequentially, droped randomly, no balls touching, race to 10, and only progressing if you beat this ghost 70% of the time, is a terrific practice routine. It's a good measure of progress and is quite satisfying if you can ever run all 15 balls this way.

Regards,

Doug

I want to change my answer from once in a blue moon to never.

You see, I had never played the ghost, but sitting at the computer it didn't seem all that hard.

So yesterday I tried it and found out it is not all that easy. In 10 racks I beat him once and once almost.

Now that I tried it I doubt that there is anyone playing around here that can beat the ghost in a race to 5. A couple people might come close but I doubt that they would bet on themselves.

Anyway, that does say a lot about people who can consistently beat the ghost. I sure have a lot more respect for their game.

Jake