If you foul, but your opponent doesn't see it, should you call it on yourself?
- Thread starter ChrisBanks
- Start date
This is as great a first post as I've ever read on here.
Welcome to the forums, Carbonbit!!!
Maniac
There is a VERY large difference between not admitting to an accidental fault, and to deliberatly attempting to harm someone. Your analogy is garbage. Here is a better questions.
If you were playing a game of pool in a bar for $5.00 dollars would you call a foul on yourself?
If you were playing a game of pool in a poolhall for $50,000 dollars would you call a foul on yourself?
If you hadn't eaten in 1 day would you attack someone for their food?
If you hadn't eaten in 6 days would you attack someone for their food?
#1 you can't REALLY answer these questions because you have no idea how you would act on the presibus. #2 Integrity in a very loose word, and can easily change based upon ones circumstances....
It is very easy to say "Omg duh you call a foul on yourself" when you are playing for $10 or maybe $100 dollars. But no one on this forum can defintivily say that would do it under any circumstances. The only players in the world that would and could play for $50,000 I am near positive would not call a foul on themselves, and there is a reason they are able to play for that kind of coin. Just as the saying goes "he didn't get rich by spending his money".
It doesn't matter what I would do in that situation. Even if I didn't call a foul, it would still be wrong. I would be stealing 10000$ from my opponent.
If you can't play fair under those conditions, you shouldn't play for that amount of money.
Lol....
This forum is honestly a gigantic joke to me. Who are all these people hiding behind their computer screens that are these extraordinary gentlemen? Just the worlds moral gift to the world. Always doing the right thing no matter the circumstance....
You sir's are completely full of shit. I don't understand how or why you hold all hold your own and everyone elses pool games to some perfect standard when I gurantee for a fact that you do not hold the same standard to the rest of your life.
What's your point? I said, it doesn't matter what I would do. Maybe I wouldn't call a foul and steal 10000$ from my opponent. I don't know. But that doesn't mean I think it's the right thing to do. I would probably regret it later.
My point was not so much directed at you... More so the numerous other people who have the simplest answer of "always otherwise its cheating."
The OP wants an honest answer... Not the answer that looks good on paper.
If I foul, I call it on myself.
I don't hide either, my screen name is who I am.
I don't hide either, my screen name is who I am.
I understand. The question was: "SHOULD you call it on yourself?" Simple answer: Yes!
WOULD you actually obey your own moral standards under all circumstances? That's a different question and not so easy to answer.
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This discussion reminds me of an old joke. http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/03/07/haggling
I think both players should try to make sure that all rules are followed even if there is a referee present. Sometimes humans fail in this duty.
I think both players should try to make sure that all rules are followed even if there is a referee present. Sometimes humans fail in this duty.
There's no written rule that says you're SUPPOSED to watch your equipment. But we both know it's wrong for me to steal your equipment, whether you watch it or not. I'm hoping we at least agree on that much.
If there is a written rule that says the guy in the chair is obligated to watch for signs of cheating... that does not automatically excuse the shooter to do whatever dishonest thing he can get away with, as long as it's hidden from view.
Given the choice between trying to convince people on this forum to play honestly and not cheat others, or encouraging everyone to watch like a hawk because the world's a harsh place and cheating is inevitable... I will choose the first one every time.
You don't expect me pick up trash after someone, apologize for their rude behavior, or make sure they don't drink to excess right? So why am I expected to be someone else's conscience at the pool table? That's their job.
Of course you don't say anything. Don't even know why you would ask the question. Any cheap move you can make is a good move. You should also try to move the coin a few extra times as well when you opponent isn't looking. And if you lose try to wiggle out of paying. No need for honor at all in anything you do in life.
:deadhorse:
:deadhorse:
Both you & EagleMan have well thought out points. I agree with you & your desire for pocket billiards to elevate itself to the level of Golf & not just Pro Golf but Junior Golf as well. However EagleMan has some technically logical points & conclusions. Therefore the rules should be re-stated so as to take any ambiguity or loop holes out of the equation. I for one would not mind even a forfeiture of match for dishonoring the game as it was intended to be played, although wording & proof of such a rule might cause more problems than it would be attempting to fix.
I think Mr. Jewitt or someone else in position to do so should bring this to the attention of the parties that be for consideration.
I'm sure this problem was solved in a simple & immediate manner in the old west. The shooter fouled & did not call it on hinself & shot again. Then his opponent pulled a gun & shot his 'shot' & simply said he cheated. Hence the foul was called & the penalty immediately imposed.
I'm glad we don't live in the old west any longer, but sometimes I'm not so sure that we don't.
Best Regards,
Once S potted the 4 ball, the foul was OFF...i.e. all fouls are extinguished unless called PRIOR TO the next shot. Since balls 4-7 were potted in order, there was no subsequent foul.
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EagleMan
Talk about someone being full of $hit. YOU sir....cannot "guarantee for a fact" ANYTHING about anyone else's life except that they breathe, eat...and yes....$hit.
Dumb comment. And I'm sure the other members of this GREAT forum would join me in being pleased that we provide you with comic relief.
Cheers
Yes. There's nothing more that needs to be said.
Eddie May,
Your points are well made & you are correct that no one can guarantee what they would actually do given the reality of some hypothetical situations.
However there have been those that have said here & now that they would not call the foul on themselves hence they have made their decision regardless of the situation.
Then there are those, like myself, who say that they will not sell their honesty, honor & self dignity for any price.
However, as you say, if it came down to survival, who really knows what one would ultimately do. One who places value on such things as truth, honor, & dignity can only hope that their value system would not be altered by the desperation of a situation.
If truely tested, all one can really do is hope & pray that one will pass the test & prove themselves to be truly selfless.
Merry Christmas,
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